newyorknewyork wrote:I mean if we had our 2014 lotto pick with a shot at Lavine or a trade down like Denver did to land Nurkic and Harris. As well as our 2016 draft pick with that chance to draft Sabonis or Prince. All together with our lotto pick of Frank this past draft.

We would be in better position going forward then we are today. We are behind most teams in terms of adding cost controlled young talent to build a core with due to to not having 2 out of our last 4 lotto picks.

We are finally out of that hole but are 2 yrs behind. Harris & Prince or Sabonis with KP & Frank would completely change the dynamic of this teams future while not counting the cap space that would be allocated differently.

Completely agree. Adding Harris and Prince for example would be amazing. It sucks but at least we are trending up.

Knixkik wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:I mean if we had our 2014 lotto pick with a shot at Lavine or a trade down like Denver did to land Nurkic and Harris. As well as our 2016 draft pick with that chance to draft Sabonis or Prince. All together with our lotto pick of Frank this past draft.

We would be in better position going forward then we are today. We are behind most teams in terms of adding cost controlled young talent to build a core with due to to not having 2 out of our last 4 lotto picks.

We are finally out of that hole but are 2 yrs behind. Harris & Prince or Sabonis with KP & Frank would completely change the dynamic of this teams future while not counting the cap space that would be allocated differently.

Completely agree. Adding Harris and Prince for example would be amazing. It sucks but at least we are trending up.

Agreed. I hope Perry will be able to upgrade this team with the kind of Live Bodies we need. Aside from the PG spot this team also needs SF n PF with Length, Athletic Ability. Guys that can create their own offense and get out n run, finish above the rim. The lack of that type of talent is crystal clear when we play a team like the Lakers or even the Grizz. Perry’s gotta upgrade this roster.

Knixkik wrote:

nixluva wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

newyorknewyork wrote:I mean if we had our 2014 lotto pick with a shot at Lavine or a trade down like Denver did to land Nurkic and Harris. As well as our 2016 draft pick with that chance to draft Sabonis or Prince. All together with our lotto pick of Frank this past draft.

We would be in better position going forward then we are today. We are behind most teams in terms of adding cost controlled young talent to build a core with due to to not having 2 out of our last 4 lotto picks.

We are finally out of that hole but are 2 yrs behind. Harris & Prince or Sabonis with KP & Frank would completely change the dynamic of this teams future while not counting the cap space that would be allocated differently.

Completely agree. Adding Harris and Prince for example would be amazing. It sucks but at least we are trending up.

Agreed. I hope Perry will be able to upgrade this team with the kind of Live Bodies we need. Aside from the PG spot this team also needs SF n PF with Length, Athletic Ability. Guys that can create their own offense and get out n run, finish above the rim. The lack of that type of talent is crystal clear when we play a team like the Lakers or even the Grizz. Perry’s gotta upgrade this roster.

The good thing is with a high 1st round pick and 2 high 2nd round picks, this is the year we have an opportunity to really build up the young talent pool a bit.

After KP we lack any real athletic length from the SF/PF spot. Hardaway starts at SF, with Dougie & Lance manning the backup SF mins. Beasley taking the backup PF spot. All while most teams have been collecting those athletic forward type athletes. We are behind in this area and get smacked around at this spot. And we lack elite fundamentals like boxing out etc to make up for it. For a team that lacks a lot of athleticism. We also make some of the most boneheaded plays at all 5 positions.

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knixkik wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knixkik wrote:You think Frank is a 2nd round talent? Wow.

Yep. Right now he is playing like a guy that could have been taken in the second round..Dillon Brooks, Jordan Bell, Frank Mason. And not as good as some others taken in late 1st round...Kuzma. Btw shooting 34/30% wont even keep him in the league.

But okay, what stats have shown him to be a first round pick? We can keep wishing ait nd pointing out obscure defensive stats, but if we are going to be real, he has not been what everyone expected after a losing year.

I am hoping he turns into a start as much as the next guy, But tired of the lost that keep ignoring reality.

You listed a bunch of guys 4 years older than him. Classic overreaction.

Good point. So let me ask you something. IF NO ONE knows what a 19 year old will turn out to be, why make him your lottery pick? And does him being 19 guarantee that he wont turn out to be just a role player?

Duh

HofstraBBall wrote:

franco12 wrote:

martin wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

martin wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:It's only going to work for Frank if he has the right development process, and we don't.

Oh yeah? Please do tell us all what you know about this Knicks’ development process and how Franks doing within it.

This I want to hear

I really don't have to say anything, all you have to do is look at the results. When i see young players getting better under the knicks management..Then i'll say different. But when i see players regress, making the same mistakes over and over. Not putting the correct roster, system doesn't cater to the player..

I don’t even know what that means.

I don't want to talk for him. But I think I share a level of concern about what we are doing to develop players.

And I think exhibit A is KP. He's developed a lot of bad habits - those have been documented.

Me, simple is he says he is tired, and then we continue to play him over 30 minutes in games, even in blow outs.

KP is young, doesn't have the physical or mental stamina. Sure, we need him *to win. But we need him more to become a championship team.

And I think we're trying too hard to win this year, and not doing enough to develop players.

