HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozon/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

Think chemistry and familiarity trump just being able to replace key pieces. The fact is Bullock has been exceptional defensively and has accepted his role on the team. As has Burks. Something that is not easy to predict or find. Can't underestimate the importance of not only adding vets that one thinks would fit a team and system but keeping the ones that actually do. For me, it is absolutely crucial that we finally stick with the pieces that are working. We have been the turnstile of the NBA the last few years and our record has reflected that. The theory behind these one-year deals was to find out which vets fit. Well, these guys fit. Why go after replacements that we do not know will buy in, fit in or work well together, when we already have ones that do. I also think that Burks is one of those fringe guys that are on the brink of next-level stuff.

IF we look at what we all wanted at the beginning of the year, it was more 3pt shooting, good defense and a solid PG. Knicks have shown they are now a very good 3pt shooting team(4th in the NBA and almost 2nd if not for small clicks). They have Rose who is playing exceptional basketball at PG spot and a top-ranked defense. Think its reason enough to make keeping the core roster together a priority. Sure, if we can add a decent PG and another shooter like Powell, I am all in. But again, think this is a roster that you just trim some fat ( Frank, Knox, Pinson, Pelle, and Payton), add a draft asset, and a couple of value FA's to an already well put together core.

I believe we have a real gift with DRose and I think he and Taj both return on low money veteran exception type deals. Rose can get paid more somewhere but doesnt need it (check out his Adidas deal). So I think unless Noel is stupid again we end up bringing up Noel/Taj/DRose and still have enough for a submax level guy like Scroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan... something starting in $20-$28 range depending on the guy

We are not far apart. Its really the wing guys... I am not prioritizing bringing back Burks/Bullock over signing one of those bigger fish above

MS wrote:I don't think we can bring back the same exact team.

I think Rose and Noel are the priorities. Gibson will sign for peanuts. Burks and Bullock are going to want real money and someone is going to give them deals starting at $8-9MM.

We can't keep running Randle and Barrett into the ground, they are playing way too many minutes.

I think you take a run at Ball at the right price or you give Lowry at two you deal for $50MM and resign Rose, try to replace Burks in the draft with our two picks. Frank won't be back

We need improvement from IQ, Knox, Obi and Mitch. Noel has been awesome but what's the number you're comfortable signing him at?

DRose wont cost much. We cant pay him NBA dollars his worth but we dont need to. Taj we can sign for vets min. Hopefully we can use the remaining cap to bring in another real pony. Powell or Schroder would be great IMO

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozon/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

Think chemistry and familiarity trump just being able to replace key pieces. The fact is Bullock has been exceptional defensively and has accepted his role on the team. As has Burks. Something that is not easy to predict or find. Can't underestimate the importance of not only adding vets that one thinks would fit a team and system but keeping the ones that actually do. For me, it is absolutely crucial that we finally stick with the pieces that are working. We have been the turnstile of the NBA the last few years and our record has reflected that. The theory behind these one-year deals was to find out which vets fit. Well, these guys fit. Why go after replacements that we do not know will buy in, fit in or work well together, when we already have ones that do. I also think that Burks is one of those fringe guys that are on the brink of next-level stuff.

IF we look at what we all wanted at the beginning of the year, it was more 3pt shooting, good defense and a solid PG. Knicks have shown they are now a very good 3pt shooting team(4th in the NBA and almost 2nd if not for small clicks). They have Rose who is playing exceptional basketball at PG spot and a top-ranked defense. Think its reason enough to make keeping the core roster together a priority. Sure, if we can add a decent PG and another shooter like Powell, I am all in. But again, think this is a roster that you just trim some fat ( Frank, Knox, Pinson, Pelle, and Payton), add a draft asset, and a couple of value FA's to an already well put together core.

I think there is something to be said about chemistry and familiarity and building on what you have accomplished but let's also be very explicit: IQ, Rose, Burks, Noel are players who didn't need the previous year's familiarity to get to the point where the Knicks are today. And I really don't know how the chemistry of RJ, Payton, Mitch, Julius, Taj really carried over from last year.

I think there will be some carry over from this year to next - Rose, Taj - are vet min shoe in's. I'm there with Fish on Noel being a priority with Mitch.

I'm also with Fish in the you NEED to maximize the cap space this year especially with Mitch, Julius in looming extension modes.

It's nice to say we want to bring back Burks but there are just higher talent guys out there that would do the same or much more than him.

