knicks1248 wrote:Willy is not playing better than anyone on the roster, and to me minutes are earned. I'm not sure why he hasn't been working on a perimeter game since DAY 1, knowing that's a big part of NBA offenses, it's all about space and pace.

HE didn't see significant minutes when KP didn't play, and he didn't look good in the extensive garbage minutes against the KINGS. IMO, he has a long way to go, and I'm sure his confidence has taken a hit since the benching. the best thing for him to do is keep working hard everyday at expanding his game, and be a good cheer leader/teammate, and let the chip fall where they may

martin wrote:

Finestrg wrote:Willy's gotta play, bottom line. As soon as he starts playing regularly and contributing, you won't hear a word about how soft he's playing -- dude can score and rebound. As good as O'Quinn's looked in the early going, I'd rather see Willy get those mins.

Quickly on Kanter -- I'm starting to wonder if they're suppressing him on purpose in order to keep his eventual cost down. Maybe Jeff's getting word from topside to do that.. He's got the rest of this year and then a player option next year for over $18m I believe. Maybe they do know what he's capable of doing offensively, they like him & wanna keep him, but want him at their price. Otherwise, I continue to see a problem with Kanter not getting enough touches on the offensive end. Only thing I can think of that's even remotely plausible.

Bottom line, Knicks are winning, and within an offense and defense that seems to be working for them. Why mess with that because of some perceived slights?

When does reality kick in? You don't play guys just because you want them to get minutes or more shots.

KOQ is actually playing well and within his role at 16 minutes, 2-way player who spaces the floor out to about 20 feet, averaging 14.5 points, 13 rebounds, 2.5 blocks and an ungodly 5 assists at a rate of 36 minutes... and you want to cut his minutes in favor of Willy? Or did you mean to cut Kanter's minutes in favor of Willy? Or perhaps sit KP some extra time for Willy?

This is a real head scratcher for me

Scratch away my friend, that's just how I see it. Not too long ago (a matter of mere weeks actually--days even), people were saying how if they redid the 2015 draft, Willy would've been a surefire 1st round pick, maybe even crack the lottery. Now people are saying he's soft and can't play?!? I don't believe that at all, definitely believe the former point made, however, that he would've been a 1st rounder if they did that draft over. There's no doubt about that to me.. Not saying I don't like KOQ or appreciate what he's doing -- I do, believe me, and I do agree with you somewhat on not ruining a good thing and the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' mentality -- but in the end of the day, I just feel Willy's too skilled to just shelf and forget about him the way there doing. Up to me, I'd sell high on KOQ asap and fast track/develop Willy.

And while we're at it -- another disagreement I have with most around here: LeBron's right, as hard as it is to hear from that friggin' diva: we should've taken DSJ over Frank this summer. Not a knock on this poor kid Frank at all--he's a Knick and I will always root like hell for anyone who wears our uniform (and I don't hate him by any means--he's a talent but just seems far off to me; DSJ can help and play at a much higher level right now at the same young age--that's all that goes into the evaluation/comparison for me), and F LeBron too btw--I definitely don't want 'Bron anymore, that ship sailed for me--he can go F himself, he's a guy I wanna see us go through now, and I LOVE the way KP and Enes grabbed his back, that's awesome (can't stress that enough--nice job fellas!!!), but again, end of the day how I see it, YES, we should've taken DSJ ahead of Frank. No doubt in my mind. I mean come on--to not even work that kid out, a talent like that AND we needed a PG??? Just a dinner with Phil?? UTTERLY MINDBOGGLING...That wasn't handled right at all by a guy who upper Knick brass was already prob. 95% sure they wanted to **** can at the time. He never should've been allowed to draft anyone. They can all say otherwise all they want (and they have to say they wanted Frank), but I'm almost 100% that if it were up to Perry/Mills with no PJ, Smith would've been a Knick. And I'm not Monday morning quarterbacking here -- I've said this since draft night.

fishmike wrote:

Finestrg wrote:

martin wrote:

Finestrg wrote:Willy's gotta play, bottom line. As soon as he starts playing regularly and contributing, you won't hear a word about how soft he's playing -- dude can score and rebound. As good as O'Quinn's looked in the early going, I'd rather see Willy get those mins.

Quickly on Kanter -- I'm starting to wonder if they're suppressing him on purpose in order to keep his eventual cost down. Maybe Jeff's getting word from topside to do that.. He's got the rest of this year and then a player option next year for over $18m I believe. Maybe they do know what he's capable of doing offensively, they like him & wanna keep him, but want him at their price. Otherwise, I continue to see a problem with Kanter not getting enough touches on the offensive end. Only thing I can think of that's even remotely plausible.