This may shed some light on the development skills of the NY Knicks in the last 20 tears :

Dontae' Jones : Developed to sell hot dogs
John Thomas : Developed to be released.
DeMarco Johnson : Developed to sell hair products.
Sean Marks : Developed to join the marketing team.
Frédéric Weis : Developed to become an alcoholic.
J. R. Koch : Dunno anything on him. Mayors Son?
Donnell Harvey : Developed to sell womens underwear
Lavor Postell : Developed use the bathroom on his own.
Michael Wright : Developed Wrong not Wright
Eric Chenowith : Did not make it to the opening dinner at training camp
Nenê : Well developed...by the Nuggets
Miloš Vujanić : Developed to play in Hungary company league
Michael Sweetney : Developed to clean bathrooms back at Georgetown.
Maciej Lampe : Developed to teach French
Slavko Vraneš :Developed to help liberate Yugoslavia
Trevor Ariza : Developed by Houston
Channing Frye : Developed by Phoenix
David Lee+ : Developed by GS
Dijon Thompson : Developed to sell mustard
Renaldo Balkman : Develped to not break his leg.
Mardy Collins : Missing
Wilson Chandler : Under achieved
Danilo Gallinari : Still trying to get on the court.
Jordan Hill : 7 foot flop
Andy Rautins : Balding and coaching girl basketball
Landry Fields : Developed to shoot with two hands
Iman Shumpert : Developed to be released for nothing
Kostas Papanikolaou : Missing
Tim Hardaway, Jr. : Developed by the Hawks G league
Cleanthony Early : Developed to carry a hand gun.
Thanasis Antetokounmpo : Developed to start his brother fan club
Kristaps Porziņģis : Developed......by Melo.

TBD:
Frank Ntilikina
Damyean Dotson

The fruits never fall far from the tree...

StarksEwing1 wrote:

Knixkik wrote:You think Frank is a 2nd round talent? Wow.

Yeah thats a pretty insane statement

Can't fix stupid. Is not even worth trying

meloshouldgo wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

Knixkik wrote:You think Frank is a 2nd round talent? Wow.

Yeah thats a pretty insane statement

Can't fix stupid. Is not even worth trying

Ah the biggest case of lost on the boards. Thanks for the input Eraser boy. Thats only the 37th time you used that line. You must kill it with your class mates in middle school.

Why not just try to show off your Bball IQ? Lets see why the the all knowing thinks Franks play has been lottery like?

Seriously, I think Mills and Perry have done a great job of pulling together a decent team and trust them to make the right decisions at the trade deadline. Perry is the real deal and is showing that he has a good eye for finding good players on cheap contracts. I will note that the Tim Hardaway signing that we all bemoaned, including myself, has actually turned out to look like a pretty good deal. If Hardaway's current production is his new normal production, then he is probably going to be considered underpaid by year 2 of his deal. Bottomline, I trust this current management group to make sound decisions and look forward to seeing the results.

HofstraBBall wrote:

Welpee wrote:

HofstraBBall wrote:

Knixkik wrote:You think Frank is a 2nd round talent? Wow.

Yep. Right now he is playing like a guy that could have been taken in the second round..Dillon Brooks, Jordan Bell, Frank Mason. And not as good as some others taken in late 1st round...Kuzma. Btw shooting 34/30% wont even keep him in the league.

But okay, what stats have shown him to be a first round pick? We can keep wishing ait nd pointing out obscure defensive stats, but if we are going to be real, he has not been what everyone expected after a losing year.

I am hoping he turns into a start as much as the next guy, But tired of the lost that keep ignoring reality.

Do you not at least concede that making determinations about a rookie based on 1/2 of his first season is illogical?

Is it more important how a guy develops over the next three/four years or over his first three/four months? Is this not irrational? Ironically, based on your logic and the stats of the first 1/2 of their rookie seasons, the Bucks should've traded Tim Hardaway Jr. instead of the Greek Freak.

Do you think anyone in Milwaukee cares that Giannis Antetokounmpo (based on your logic) played like a 2nd round talent as a rookie because his stats were comparable to Ray McCallum, Nate Wolters and Ryan Kelly who were taken in the 2nd round in 2013?

Did I say he will never play again? Or that the Knicks should release him? Trade him? I have been consistent. You cant give up on him and I would not trade him this early. I am saying he has not played like an 8th pick thus far. Some guys just cant handle that.

What people don't seem to get is every player is different. Evaluating Frank 1/2 way into his rookie season is kinda ridiculous. The most logical thing to say at this point of this career is that he has a ways to go to reach the potential the Knicks evidently saw in him and there's nothing wrong with that. OJ Mayo got off to a statistically good start to his career. How'd that turn out? Not saying the same will happen to Mitchell or DSJ, but that's a perfect example of why folks need to slow down on all of these guys.

Nalod wrote:Based not the past, should the knicks never draft again?

Based on the past you shouldn't pin your hopes on it.

The rockets weren't good at either thats why theys said fck it, lets make the right trades and sign the right FA, and hire the right coach, who's system matches our talent.

nyknickzingis wrote:We need a way to play faster more 3 point shots off
Hof is taking shots at the Triangle
But what we have run most of this year is far worse than the Triangle
Not enough spacing
Not enough 3 point looks

I can't blame Frank or any PG until we run a better spaced offense where there are more opportunities for players to get good open shots

Frank will find players if they get open ... problem is Jeff has been running an offense that is built around KP and Kanter setting screens up high and then posting up. If we were gonna run the offense through bigs should have kept the Triangle. At least there was spacing and when you posted up s big like KP or Kanter would always know where the spot up guys and cutters were.

I've seen the triangle form from time to time. They at times still use that for spacing.

We aren't a team that kicks the ball out from the paint to much looking for the 3. We do it from time to time but its not a focus. Some teams make that a primary focus to get that 3 off.