Bullock has the Early Bird rights attached to him, so I can see the Knicks going over the cap and then signing him; the others, not so much. Noel maybe with the MLE?

Good descriptor of what Bird rights are and how much we can sign each player for: https://www.nba.com/news/free-agency-explained

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozon/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

Think chemistry and familiarity trump just being able to replace key pieces. The fact is Bullock has been exceptional defensively and has accepted his role on the team. As has Burks. Something that is not easy to predict or find. Can't underestimate the importance of not only adding vets that one thinks would fit a team and system but keeping the ones that actually do. For me, it is absolutely crucial that we finally stick with the pieces that are working. We have been the turnstile of the NBA the last few years and our record has reflected that. The theory behind these one-year deals was to find out which vets fit. Well, these guys fit. Why go after replacements that we do not know will buy in, fit in or work well together, when we already have ones that do. I also think that Burks is one of those fringe guys that are on the brink of next-level stuff.

IF we look at what we all wanted at the beginning of the year, it was more 3pt shooting, good defense and a solid PG. Knicks have shown they are now a very good 3pt shooting team(4th in the NBA and almost 2nd if not for small clicks). They have Rose who is playing exceptional basketball at PG spot and a top-ranked defense. Think its reason enough to make keeping the core roster together a priority. Sure, if we can add a decent PG and another shooter like Powell, I am all in. But again, think this is a roster that you just trim some fat ( Frank, Knox, Pinson, Pelle, and Payton), add a draft asset, and a couple of value FA's to an already well put together core.

Be really careful about the bold. We are some ways from quantifying exactly what "working" means. The goal is to win a title, and we have a real opportunity with cap space to procure another key piece. I like Burks/Bullock a ton but they are 30 year old role players. Noel is absolutely a keeper even if we keep Mitch as well (or plan to).

I believe we have a real gift with DRose and I think he and Taj both return on low money veteran exception type deals. Rose can get paid more somewhere but doesnt need it (check out his Adidas deal). So I think unless Noel is stupid again we end up bringing up Noel/Taj/DRose and still have enough for a submax level guy like Scroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan... something starting in $20-$28 range depending on the guy

We are not far apart. Its really the wing guys... I am not prioritizing bringing back Burks/Bullock over signing one of those bigger fish above

Agree on Rose...The re-emergence of Rose may definitely change the way the FO will view the PG position this summer. Rose's wear and tear on his body, injury history and age says we still need a young PG on the roster to back-up Rose or play in front of him. Lucrative Sneaker deals hasn't prevented other athletes from still requesting max-dollars from their perspective teams. I am not banking on Rose giving us a discount. I will believe it when I see it.

Also agree that we need an upgrade on the wing. Wouldn't mind one of Bullocks or Burks returning but not both at the kind of money they will command on the open market. I like DeRozan but I am not sure I like the fit here. DeRozan is lethal from the mid-range, but will hurt the spacing that Randle has been able to operate in this year. He does give us a go-to-scorer on any last second shots, however.

In the end, a Pg and a wing should be the priority this summer....

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozon/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

Think chemistry and familiarity trump just being able to replace key pieces. The fact is Bullock has been exceptional defensively and has accepted his role on the team. As has Burks. Something that is not easy to predict or find. Can't underestimate the importance of not only adding vets that one thinks would fit a team and system but keeping the ones that actually do. For me, it is absolutely crucial that we finally stick with the pieces that are working. We have been the turnstile of the NBA the last few years and our record has reflected that. The theory behind these one-year deals was to find out which vets fit. Well, these guys fit. Why go after replacements that we do not know will buy in, fit in or work well together, when we already have ones that do. I also think that Burks is one of those fringe guys that are on the brink of next-level stuff.

IF we look at what we all wanted at the beginning of the year, it was more 3pt shooting, good defense and a solid PG. Knicks have shown they are now a very good 3pt shooting team(4th in the NBA and almost 2nd if not for small clicks). They have Rose who is playing exceptional basketball at PG spot and a top-ranked defense. Think its reason enough to make keeping the core roster together a priority. Sure, if we can add a decent PG and another shooter like Powell, I am all in. But again, think this is a roster that you just trim some fat ( Frank, Knox, Pinson, Pelle, and Payton), add a draft asset, and a couple of value FA's to an already well put together core.

