BigRedDog wrote:

Nalod wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Kemet wrote:

Vmart wrote:

franco12 wrote:I don't understand some people here.

Fiz is the best coach we've had since Riley.

Full stop.

He is trying to win games, and I think also trying to figure out which players should be part of the long term future here.

I don't think there is one player right now on the team healthy who is a clear cut starter in the NBA.

You have a ton of middling, average, mixed talents. Some with upside, some with downsides.

Besides KP, who is the clear cut starters????

Fizz is just another stop gap coach. He sucks there is no system no plan.

So True .. Fiz is just another front-office puppet-coach without a system or defensive plan.
All the different starter lineup changes in 24 games has not got players on the same-page.

Glad someone seems to know. Yes this guy is Perry’s puppet and Perry scares me as a no talent GM. Who is know to give up on the wrong up and coming players. Oladipo and Harris are prime examples. This what he is doing to Ntlikina and this going to be disastrous mistake. As for Fizz he has no system so any player of Ntlikina’s ilk is going to struggle. He isn’t a street baller. Usually street ballers don’t play well in systems. And system players don’t play well in street ball. Ntlikina needs structure and Fiz has no structure. Street ball fans will be happy with Fizz but winning is about system.

Perry was the assistant GM in Orlando.

Ssssh. Don't let the facts get in the way of Vmarts agenda.

With input. But let’s not consider it a team decision. If the GM is asking for input and getting input what does that make the decision? But let’s just blame everyone else but the guy in the ear.

Vmart wrote:

Nalod wrote:Is fiz doing what it takes for NOW? Or this the direction going forward.
Because of this I can't say Im unhappy. If we are still sorting things out so be it.
Maybe we just shelving Frank because of the lack of system for now.

You either have a system to implement or you don’t. He doesn’t have a system at least nothing that will result in winning.

There is no system which can result in winning for this team.
The goal is to first have a group which can win in general then install a system which will fit this non-existent yet team best.
This year is about development, accountability, and evaluation of everyone, including GM and coach.
Data collection in progress...

Knixkik wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

Knixkik wrote:I think Fiz is using Hezonja as a placeholder until he confidently can put Knox back in the lineup. He can't put Dotson in because Dotson won't give up that spot. Hezonja is playing his way out of it and Knox will eventually be the guy. Also, clearly Hezonja was promised preferential treatment, so he's getting it now until Knox is ready.

Ok. But this is the complete opposite of keeping what you kill lol

I don't want knox, trier or dotson in the starting line up, because if you fill out the bench with everyone who is struggling, what do you think is going to happen?

Either they wont be able to sustain leads or comeback from a deficit. Its got to be a balance

I don't agree with this, but I can kinda see your point. How do you explain the fact that Dot wasn't playing at all?

He was part of the starting line up that would get off to slow starts, then he started missing shots and playing a lil shaky. He rewarded Mario with his minutes because he saw an improvement in his defense.

fiz was very honest about the knicks having an extended preseason, 20 to 25 games in.

should he have just stayed with a line up that was falling behind by double digits for 5 straight games

That doesn't explain the DNPs. Have you seen anything from Mario that gives you any indication that he'd have more of an offensive or defensive impact than DOT. His overallplay on the court makes it hard to believe he deserves minutes at all, forget about starting. Again, I could understand wanting to see how Mario fits in as a starter. But not playing Dot at all, who is clearly our best available option on the wing, doesn't make sense.

I definitely think Mario seeing starter's minutes has more to do with the new regime and promise to him when he agreed to sign. Dotson and Ntilikina are on rookie contracts (and have no influence) and will both eventually be consistent rotation players. Hezonja will be gone, as will Burke and maybe even Mudiay, although he may hang around. There are a lot of minutes to be distributed at the 1, 2, and 3 and we need to see this team consolidated a bit before blaming that on the coach.

Mario will get 10 games starter run and then they will go to the film room to summarize the body of work.
And he will be asked if this body of work is worth to keep him as starter. It will no questions left from anybody.
Work talks for itself.

Vmart wrote:

arkrud wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Nalod wrote:Is fiz doing what it takes for NOW? Or this the direction going forward.
Because of this I can't say Im unhappy. If we are still sorting things out so be it.
Maybe we just shelving Frank because of the lack of system for now.

You either have a system to implement or you don’t. He doesn’t have a system at least nothing that will result in winning.

