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lrluis
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10/26/2004  6:36 PM
Say all you want about Phil coaching the Knicks but don't look at it from a basketball perspective.

I'd say he won't go back East, especially if his fiancee (wife?) has anything to say about it. After all, he attached himself to Jerry Buss's daughter, who happens to run the LA Forum. She also happened to pose for Playboy---who would leave a woman like that?

Plus: retirement could be peaceful (I wouldn't know), almost "Zen"-like. After all, he is the "Zen"-master.
AUTOADVERT
Nalod
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10/26/2004  7:36 PM
Posted by Panos:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by RonRon:


[clip...]
And about phil jackson, I dont think this team quite fits the triangle. Phil jackson is a great coach but he also needs dominating players in his system and the PG is probably the weakest position in it. With that said, what would we do for marbary.

He won't do it this year. Say next year, a 3 year deal, thats 4 years to get it right.

Zen: See not the team rahw, but rut dah team cood be. See not Moochie san, but Ariza san. See not bad fung shui Krut, but Sweetney San. See not Nazy san, not binny san, but prayah you not know. Phril must wise man. Him not trake suppah stah, him do dat ready, but him do it rif differrent type prayah.

Phril very wise, Panos not see wisdom in Phril. You must snatch stones from kidney and see fru fog in blaine in head.

Gong!

Why Phil Jackson? What makes him so great? What has he done
without 2 of the 5 best players in the league on his team?
He's even managed to lose a couple of championships with
Shaq and Kobe on the team.
A championship ring on every finger takes a good coach even if you have one or two great players

We're not just talking great players. We're talking he had the most dominant player in the league at the time when he won each of those rings, and another player that was easily top 5.
What will he have on the Knicks? Nothing even close.
PENNS45
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10/26/2004  11:10 PM
I think that Lenny is the right coach for this team. He had success with Cleveland when his best player on the team was a point guard(Mark Price). It's similar to the situation here. He has taken all 4 teams that he has coached into the playoffs, so that indicates to me that he has a good system that works. Maybe we don't know exactly what his system is here yet, but it's only preseason. There have been a lot of roster changes in the past year, so it would be difficult for any coach to establish a system.
technomaster
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10/27/2004  12:47 AM
Phil Jackson isn't well liked because of the mind-games he plays with opposing teams. (not to mention that his Bulls teams generally got the better of us)

I'm a believer that you need to try to understand the enemy before making a judgment about them. I've read his first book and have followed his interviews and articles about him over the years.

Phil Jackson's coaching philosophy is very sound--- a lot of it is based on what he learned as a "specialty" bench guy on the Knicks. The Knicks championship teams never had the absolute top players on those teams--- just a college of very good players who played SMART team basketball.

Doesn't he have 11 rings as a player and coach? (not sure if he got one for the 69 season-- he was injured)

http://www.nba.com/coachfile/phil_jackson/

Anyway, I believe that he's one of those coaches that truly makes his teams better.

Sure, the Lakers had Kobe and Shaq... but many of the other 10 players they sported couldn't crack any other teams' rotations.


Posted by Panos:
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by Panos:
Posted by RonRon:


[clip...]
And about phil jackson, I dont think this team quite fits the triangle. Phil jackson is a great coach but he also needs dominating players in his system and the PG is probably the weakest position in it. With that said, what would we do for marbary.

Why Phil Jackson? What makes him so great? What has he done
without 2 of the 5 best players in the league on his team?
He's even managed to lose a couple of championships with
Shaq and Kobe on the team.
A championship ring on every finger takes a good coach even if you have one or two great players

We're not just talking great players. We're talking he had the most dominant player in the league at the time when he won each of those rings, and another player that was easily top 5.
What will he have on the Knicks? Nothing even close.
“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
Bippity10
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10/27/2004  1:34 PM
Yeah I'm not a big Wilkens fan but I find it difficult to criticize him at this point. We have made 400 trades in the span of 6 months, of course we don't have a team identity yet. These guys are still trying to remember each other's names. Give it time.

Also for the record Lenny's teams are consistently in the Top 10 in the league in defense. Our team unfortunately has poor defensive players and it will take a lot to improve. If we finish in the Top 10 in defense this year then Lenny should be considered Coach of the Year.
I just hope that people will like me
fishmike
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10/27/2004  1:48 PM
while Lenny never blew me away I always thought he was solid. His Hawks teams were never as good as the Knicks/Bulls/Pacers of the 90s, but they were always tough and often advanced. Also, remember when the Raptors won like 18 of 21 to finish the season WITHOUT Vince Carter to make the playoffs? They did it with Mo Pete as a rookie and Chris Childs and Antonio Davis leading the way. Talk about squeezing blood from a stone.

