newyorknewyork wrote:

fishmike wrote:

Knixkik wrote:If anything we can now turn the page on the Porzingis chapter knowing that it has led to something better and has in a sense worked out in our favor to some extent.

its worked out. We used the cap space for Randle/Morris. Morris netted us a FRP who becomes IQ. We all love that move. Randle becomes a stud at PF and looks great playing next to Mitch.

We have a squad that Thibs can coach up and nice draft assets coming in.

Don’t forget the Dallas picks

Conidering their value at the time. Perry did a good job of trading Melo, and KP, while keeping an eye on the future. How we got Mitch, as well as Quickley.

Randle is a much better buy, an Ironman compared to KP. This season he’s doing his best Lebron impression - James without the hops. He’ll impact the team in more games.

technomaster wrote:I voted KP... because at his best, he’s a force of nature. If he’s healthy at the right time, he’s a weapon that can’t be stopped and cheat mode on defense. He’s like a performance race car - needs frequent maintenance and from time to time needs a lot of maintenance.

Randle is a much better buy, an Ironman compared to KP. This season he’s doing his best Lebron impression - James without the hops. He’ll impact the team in more games.

Quick everyone- GET HIM!!!!!!!

As always if Knicks take care of business we move on from KP, and from frank with new talent. Until that happens we as fans get stuck on what’s in front of us. Its why going into preseason we were fixated on Frank and Dennis. Its why we wanted to keep Miller. We know what we know. Thibs conceptually was a great idea but the things we were concerned about are still valid. Thibs burns the candle at both ends and burns himself and the team out. He professed to having evolved from that. Time will tell.
Meanwhile, enjoy the games!

Nalod wrote:PHil was a doubter from day one. He was. Bit injured even in his tryout. Gaines his top scout was trusted and Phil drafted him.
That we picked fourth made it easy. KP was a better trade chip than Okafor ever was. I think Russell was the safe pick but if you think he buckled in LA, NYC situation would have crushed him.
PHil said height, lack of lower body strength, and the small ass would not the help. We later learned his anemic condition was cause of fatigue. This to counter balance a 7’3 small forward who had crazy range and a reasonable handle that can defend the rim and excite with putbacks! KP is the better player. Randle is the better knick.
PHil wanted to trade him at max value after he early on demonstrated being a problem. So lets not congratulate ourselves for being all smart about prognosticating what happened. It was all out there to be read and thought thru.
Nalod will puff his chest out and remind I bought this subject up early last year and y’all blew me off when I said to consider Randle as part of the trade given the cap space. I will remind all that I said give this trade 5 years to see how it sorts out with the picks. Again, I’m not self congratulatory here, just applying common sense.
This is not “I told you so” because in the end Randle might be off to another team as free agent and KP with Luka might be hoisting a chip with Cuban under a shower of confetti. What we are learning is PHil was on it despite his other derelict qualities and in the aftermath the trade created opportunities. We signed Randle, we drafted Quick, etc etc.
IN a perfect world two teams make a trade and it helps both. Maybe this is where we are heading. KP is Dallas problem and opportunity.
It took years to digest the enormity of the Melo deal and the ramifications both positive and not to disclose. This kp trade is still in progress. Where the pick falls this year?

As always if Knicks take care of business we move on from KP, and from frank with new talent. Until that happens we as fans get stuck on what’s in front of us. Its why going into preseason we were fixated on Frank and Dennis. Its why we wanted to keep Miller. We know what we know. Thibs conceptually was a great idea but the things we were concerned about are still valid. Thibs burns the candle at both ends and burns himself and the team out. He professed to having evolved from that. Time will tell.
Meanwhile, enjoy the games!

Yeah looking back I was against the Celtics trade mainly because it was Boston, and I figured if we traded him there it would burn us for 10 years. In the end they had the best deal for us with Jaylen Brown and picks, assuming Brown also developed here, which is a big If. The Suns deal of the 4th pick in 2017 plus whatever else was ok but the problem is Phil wanted Josh Jackson and coming out of that draft with Josh Jackson and Ntilikina would have obviously turned out poorly. In the end, Phil was spot on about his concerns with Porzingis, but there wasn't really a good trade out there other than a Boston trade and that wasn't clear at the time. We have to be happy the previous regimes/trades failed to get to this point. I am looking at the Porzingis to Mavs trade as basically Porzingis, Hardaway, and Burks for Randle, Quickley, Payton, Bullock, and 2 first round picks. Would you do that trade now? I definitely would.