Be really careful about the bold. We are some ways from quantifying exactly what "working" means. The goal is to win a title, and we have a real opportunity with cap space to procure another key piece. I like Burks/Bullock a ton but they are 30 year old role players. Noel is absolutely a keeper even if we keep Mitch as well (or plan to).

I believe we have a real gift with DRose and I think he and Taj both return on low money veteran exception type deals. Rose can get paid more somewhere but doesnt need it (check out his Adidas deal). So I think unless Noel is stupid again we end up bringing up Noel/Taj/DRose and still have enough for a submax level guy like Scroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan... something starting in $20-$28 range depending on the guy

We are not far apart. Its really the wing guys... I am not prioritizing bringing back Burks/Bullock over signing one of those bigger fish above

Agree on Rose...The re-emergence of Rose may definitely change the way the FO will view the PG position this summer. Rose's wear and tear on his body, injury history and age says we still need a young PG on the roster to back-up Rose or play in front of him. Lucrative Sneaker deals hasn't prevented other athletes from still requesting max-dollars from their perspective teams. I am not banking on Rose giving us a discount. I will believe it when I see it.

Also agree that we need an upgrade on the wing. Wouldn't mind one of Bullocks or Burks returning but not both at the kind of money they will command on the open market. I like DeRozan but I am not sure I like the fit here. DeRozan is lethal from the mid-range, but will hurt the spacing that Randle has been able to operate in this year. He does give us a go-to-scorer on any last second shots, however.

In the end, a Pg and a wing should be the priority this summer....

Thing with Derozan is he gives you another legit option to run the offense through. That means your PG needs are more shooting and ball handling and less floor general.

As for Rose I dont think you are reading the tea laves.

In 2011 that he signed a 14-year deal with Adidas that totaled $185 million. It includes use of a private jet, a $250K salary to Rose's brother Reggie. He's made over $130mm with his NBA wages. The guy's approaching $300mm in career earnings at 32. He's not going to xxx for $12mm a year because the Knicks could only offer him $4mm, or $6mm... he's just not. He's so happy in this role. He's gotta stay in the league first and foremost to collect his Adidas cash. Cmon... listen to Rose talk, watch him play here vs. Detroit.. the guy is having fun. Time will tell but I feel pretty good Rose isnt going to be a high cost. Fingers crossed on that but dont think its a stretch. He's a bit unique

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozon/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

Think chemistry and familiarity trump just being able to replace key pieces. The fact is Bullock has been exceptional defensively and has accepted his role on the team. As has Burks. Something that is not easy to predict or find. Can't underestimate the importance of not only adding vets that one thinks would fit a team and system but keeping the ones that actually do. For me, it is absolutely crucial that we finally stick with the pieces that are working. We have been the turnstile of the NBA the last few years and our record has reflected that. The theory behind these one-year deals was to find out which vets fit. Well, these guys fit. Why go after replacements that we do not know will buy in, fit in or work well together, when we already have ones that do. I also think that Burks is one of those fringe guys that are on the brink of next-level stuff.

IF we look at what we all wanted at the beginning of the year, it was more 3pt shooting, good defense and a solid PG. Knicks have shown they are now a very good 3pt shooting team(4th in the NBA and almost 2nd if not for small clicks). They have Rose who is playing exceptional basketball at PG spot and a top-ranked defense. Think its reason enough to make keeping the core roster together a priority. Sure, if we can add a decent PG and another shooter like Powell, I am all in. But again, think this is a roster that you just trim some fat ( Frank, Knox, Pinson, Pelle, and Payton), add a draft asset, and a couple of value FA's to an already well put together core.

Be really careful about the bold. We are some ways from quantifying exactly what "working" means. The goal is to win a title, and we have a real opportunity with cap space to procure another key piece. I like Burks/Bullock a ton but they are 30 year old role players. Noel is absolutely a keeper even if we keep Mitch as well (or plan to).

I believe we have a real gift with DRose and I think he and Taj both return on low money veteran exception type deals. Rose can get paid more somewhere but doesnt need it (check out his Adidas deal). So I think unless Noel is stupid again we end up bringing up Noel/Taj/DRose and still have enough for a submax level guy like Scroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan... something starting in $20-$28 range depending on the guy

We are not far apart. Its really the wing guys... I am not prioritizing bringing back Burks/Bullock over signing one of those bigger fish above

Agree on Rose...The re-emergence of Rose may definitely change the way the FO will view the PG position this summer. Rose's wear and tear on his body, injury history and age says we still need a young PG on the roster to back-up Rose or play in front of him. Lucrative Sneaker deals hasn't prevented other athletes from still requesting max-dollars from their perspective teams. I am not banking on Rose giving us a discount. I will believe it when I see it.