There is no system which can result in winning for this team.
The goal is to first have a group which can win in general then install a system which will fit this non-existent yet team best.
This year is about development, accountability, and evaluation of everyone, including GM and coach.
Data collection in progress...

The goal is to develop not give up on.

Who was gave up on?

Fiz has done a great job giving EVERYONE a look and fair shake thus far. He has done so and stayed competitive. Lets see the armchair geniuses suggest better lineups. For those mad that Frank is sitting, guess you were not listening at the beginning of the year when he said he will roll the ball out and let the best players play. What kind of respect would he have if he now changed the rules!!

HofstraBBall wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Kemet wrote:

Vmart wrote:

franco12 wrote:I don't understand some people here.

Fiz is the best coach we've had since Riley.

Full stop.

He is trying to win games, and I think also trying to figure out which players should be part of the long term future here.

I don't think there is one player right now on the team healthy who is a clear cut starter in the NBA.

You have a ton of middling, average, mixed talents. Some with upside, some with downsides.

Besides KP, who is the clear cut starters????

Fizz is just another stop gap coach. He sucks there is no system no plan.

So True .. Fiz is just another front-office puppet-coach without a system or defensive plan.
All the different starter lineup changes in 24 games has not got players on the same-page.

Glad someone seems to know. Yes this guy is Perry’s puppet and Perry scares me as a no talent GM. Who is know to give up on the wrong up and coming players. Oladipo and Harris are prime examples. This what he is doing to Ntlikina and this going to be disastrous mistake. As for Fizz he has no system so any player of Ntlikina’s ilk is going to struggle. He isn’t a street baller. Usually street ballers don’t play well in systems. And system players don’t play well in street ball. Ntlikina needs structure and Fiz has no structure. Street ball fans will be happy with Fizz but winning is about system.

Huh?

What moves has Perry made here that you disagree with? If your mad that Frank has been benched because he has not played well that's one thing. But why make it about Perry? And how is comparing Oladipo with Frank relevant. Oladipo was playing pretty well in Orlando but they knew he would be too costly to keep. Frank is not playing well nor does he have cost issues for the Knicks. Btw, have you heard something we have not? Is Frank being traded? Or you just like complaining about things that have yet to happen.

I dislike all his moves. I don’t like the coach he has hired. I don’t like the players he has brought in. The players he has brought in are trashed players and all reclamation project that will lead the team to nowhere.

As for Frank he has played poorly but the object of the year is developing players so why is Frank sitting. Let him play through it.

Vmart wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Kemet wrote:

Vmart wrote:

franco12 wrote:I don't understand some people here.

Fiz is the best coach we've had since Riley.

Full stop.

He is trying to win games, and I think also trying to figure out which players should be part of the long term future here.

I don't think there is one player right now on the team healthy who is a clear cut starter in the NBA.

You have a ton of middling, average, mixed talents. Some with upside, some with downsides.

Besides KP, who is the clear cut starters????

Fizz is just another stop gap coach. He sucks there is no system no plan.

So True .. Fiz is just another front-office puppet-coach without a system or defensive plan.
All the different starter lineup changes in 24 games has not got players on the same-page.

Glad someone seems to know. Yes this guy is Perry’s puppet and Perry scares me as a no talent GM. Who is know to give up on the wrong up and coming players. Oladipo and Harris are prime examples. This what he is doing to Ntlikina and this going to be disastrous mistake. As for Fizz he has no system so any player of Ntlikina’s ilk is going to struggle. He isn’t a street baller. Usually street ballers don’t play well in systems. And system players don’t play well in street ball. Ntlikina needs structure and Fiz has no structure. Street ball fans will be happy with Fizz but winning is about system.

What does a gm that has talent do? Do they take over a dysfunctional team and make it less functional? Do they take pennies on the dollar in every trade they make? Do they give out the worst contract in professional sports and two of the worst contracts in the NBA? Do they have lots of enemies in other front offices? Do they specialize in a lack of roster continuity? Do they alienate and almost trade star players because of exit meetings? Are they hard to reach when other league execs are interested in doing deals with them? Do they force their coaches to use an antiquated system? Do they fall asleep during pre-draft workouts? Do they leave town to attend a retirement ceremony when there is a. college tournament in their building and the team they built is in the lottery again? Do they have to master the accidental tank and in the process give out horrendous, cap killing contracts and make bad trades?
Talk about a gm having a puppet coach, what was Jeff? What happened to DFish when he wasn't a puppet?
The Knicks are being run like an NBA team now. Thank god Dolan had the sense to move on from Phil right after he signed his extension. I couldn't be more disappointed in Phil and the job he did. The guy was given autonomy and just wanted to cash a check and prove what a great system the triangle was. No room to say Perry sucks. The Knicks had the worst. Phil set the benchmark. Imagine a front office doing an exhaustive coaching search and hiring the most sought after candidate. That didn't happen with Phil. To be qualified to work for Phil you had to agree to run the triangle, be a yes man and allow Phil to interfere and hold workshops with your team.