Bottom line, Knicks are winning, and within an offense and defense that seems to be working for them. Why mess with that because of some perceived slights?

When does reality kick in? You don't play guys just because you want them to get minutes or more shots.

KOQ is actually playing well and within his role at 16 minutes, 2-way player who spaces the floor out to about 20 feet, averaging 14.5 points, 13 rebounds, 2.5 blocks and an ungodly 5 assists at a rate of 36 minutes... and you want to cut his minutes in favor of Willy? Or did you mean to cut Kanter's minutes in favor of Willy? Or perhaps sit KP some extra time for Willy?

This is a real head scratcher for me

Scratch away my friend, that's just how I see it. Not too long ago (a matter of mere weeks actually--days even), people were saying how if they redid the 2015 draft, Willy would've been a surefire 1st round pick, maybe even crack the lottery. Now people are saying he's soft and can't play?!? I don't believe that at all, definitely believe the former point made, however, that he would've been a 1st rounder if they did that draft over. There's no doubt about that to me.. Not saying I don't like KOQ or appreciate what he's doing -- I do, believe me, and I do agree with you somewhat on not ruining a good thing and the 'if it ain't broke don't fix it' mentality -- but in the end of the day, I just feel Willy's too skilled to just shelf and forget about him the way there doing. Up to me, I'd sell high on KOQ asap and fast track/develop Willy.

And while we're at it -- another disagreement I have with most around here: LeBron's right, as hard as it is to hear from that friggin' diva: we should've taken DSJ over Frank this summer. Not a knock on this poor kid Frank at all--he's a Knick and I will always root like hell for anyone who wears our uniform (and I don't hate him by any means--he's a talent but just seems far off to me; DSJ can help and play at a much higher level right now at the same young age--that's all that goes into the evaluation/comparison for me), and F LeBron too btw--I definitely don't want 'Bron anymore, that ship sailed for me--he can go F himself, he's a guy I wanna see us go through now, and I LOVE the way KP and Enes grabbed his back, that's awesome (can't stress that enough--nice job fellas!!!), but again, end of the day how I see it, YES, we should've taken DSJ ahead of Frank. No doubt in my mind. I mean come on--to not even work that kid out, a talent like that AND we needed a PG??? Just a dinner with Phil?? UTTERLY MINDBOGGLING...That wasn't handled right at all by a guy who upper Knick brass was already prob. 95% sure they wanted to **** can at the time. He never should've been allowed to draft anyone. They can all say otherwise all they want (and they have to say they wanted Frank), but I'm almost 100% that if it were up to Perry/Mills with no PJ, Smith would've been a Knick.

What was your expectation for the Knicks? The guy wasnt sharing his medical records with the Knicks and didnt give them a workout. Just draft him anyway? Do you watch the games? What looks better? KP playing next to ball dominant players or KP playing with PGs who get him the ball in spots to score? At the time of the draft there were just as many reasons to pass on DSjr than take him.
1) rep for not playing defense
2) rep for not improving teammates
3) came from losing NCAA program
4) coming off a knee reconstruction
5) held medical records from Knicks and didnt work out for them

Meanwhile Frank was playing meaningful minutes while his team went for a title. I liked DSjr as a prospect, but there were plenty of reasons to pass on him over one of the others. Could have easily been Monk or Mitchell. All had warts.

Not so much with Willy. He looks heavier and not in a good way.

GustavBahler wrote:Willy would be going up against players who are even faster than the 5s he's use to, his lateral movement isn't great.

If have no doubt that Willy can put up good numbers in a hurry. The question the Knicks have to find an answer to, is will that encourage Willy to find a place where he has a better chance of starting? Getting more minutes?

Some of this will be sorted out when Perry decides what to do with Kanter. Do the Knicks let Willy leave in free agency for a larger role on a another team, or do they pay him starter money to come off the bench?

If Willy is still showing he can put up double-doubles in short order, thats what its probably going to take to keep him. Until his defense takes a big step forward, I dont see any other role than backup.

IDK if the Knicks will be able to afford to keep him. Might make sense to explore other options, like a trade for more of a two-way player before Willy's deal expires.

Bonn1997 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Willy is not playing better than anyone on the roster, and to me minutes are earned. I'm not sure why he hasn't been working on a perimeter game since DAY 1, knowing that's a big part of NBA offenses, it's all about space and pace.

HE didn't see significant minutes when KP didn't play, and he didn't look good in the extensive garbage minutes against the KINGS. IMO, he has a long way to go, and I'm sure his confidence has taken a hit since the benching. the best thing for him to do is keep working hard everyday at expanding his game, and be a good cheer leader/teammate, and let the chip fall where they may

It's hard to know what he worked on. We've only seen him for a handful of minutes.

Exactly.