Also agree that we need an upgrade on the wing. Wouldn't mind one of Bullocks or Burks returning but not both at the kind of money they will command on the open market. I like DeRozan but I am not sure I like the fit here. DeRozan is lethal from the mid-range, but will hurt the spacing that Randle has been able to operate in this year. He does give us a go-to-scorer on any last second shots, however.

In the end, a Pg and a wing should be the priority this summer....

I would love Derozan and think he's the ideal fit. He doesnt shoot the 3 but is still a spacer. His midrange game is fantastic and he's a GREAT ball mover with 7 assists a game and he attacks w/ 7FTs a game.

Thing with Derozan is he gives you another legit option to run the offense through. That means your PG needs are more shooting and ball handling and less floor general.

As for Rose I dont think you are reading the tea laves.

In 2011 that he signed a 14-year deal with Adidas that totaled $185 million. It includes use of a private jet, a $250K salary to Rose's brother Reggie. He's made over $130mm with his NBA wages. The guy's approaching $300mm in career earnings at 32. He's not going to xxx for $12mm a year because the Knicks could only offer him $4mm, or $6mm... he's just not. He's so happy in this role. He's gotta stay in the league first and foremost to collect his Adidas cash. Cmon... listen to Rose talk, watch him play here vs. Detroit.. the guy is having fun. Time will tell but I feel pretty good Rose isnt going to be a high cost. Fingers crossed on that but dont think its a stretch. He's a bit unique

DeRozan has reshaped and redefined his game under the tuteledge of Pop similar to Julius under Thibs. DeRozan has turned into an elite passer to compliment his mid range game similar to Julius under Thibs as well. Unlike Julius, though, he hasn't improved the distance on his shot.
Like I said, I like Derozans game, always have. I'm not saying he definitely won't be a fit here, its a good chance that he will, but I have some concerns that may or may not be a concern.

DeRozans assists are high which is a great thing, but his usage is much higher than Bullocks which will have to be worked out between RJ, Randle, DeRozan and Thibs. I guess the spacing won't be too much of a concern, as long as RJ and Randle shoot the rock next year, the way they are shooting it this year.

I saw Roses deal and the fact that he negotiated that deal for his bro is gangsta!!! Only thing better than money, is mo money. With that said, he is a different dude, literally, and seems to be in a great space. Based on the last contract he signed, its a good chance he will sign that will benefit us....I am not saying it won't happen, I just want to see it

Time will tell but its fun no matter what

Knickfury11 wrote:

EwingsGlass wrote:My my focus would to try and get Ball and Powell in sign and trades and then use cap hold and exceptions to re-sign. Their signing power can exceed the cap if they are clever about ordering and other teams are incentivized to not lose FAs for nothing.

1) Rose (early bird)
2) Noel (non-bird)
3) Bullock (early bird)
4) Burks (non-bird)
5) Gibson (Vet Min)

Ball/Rose/Vildoza
Barrett/IQ
Powell/Burks/Bullock
Randle/Toppin/Knox
Robinson/Noel/Pelle/Gibson

Only thing about this roster is that it leaves zero room for rookie draft picks. They will need to consolidate assets to some degree or draft foreign players in stash moves.

I think it would be a mistake to not make a move on Ball and/or Powell as both are more developed but within the growth cycle of this team and likely ok playing next to Randle. Long wingspans that can shoot decent from 3 (Both have been regressing from 3 lately which is a concern)

Like the thought process here. The composition of our roster should not remain static. We have to keep trying to supplement our core ( Randle & RJ ) in search of improvements? I would speculate that there are already plans in place regarding our draft assets. Depending upon how the chips fall.

FA players we need to pursue- Lonzo, Brunson and Powell ( younger burks ).

So, my approach to daydream team construction lately is to target 25-28 year old RFA or UFA players that have relatively high eFG, strong motor, and long wingspan. I ignore height except to the extent that height is a positional strength despite average wingspan. (Powell 6’3 with 6’11 wingspan.. all I see is 6’11.

I’m looking for 38% 3pt shooter and generally guys that brings a different something to either the first or second unit.

