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No more Kurt Thomas nor Anderson please......
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fishmike
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9/9/2004  3:52 PM
me neither... Big Z is a plodder. He's a good player but a plodder. Either we are a fast team or we arent. Lets get guys who can thrive in transition and are fast. One guy that isnt is ok, 2-3 guys kills your team speed.
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Bonn1997
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9/9/2004  4:53 PM
Posted by fishmike:

me neither... Big Z is a plodder. He's a good player but a plodder. Either we are a fast team or we arent. Lets get guys who can thrive in transition and are fast. One guy that isnt is ok, 2-3 guys kills your team speed.
I'd rather keep TT and KT. A center like Big Z isn't that important that I'd give up someone as young, athletic, and still improving player like TT
technomaster
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9/9/2004  5:02 PM
I was thinking about our lineup--- and what KT has to offer us. Imagine our team w/o Kurt. We'd have ONLY Nazr and Baker at center--- okay folks, I guess Sundov is also an option. :) Very scary.

KT and Sweetney might very well be our best two PF/C's... and it'd be imperative to have them on the floor for solid minutes. Baker strikes me as a flimsy player... and Nazr, while capable of putting up good numbers, doesn't have a complete game (yet). Maybe he'll be a late bloomer and do what Dale Davis did for Indiana.

“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
TMS
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9/9/2004  5:59 PM
Posted by fishmike:

me neither... Big Z is a plodder. He's a good player but a plodder. Either we are a fast team or we arent. Lets get guys who can thrive in transition and are fast. One guy that isnt is ok, 2-3 guys kills your team speed.

i realize we need to get athletic, but we also need a legitimate C as well who can score in the post, block shots, rebound & work in the pick & roll...& Isiah could really work some things having that expiring contract to work with at the trade deadline.

Bonn, for someone who supports the idea of the high value of expiring deals as much as you do, i would have thought you would have liked this idea.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Bonn1997
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9/9/2004  6:57 PM
Posted by TMS:
Posted by fishmike:

me neither... Big Z is a plodder. He's a good player but a plodder. Either we are a fast team or we arent. Lets get guys who can thrive in transition and are fast. One guy that isnt is ok, 2-3 guys kills your team speed.

i realize we need to get athletic, but we also need a legitimate C as well who can score in the post, block shots, rebound & work in the pick & roll...& Isiah could really work some things having that expiring contract to work with at the trade deadline.

Bonn, for someone who supports the idea of the high value of expiring deals as much as you do, i would have thought you would have liked this idea.
You're giving up TT. His expiring contract in ten months will be pretty comparable to big Z's now.
crzymdups
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9/9/2004  10:56 PM
Posted by Bonn1997:
Posted by TMS:
Posted by fishmike:

me neither... Big Z is a plodder. He's a good player but a plodder. Either we are a fast team or we arent. Lets get guys who can thrive in transition and are fast. One guy that isnt is ok, 2-3 guys kills your team speed.

i realize we need to get athletic, but we also need a legitimate C as well who can score in the post, block shots, rebound & work in the pick & roll...& Isiah could really work some things having that expiring contract to work with at the trade deadline.

Bonn, for someone who supports the idea of the high value of expiring deals as much as you do, i would have thought you would have liked this idea.
You're giving up TT. His expiring contract in ten months will be pretty comparable to big Z's now.

The idea is to build a team. Tim Thomas fits much better with Marbury than Z does. If Thomas REALLY doesn't work, he'll be an expiry next year. Zydrunas would be wasted on this team.
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technomaster
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9/10/2004  5:38 AM
Well... you get the best players you can and try to make it work. The Knicks overall weren't a very talented club last year. We're still at the stage where we're trying to get some high quality talent together.

I think finding the right talent (stars) is the first priority. Once you've decided who your go-to-guys are, then you throw in your role players.

Ilgauskas is clearly one of the dominant centers in the NBA today and for people to say he wouldn't be a good fit for this team is kind of silly. The Knicks' identity is still evolving. We still kind of have the same issues as last year at this time--- too many softies, too many undersized big men, too many players that play the same position. Some call it depth, others call it too many average players.

Ilgauskas is a top-3 offensive center who causes major mismatches on the floor. That's a good thing. There are few players who can stop him one-on-one. Maybe he doesn't fit the vision of a fast, athletic, running team... but playoffs usually come down to half-court execution anyway. Having a dependable big man makes things a lot easier.
“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
franco12
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9/10/2004  9:26 AM
Kurt couldn't even guard Kenyon Martin

Not many people can guard Kenyon.

but we also need a legitimate C as well who can score in the post, block shots, rebound & work in the pick & roll

This is what every team but Miami and San Antonio need.

And as far as all this talk of Sweetney and Ariza- Ariza is an unknown and I hope definitely takes playing time before Shandon. Sweetney is a second year player who showed promise last year and excelled in the summer leagues. HE COULD STILL BE A BUST.

Yes, he should get the playing time he warrents from both a performance standpoint and developmental standpoint.

But Kurt is the only big on this team that can work the pick and roll with Marbury and I am sure Crawford. When Sweetney can hit the 15 ftr with regularity, he will probably take more and more minutes away from Kurt.

And, the pick and roll makes Marbury better because teams have to honor Kurt's outside shot and that frees up Marbury for penetration.

Kurt Thomas is like an old chevy- he ain't pretty, but he gets you there.
bernard
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9/10/2004  9:34 AM
I like KT at center too. Look on the OT Center Rankings thread. There are only 3 or 4 low post threats at C in the game today. Shaq, Yao, Ilgau and maybe McGloire. I'm not sure who on our team will do better against these guys than KT, and I like the way he'll draw them from the basket w/ his jumper, which is excellent and underrated from 12 - 17 ft. I don't think Nazr or Vinnie is Knicks future any more than KT, and IMO KT will help us more today.

I don't want to trade KT and TT for Ilgau. We don't need a scoring center as much as a defensive threat.
TMS
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9/13/2004  12:36 PM
you guys keep saying you want a pick & roll player, someone who can play in the low post, someone who can block shots...Ilgauskas is alot better in all phases than KT is...the only thing KT does that's better is he's a good 1 on 1 defender in the low post against guys who are bigger than he is but slow...he gets abused by guys like K-Mart who run the floor as well as guys who can shoot from the perimeter...hell, even Mo Taylor abused him twice last year...i don't think i need to point out how Ilgauskas did against us last year either.

TT is a nice complementary player to Stephon, but the expiring contract of Ilgauskas will have alot more value this year than TT's will have next year, simply because quality C's are alot harder to attain.
After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
diderotn
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9/14/2004  10:50 AM
I am hoping that you are all wrong about Kurt Thomas as our Center. I hope that Lenny and Isiah are not as dumb as the most of us to infiltrate Kurt in that position at the expense of either Naser, Sundov, or Vinny. There comes a time in an organization, where the GM has to evaluate and eliminate pieces that are good, but not fit into the philosophy that is being preached. Sometimes, you have to lose some to gain some. That is why guys like Houstons, Kurt, and Anderson are now obsolete to our organization.
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No more Kurt Thomas nor Anderson please......
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