I fell asleep half way through your post.

Vmart wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

Vmart wrote:

Kemet wrote:

Vmart wrote:

franco12 wrote:I don't understand some people here.

Fiz is the best coach we've had since Riley.

Full stop.

He is trying to win games, and I think also trying to figure out which players should be part of the long term future here.

I don't think there is one player right now on the team healthy who is a clear cut starter in the NBA.

You have a ton of middling, average, mixed talents. Some with upside, some with downsides.

Besides KP, who is the clear cut starters????

Fizz is just another stop gap coach. He sucks there is no system no plan.

So True .. Fiz is just another front-office puppet-coach without a system or defensive plan.
All the different starter lineup changes in 24 games has not got players on the same-page.

Glad someone seems to know. Yes this guy is Perry’s puppet and Perry scares me as a no talent GM. Who is know to give up on the wrong up and coming players. Oladipo and Harris are prime examples. This what he is doing to Ntlikina and this going to be disastrous mistake. As for Fizz he has no system so any player of Ntlikina’s ilk is going to struggle. He isn’t a street baller. Usually street ballers don’t play well in systems. And system players don’t play well in street ball. Ntlikina needs structure and Fiz has no structure. Street ball fans will be happy with Fizz but winning is about system.

What does a gm that has talent do? Do they take over a dysfunctional team and make it less functional? Do they take pennies on the dollar in every trade they make? Do they give out the worst contract in professional sports and two of the worst contracts in the NBA? Do they have lots of enemies in other front offices? Do they specialize in a lack of roster continuity? Do they alienate and almost trade star players because of exit meetings? Are they hard to reach when other league execs are interested in doing deals with them? Do they force their coaches to use an antiquated system? Do they fall asleep during pre-draft workouts? Do they leave town to attend a retirement ceremony when there is a. college tournament in their building and the team they built is in the lottery again? Do they have to master the accidental tank and in the process give out horrendous, cap killing contracts and make bad trades?
Talk about a gm having a puppet coach, what was Jeff? What happened to DFish when he wasn't a puppet?
The Knicks are being run like an NBA team now. Thank god Dolan had the sense to move on from Phil right after he signed his extension. I couldn't be more disappointed in Phil and the job he did. The guy was given autonomy and just wanted to cash a check and prove what a great system the triangle was. No room to say Perry sucks. The Knicks had the worst. Phil set the benchmark. Imagine a front office doing an exhaustive coaching search and hiring the most sought after candidate. That didn't happen with Phil. To be qualified to work for Phil you had to agree to run the triangle, be a yes man and allow Phil to interfere and hold workshops with your team.

I fell asleep half way through your post.

Of course you did....it doesn't fit your agenda!

Chandler wrote:

franco12 wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Anyone that thinks this year is about lineups, should stick to watching cricket.

Fiz has done a great job giving EVERYONE a look and fair shake thus far. He has done so and stayed competitive. Lets see the armchair geniuses suggest better lineups. For those mad that Frank is sitting, guess you were not listening at the beginning of the year when he said he will roll the ball out and let the best players play. What kind of respect would he have if he now changed the rules!!

Thank you. As I posted earlier- what is our record with KP? We're probably 500 or just a smidge over.

Add KD, and we're in first.

I love Fiz- I think he has done a great job of getting guys to overachieve.

What clear cut starter has he benched?

Before you fall too deeply in love consider the stats.