Ball is a playmaker that looked like he could shoot for a few months. Great height, good wingspan. High defense motor. Can bring transition offense and create with his passing in the half court set. Would expect him to utilize MRobinson a bit more than the current team has. If we can’t get Ball, I’d probably try and pry Russell away from Minnesota. Would cost more, but that team probably needs to just reorient around Edwards and a new coach.

Powell is long and bouncy. Love this guy. Was a 40% 3pt shooter until he hit Portland. UFA. 6’3 and plays SF with his 6’11 condor wingspan.

I think those moves aren’t the biggest names, but you start this team with those additions and i think you add 5-6 more wins to the team. That’s top 4. And as they gel, or a internal player takes a step forward, I think they are contenders.

ramtour420 wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Uptown wrote:

fishmike wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozon/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

Think chemistry and familiarity trump just being able to replace key pieces. The fact is Bullock has been exceptional defensively and has accepted his role on the team. As has Burks. Something that is not easy to predict or find. Can't underestimate the importance of not only adding vets that one thinks would fit a team and system but keeping the ones that actually do. For me, it is absolutely crucial that we finally stick with the pieces that are working. We have been the turnstile of the NBA the last few years and our record has reflected that. The theory behind these one-year deals was to find out which vets fit. Well, these guys fit. Why go after replacements that we do not know will buy in, fit in or work well together, when we already have ones that do. I also think that Burks is one of those fringe guys that are on the brink of next-level stuff.

IF we look at what we all wanted at the beginning of the year, it was more 3pt shooting, good defense and a solid PG. Knicks have shown they are now a very good 3pt shooting team(4th in the NBA and almost 2nd if not for small clicks). They have Rose who is playing exceptional basketball at PG spot and a top-ranked defense. Think its reason enough to make keeping the core roster together a priority. Sure, if we can add a decent PG and another shooter like Powell, I am all in. But again, think this is a roster that you just trim some fat ( Frank, Knox, Pinson, Pelle, and Payton), add a draft asset, and a couple of value FA's to an already well put together core.

Be really careful about the bold. We are some ways from quantifying exactly what "working" means. The goal is to win a title, and we have a real opportunity with cap space to procure another key piece. I like Burks/Bullock a ton but they are 30 year old role players. Noel is absolutely a keeper even if we keep Mitch as well (or plan to).

I believe we have a real gift with DRose and I think he and Taj both return on low money veteran exception type deals. Rose can get paid more somewhere but doesnt need it (check out his Adidas deal). So I think unless Noel is stupid again we end up bringing up Noel/Taj/DRose and still have enough for a submax level guy like Scroder/Conley/Powell/Derozan... something starting in $20-$28 range depending on the guy

We are not far apart. Its really the wing guys... I am not prioritizing bringing back Burks/Bullock over signing one of those bigger fish above

Agree on Rose...The re-emergence of Rose may definitely change the way the FO will view the PG position this summer. Rose's wear and tear on his body, injury history and age says we still need a young PG on the roster to back-up Rose or play in front of him. Lucrative Sneaker deals hasn't prevented other athletes from still requesting max-dollars from their perspective teams. I am not banking on Rose giving us a discount. I will believe it when I see it.

Also agree that we need an upgrade on the wing. Wouldn't mind one of Bullocks or Burks returning but not both at the kind of money they will command on the open market. I like DeRozan but I am not sure I like the fit here. DeRozan is lethal from the mid-range, but will hurt the spacing that Randle has been able to operate in this year. He does give us a go-to-scorer on any last second shots, however.

In the end, a Pg and a wing should be the priority this summer....

I would love Derozan and think he's the ideal fit. He doesnt shoot the 3 but is still a spacer. His midrange game is fantastic and he's a GREAT ball mover with 7 assists a game and he attacks w/ 7FTs a game.

Thing with Derozan is he gives you another legit option to run the offense through. That means your PG needs are more shooting and ball handling and less floor general.

As for Rose I dont think you are reading the tea laves.

In 2011 that he signed a 14-year deal with Adidas that totaled $185 million. It includes use of a private jet, a $250K salary to Rose's brother Reggie. He's made over $130mm with his NBA wages. The guy's approaching $300mm in career earnings at 32. He's not going to xxx for $12mm a year because the Knicks could only offer him $4mm, or $6mm... he's just not. He's so happy in this role. He's gotta stay in the league first and foremost to collect his Adidas cash. Cmon... listen to Rose talk, watch him play here vs. Detroit.. the guy is having fun. Time will tell but I feel pretty good Rose isnt going to be a high cost. Fingers crossed on that but dont think its a stretch. He's a bit unique

DeRozan has reshaped and redefined his game under the tuteledge of Pop similar to Julius under Thibs. DeRozan has turned into an elite passer to compliment his mid range game similar to Julius under Thibs as well. Unlike Julius, though, he hasn't improved the distance on his shot.
Like I said, I like Derozans game, always have. I'm not saying he definitely won't be a fit here, its a good chance that he will, but I have some concerns that may or may not be a concern.