Knixkik wrote:

Nalod wrote:PHil was a doubter from day one. He was. Bit injured even in his tryout. Gaines his top scout was trusted and Phil drafted him.
That we picked fourth made it easy. KP was a better trade chip than Okafor ever was. I think Russell was the safe pick but if you think he buckled in LA, NYC situation would have crushed him.
PHil said height, lack of lower body strength, and the small ass would not the help. We later learned his anemic condition was cause of fatigue. This to counter balance a 7’3 small forward who had crazy range and a reasonable handle that can defend the rim and excite with putbacks! KP is the better player. Randle is the better knick.
PHil wanted to trade him at max value after he early on demonstrated being a problem. So lets not congratulate ourselves for being all smart about prognosticating what happened. It was all out there to be read and thought thru.
Nalod will puff his chest out and remind I bought this subject up early last year and y’all blew me off when I said to consider Randle as part of the trade given the cap space. I will remind all that I said give this trade 5 years to see how it sorts out with the picks. Again, I’m not self congratulatory here, just applying common sense.
This is not “I told you so” because in the end Randle might be off to another team as free agent and KP with Luka might be hoisting a chip with Cuban under a shower of confetti. What we are learning is PHil was on it despite his other derelict qualities and in the aftermath the trade created opportunities. We signed Randle, we drafted Quick, etc etc.
IN a perfect world two teams make a trade and it helps both. Maybe this is where we are heading. KP is Dallas problem and opportunity.
It took years to digest the enormity of the Melo deal and the ramifications both positive and not to disclose. This kp trade is still in progress. Where the pick falls this year?

As always if Knicks take care of business we move on from KP, and from frank with new talent. Until that happens we as fans get stuck on what’s in front of us. Its why going into preseason we were fixated on Frank and Dennis. Its why we wanted to keep Miller. We know what we know. Thibs conceptually was a great idea but the things we were concerned about are still valid. Thibs burns the candle at both ends and burns himself and the team out. He professed to having evolved from that. Time will tell.
Meanwhile, enjoy the games!

Yeah looking back I was against the Celtics trade mainly because it was Boston, and I figured if we traded him there it would burn us for 10 years. In the end they had the best deal for us with Jaylen Brown and picks, assuming Brown also developed here, which is a big If. The Suns deal of the 4th pick in 2017 plus whatever else was ok but the problem is Phil wanted Josh Jackson and coming out of that draft with Josh Jackson and Ntilikina would have obviously turned out poorly. In the end, Phil was spot on about his concerns with Porzingis, but there wasn't really a good trade out there other than a Boston trade and that wasn't clear at the time. We have to be happy the previous regimes/trades failed to get to this point. I am looking at the Porzingis to Mavs trade as basically Porzingis, Hardaway, and Burks for Randle, Quickley, Payton, Bullock, and 2 first round picks. Would you do that trade now? I definitely would.

Recall there was a scenario discussed about Booker/Rights to what became Markkenen.
PHil got fired for it. Might he drafted Frank? Might have that pick been moved or reconstituted? So many moving parts that would have changed so its hard to put it all together.
All I know is Phil wanted to trade him and was canned. Most fans were tired of PHil and thought with him gone KP would be happy. So its not knicks did not try. KP did not get along with Hornacek so we bought in The Friendly Fiz. That did not make him happy.
Its all unfortunate. KP on the floor was special. With Luka he need not be the focal point and while his star ambitions might be reduced, basketball wise its good for him. He got paid too!
Randle takes the sting out of it for sure. We moving on.
IQ takes the sting out of Franks lack of development. We moving on.
Thibs exceeds Miller. We moving on.
Let’s hope the rest of the season turns out ok. Long way to go.

knicks1248 wrote:The thing is KP wanted to be here, but wanted to be in a winning environment with a franchise that had better direction even more.

As much as you like where you work, if the company has a high turnover and a dysfunctional management, your going to look for a new job

You think for one minute that if KP was here now he would be requesting a trade?

No he was a thin skinned diva. Lots of players drafted high by bad teams help their teams get better after the team struggles first couple years. KP has zero mental toughness in addition to being made of glass