The team is playing worse on offense (passing and shooting) than last year (even though Fizz is rooted as a pg). We are dead last as a team in most passing stats. Mudiay is shooting better but passing worse (fewer assist more TOs). Yes he can look good here and there but he's averaging 3 assists and 2 TO a game roughly -- egads. that's our savior, our best passer? and he's not developing as a passer --he's regressing

More embarassing, we're far worse on defense (when Hornacek coached! let that sink in) This is so, even though this year we have Dot, Vonleh, and Mitch bring significantly more defensive energy than some of their predecessors

It's easy to like Fizz's passion (I do at least); and it's easy to see a lot of players playing hard for him (that's great). I am actually pulling for him, but that's because I'm a fan not because of the evidence in front of us.
the evidence suggests some very concerning aspects -- much more than lineups

His old GM said he couldn't close games; and we've seen that -- hopefully things improve

He alienated his best player in Memphis; Fizz said he learned from that, but KP has already called BS on him in a tweet, and Frank is probably not sending him any XMAS cards this year. ANd no, this isn't complaining about losing a starting role; i get that; Mud is playing better. This is about retarded DNPs when they could have used Frank's defense at least situationally (e.g., against Beale and the like) reinforcing and building Frank's confidence as a defensive stopper if nothing else. (How many games are we going to lose with THJ guarding the opponents best wing to end a game). And yes, I still think Fizz intended to humiliate Frank by gluing Frank to pine after 6 minutes when Frank did what coach wanted him to do --- attack the paint (albeit Frank could have done that better).

Whether it's KP or Frank, players have choices. The retreads will come here because we'll pay them. If we don't get some semblance of a system, culture, and real accountability the good guys are going to walk or find a way to force a trade.

You mention the only 3 players we have which can defend outside Frank.
Non of them is a starter in NBA yet.
In fact this team has no starting caliber players. Kanter and Timmy are close but not on contender team and both are bad defensibly.
This team can win only if they play even worth team or team which fall asleep.
This roster is not even 20% ready for competing.
What you trying to evaluate?

arkrud wrote:

Chandler wrote:

franco12 wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:Anyone that thinks this year is about lineups, should stick to watching cricket.

Fiz has done a great job giving EVERYONE a look and fair shake thus far. He has done so and stayed competitive. Lets see the armchair geniuses suggest better lineups. For those mad that Frank is sitting, guess you were not listening at the beginning of the year when he said he will roll the ball out and let the best players play. What kind of respect would he have if he now changed the rules!!

Thank you. As I posted earlier- what is our record with KP? We're probably 500 or just a smidge over.

Add KD, and we're in first.

I love Fiz- I think he has done a great job of getting guys to overachieve.

What clear cut starter has he benched?

Before you fall too deeply in love consider the stats.

The team is playing worse on offense (passing and shooting) than last year (even though Fizz is rooted as a pg). We are dead last as a team in most passing stats. Mudiay is shooting better but passing worse (fewer assist more TOs). Yes he can look good here and there but he's averaging 3 assists and 2 TO a game roughly -- egads. that's our savior, our best passer? and he's not developing as a passer --he's regressing

More embarassing, we're far worse on defense (when Hornacek coached! let that sink in) This is so, even though this year we have Dot, Vonleh, and Mitch bring significantly more defensive energy than some of their predecessors

It's easy to like Fizz's passion (I do at least); and it's easy to see a lot of players playing hard for him (that's great). I am actually pulling for him, but that's because I'm a fan not because of the evidence in front of us.
the evidence suggests some very concerning aspects -- much more than lineups

His old GM said he couldn't close games; and we've seen that -- hopefully things improve

He alienated his best player in Memphis; Fizz said he learned from that, but KP has already called BS on him in a tweet, and Frank is probably not sending him any XMAS cards this year. ANd no, this isn't complaining about losing a starting role; i get that; Mud is playing better. This is about retarded DNPs when they could have used Frank's defense at least situationally (e.g., against Beale and the like) reinforcing and building Frank's confidence as a defensive stopper if nothing else. (How many games are we going to lose with THJ guarding the opponents best wing to end a game). And yes, I still think Fizz intended to humiliate Frank by gluing Frank to pine after 6 minutes when Frank did what coach wanted him to do --- attack the paint (albeit Frank could have done that better).

Whether it's KP or Frank, players have choices. The retreads will come here because we'll pay them. If we don't get some semblance of a system, culture, and real accountability the good guys are going to walk or find a way to force a trade.

You mention the only 3 players we have which can defend outside Frank.
Non of them is a starter in NBA yet.
In fact this team has no starting caliber players. Kanter and Timmy are close but not on contender team and both are bad defensibly.
This team can win only if they play even worth team or team which fall asleep.
This roster is not even 20% ready for competing.
What you trying to evaluate?

the same was true last year except for the time we had KP. We're doing far worse as a team. Our passing has regressed hugely (not something that KP padded numbers)

our defense has regressed even though we have some good defenders.