DeRozans assists are high which is a great thing, but his usage is much higher than Bullocks which will have to be worked out between RJ, Randle, DeRozan and Thibs. I guess the spacing won't be too much of a concern, as long as RJ and Randle shoot the rock next year, the way they are shooting it this year.

I saw Roses deal and the fact that he negotiated that deal for his bro is gangsta!!! Only thing better than money, is mo money. With that said, he is a different dude, literally, and seems to be in a great space. Based on the last contract he signed, its a good chance he will sign that will benefit us....I am not saying it won't happen, I just want to see it

I am against DeRozan. His 7 assists are a result of him playing for a coach who has an offensive system with sets that require passes. It's Pops. Derozan coming here to drive and kick out might not take full advantage of his passing. And that's the best case scenario. And he would take that job from Randle, who is just as good at it. Why? Because if Randle drives and kicks it to Derozan that doesn't do anything. Because DeRozan doesn't shoot from 3 and would need to get to the paint. The paint would be occupied by Randle. So he would only have the mid range. Which is from the basketball of yesteryear. Nowadays the metrics require players to take the 3 or shoot under the basket.
Now let's see if we can work it the other way. Derozan drives and kicks it to Randle who is lights out from the 3. Great. We just effectively downgraded Randle to the Steve Novak role. Not good.

I agree with this analysis. Derozan also has suspect defense. I am not really supportive of guys that can’t shoot or play D but still cost a lot of money. I just don’t see the benefit. That role is the one you want Barrett to take (while playing D and shooting the 3).

fishmike wrote:totally fool hardy and fools gold. The formula is ride RJ/Randle, protect the rim and lean on your depth. I love guys like Bullock/Burks but the simple truth is those players are easy to acquire and if the roster is loaded with high end talent they will be even easier, because low tier veteran FAs will be happy to come and play here.

Noel is the only Knick FA that is really critical to sign. The other guys are NOT AS GOOD as Conley/Powell/Derozone/Schroder and you would be stupid to waste an opportunity like $60-$70mm whatever in cap space to bring back inferior players than whats currently on the market

Makes ZERO sense.

ramtour420 wrote:I am against DeRozan. His 7 assists are a result of him playing for a coach who has an offensive system with sets that require passes. It's Pops. Derozan coming here to drive and kick out might not take full advantage of his passing. And that's the best case scenario. And he would take that job from Randle, who is just as good at it. Why? Because if Randle drives and kicks it to Derozan that doesn't do anything. Because DeRozan doesn't shoot from 3 and would need to get to the paint. The paint would be occupied by Randle. So he would only have the mid range. Which is from the basketball of yesteryear. Nowadays the metrics require players to take the 3 or shoot under the basket.
Now let's see if we can work it the other way. Derozan drives and kicks it to Randle who is lights out from the 3. Great. We just effectively downgraded Randle to the Steve Novak role. Not good.

I find all of this not right.

Derozan adds another aspect to the team that it does not have: a very competent slasher who also passes a LOT. He also adds a quality scorer night in and night out. DeRozen does not have to be the last big piece but he does have to come at a cost that meets his output.

DeRozen is a MUCH better facilitator than Randle. 7 assists to 2 TO's versus 6 and 3.5.

DeRozen is doing this with only 1 real above average 3pt shooter on the Spurs in Rudy Gay. Rudy does not start and I have zero clue how much time they share on the court. Let me say that again: DeRozen is a killer in the mid range and rim and he has zero spacing around him on the Spurs compared to what the Knicks could surround him with.

DeRozen sucks at shooting 3 point shots. He is not the perfect add.

Facilitating FOR Randle and RJ may be better then for both of those guys. Feel like we have an inkling of that with Rose but not all the way.

Feel like the Knicks are turning into a passing team ala Spurs, this must continue.

Also, you sign him to a digestible contract, and then he can be repackaged.

Would I rather have a Lonzo than DeRozen all things being equal? Sure but let's not turn away from all the options, and DeRozen would be a very one.