If I could get Larry Brown or Jerry Sloan I would in a heartbeat, but Lenny is right in with the rest of the crowd.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
jazz74
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10/27/2004  2:45 PM
i will defend lenny even though i am with martin about the long term plans of lenny. i think wilkens is the perfect coach for this team for now. if you look at a lenny wilkens team, you can not say that one team is the same as the other. each team were vastly different. cleveland and seattle were fast break teams while atlanta and toronto were defensive minded half court teams. he changed with what he had. he is one of the few coaches who can adapt his coaching style to the personell that he has. not many coaches can say they do that. it is usually the other way aroaund. now, i am not saying that this works out all the time because teams start losing their identity ( see atlanta and toronto) but for a couple of years this will work.

as far as jackson goes, if we get him say goodbye to marbury. his triangle offense is definately not a point guard friendly system. jackson would be the wrong choice to have for our current constructed team. but i thought he would have been ideal in '99.
Nalod
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10/27/2004  3:05 PM
I don't view steph as a point. HIm and barron davis are similar, shoot first guards. Bulls did not have a true point. Small "soft" shooter played point. Either Mike or Pip were the point. Point is the scoring threat. Either leave him alone, and he burns you, or double and pass.

It can work with marbs. If Trevor is the real deal. He is the Pip. Alan is more effective than Pax or kerr. Jamal is on his own planet and will need to read some of Jax mind PHuch books, but he got upside. Jax teaches the game, somthing Jamal has low IQ right now.

We are a few pieces away, but if Isiah can get Jax to come, he should pounce on it when it happens. Red holtzman will channel the love in the garden. Magic will happen.

If the the yanks dominated the sox, and the Celts dominated the knicks for years. If the sox win, they might lift the curse the celts have on the Knicks.
Bonn1997
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10/27/2004  3:23 PM
The most important part of being a true PG is making plays for your teammates. Baron and Steph are two of the best in the world at that.
lrluis
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10/27/2004  3:35 PM
I'm a believer that you need to try to understand the enemy before making a judgment about them. I've read his first book and have followed his interviews and articles about him over the years.

Techno, the following is an excerpt from a review of Phil's last book, "The Last Season" by James D. Chlovechok, M.D., author of the Sports Thriller GAME FACE. Thought you might like it:

Phil Jackson's coaching legacy might still have been in doubt following his second Michael Jordan-orchestrated three-peat. After all, Jordan's talent, leadership, and determination had amounted to an irresistible force--leaving the Zen Master with seemingly little to do but sit and hum to himself while contemplating his rings. Who, blessed with such circumstances, could fail to appear serene?

And then he took on the Lakers. Sure, we know, L.A. was loaded with talent and had not only one potentially dominant player, but two. How could he fail? For starters, he was not the first coach to try to take this group to the top. It may have looked easy, but so far it hadn't been done. And these two particular stars seemed focused not on dominating other teams so much as their own. From what the Master has revealed in this book and promotional interviews, not to mention what played out on NBA and in Colorado courts this past season, one had to wonder if Jackson should not be re-dubbed Dr. Phil--and if he should not have been tempted to escape this dishonorable situation through a traditional ceremony involving his own sword.

I want to thank Phil Jackson for writing this book. It apparently takes someone with more insight or clarity than is possessed by the mainstream sports media to make what should be an obvious point. How else to explain what has apparently been regarded as its revelatory message: that Kobe Bryant is difficult and selfish? Big shock, there. Kobe's biggest criticism of the book, in fact, is likely that it is not ALL about Kobe.

Lest we forget, Kobe Bryant has been accused of raping a young woman hotel employee in Colorado. Kobe had left his beautiful, young wife and their infant daughter at home to travel to Colorado for knee surgery. It might have been a bit much to ask that Kobe should worry about the outcome of this procedure on a body part on which he and his family depended for his continued success and prosperity. He had other things on his mind apparently--because his defense is that the sex he had with this complete stranger, reportedly minutes after meeting her, was consensual. That's right: She wanted it, and so did he.

Why is this a big point with regard to this book? Because the sports media made such a big deal out of Bryant's "courage" and determination when he would fly in a private jet from a courthouse in Colorado to a game in L.A. and knock down thirty-plus points. I heard words such as "character" used on TV to explain his performance. This to describe a guy who had just offered up adultery as a defense in a rape case, and was sufficiently untroubled by either the impact of this situation or his statements on his wife and daughter or his relationships with them, the PR disaster his actions posed for his employer and his endorsement products, or the reputations of everyone involved, that he could go right out and play basketball at a phenomenal level. Being in the zone is one thing. Living with your head in the ozone is another. But basketball is Kobe's stage. And when he is on that stage and playing well, things are just how he likes them to be: all about Kobe.

Now that he has driven the most successful NBA coach of the past twenty years out of game and the most dominant player in the league out of town, L.A., too, can now be all about Kobe. What is unfathomable is why the Laker organization was so bent on banishing these two stable corners of its triangle offense even while it remained far from a slam dunk that a jury would allow the third to be handling the ball at all next year.

Thank you, Mr. Jackson, for contributing more to the game than Kobe Bryant ever could, and more to our understanding of this shameful episode than all of the groupie reporters tagging along behind him combined.
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