StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Knicks are 4 games out of the 8th seed in the playoffs.

They're 2 games out of having the 4th pick in the draft.

I do hope Phil makes a trade at the deadline that signals to Melo that we are rebuilding. I don't think he'll be able to trade Melo, but I hope he can trade Rose or something to signal the lack of playoffs is the plan at this point.

Phil rebuilds every yr, the only difference is that this yr we have a pick, but as long as phils here we will rebuild every off season until he's gone..Melo was well aware of this

You know there's a difference in retooling and rebuilding!!! This time we want a REBUILD. The benefits of tanking vs trying to make a playoff push are immense and for some reason you seem incapable of accepting the positives of shipping out older vets that have not led to wins this year. Why continue this course at this point?

These vets had a fair chance to buy in and show they deserve to stay and they failed. Time to move on and try a different approach.

exactly. Im tired of quick fixes that fail. For 16 years we did that and ended up in worse shape. Its time to build through the draft

Phil said he will never build through the draft, but he contradicts himself every other month so who knows.. Tomorrow him and melo might have dinner and talk about what FA they can get this yr.

None of us have the slightest idea what phil is thinking, neither does phil

knicks1248 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Knicks are 4 games out of the 8th seed in the playoffs.

They're 2 games out of having the 4th pick in the draft.

I do hope Phil makes a trade at the deadline that signals to Melo that we are rebuilding. I don't think he'll be able to trade Melo, but I hope he can trade Rose or something to signal the lack of playoffs is the plan at this point.

Phil rebuilds every yr, the only difference is that this yr we have a pick, but as long as phils here we will rebuild every off season until he's gone..Melo was well aware of this

You know there's a difference in retooling and rebuilding!!! This time we want a REBUILD. The benefits of tanking vs trying to make a playoff push are immense and for some reason you seem incapable of accepting the positives of shipping out older vets that have not led to wins this year. Why continue this course at this point?

These vets had a fair chance to buy in and show they deserve to stay and they failed. Time to move on and try a different approach.

exactly. Im tired of quick fixes that fail. For 16 years we did that and ended up in worse shape. Its time to build through the draft

Phil said he will never build through the draft, but he contradicts himself every other month so who knows.. Tomorrow him and melo might have dinner and talk about what FA they can get this yr.

None of us have the slightest idea what phil is thinking, neither does phil

smackeddog wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Knicks are 4 games out of the 8th seed in the playoffs.

They're 2 games out of having the 4th pick in the draft.

I do hope Phil makes a trade at the deadline that signals to Melo that we are rebuilding. I don't think he'll be able to trade Melo, but I hope he can trade Rose or something to signal the lack of playoffs is the plan at this point.

Phil rebuilds every yr, the only difference is that this yr we have a pick, but as long as phils here we will rebuild every off season until he's gone..Melo was well aware of this

You know there's a difference in retooling and rebuilding!!! This time we want a REBUILD. The benefits of tanking vs trying to make a playoff push are immense and for some reason you seem incapable of accepting the positives of shipping out older vets that have not led to wins this year. Why continue this course at this point?

These vets had a fair chance to buy in and show they deserve to stay and they failed. Time to move on and try a different approach.

exactly. Im tired of quick fixes that fail. For 16 years we did that and ended up in worse shape. Its time to build through the draft

Phil said he will never build through the draft, but he contradicts himself every other month so who knows.. Tomorrow him and melo might have dinner and talk about what FA they can get this yr.

None of us have the slightest idea what phil is thinking, neither does phil

You're completely makes no stuff up now. He has never said that

smackeddog wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Knicks are 4 games out of the 8th seed in the playoffs.

They're 2 games out of having the 4th pick in the draft.

I do hope Phil makes a trade at the deadline that signals to Melo that we are rebuilding. I don't think he'll be able to trade Melo, but I hope he can trade Rose or something to signal the lack of playoffs is the plan at this point.

Phil rebuilds every yr, the only difference is that this yr we have a pick, but as long as phils here we will rebuild every off season until he's gone..Melo was well aware of this

You know there's a difference in retooling and rebuilding!!! This time we want a REBUILD. The benefits of tanking vs trying to make a playoff push are immense and for some reason you seem incapable of accepting the positives of shipping out older vets that have not led to wins this year. Why continue this course at this point?

These vets had a fair chance to buy in and show they deserve to stay and they failed. Time to move on and try a different approach.

exactly. Im tired of quick fixes that fail. For 16 years we did that and ended up in worse shape. Its time to build through the draft

Phil said he will never build through the draft, but he contradicts himself every other month so who knows.. Tomorrow him and melo might have dinner and talk about what FA they can get this yr.

None of us have the slightest idea what phil is thinking, neither does phil

You're completely makes no stuff up now. He has never said that

Like most knowledgeable basketball men he knows you can't have ONLY KIDS on your roster if you want to win a Title but that's not saying you should never rebuild.

Phil said he wanted a FUTURE component to this team and he's kept that approach this entire time.

CrushAlot wrote:Once a game starts I want them to win. I can see the benefit of getting a good draft pick but it was really hard to watch that 17 win team.

It's ok to trade 2-3 years of stink for 10 years of good. Heck we've had 14/15 years of stink without trying to stink

BRIGGS wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Once a game starts I want them to win. I can see the benefit of getting a good draft pick but it was really hard to watch that 17 win team.

It's ok to trade 2-3 years of stink for 10 years of good. Heck we've had 14/15 years of stink without trying to stink

Thats the cruel irony! We lost for 14/15 years because we were trying to avoid losing for 2 or 3 years

knicks1248 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Knicks are 4 games out of the 8th seed in the playoffs.

They're 2 games out of having the 4th pick in the draft.

I do hope Phil makes a trade at the deadline that signals to Melo that we are rebuilding. I don't think he'll be able to trade Melo, but I hope he can trade Rose or something to signal the lack of playoffs is the plan at this point.

Phil rebuilds every yr, the only difference is that this yr we have a pick, but as long as phils here we will rebuild every off season until he's gone..Melo was well aware of this

You know there's a difference in retooling and rebuilding!!! This time we want a REBUILD. The benefits of tanking vs trying to make a playoff push are immense and for some reason you seem incapable of accepting the positives of shipping out older vets that have not led to wins this year. Why continue this course at this point?

These vets had a fair chance to buy in and show they deserve to stay and they failed. Time to move on and try a different approach.

exactly. Im tired of quick fixes that fail. For 16 years we did that and ended up in worse shape. Its time to build through the draft

Phil said he will never build through the draft, but he contradicts himself every other month so who knows.. Tomorrow him and melo might have dinner and talk about what FA they can get this yr.

None of us have the slightest idea what phil is thinking, neither does phil

You're completely makes no stuff up now. He has never said that

Like most knowledgeable basketball men he knows you can't have ONLY KIDS on your roster if you want to win a Title but that's not saying you should never rebuild.

Phil said he wanted a FUTURE component to this team and he's kept that approach this entire time.

You don't have to tank or be a lottery team to build through the draft..

With the knicks (who have solid history of drafting well) if they don't trade the picks, they trade the player after a couple yrs. Almost every player we draft, regress in his second yr, and the losing becomes frustrating enough that you end up trading the guys you develop. Phil has been no different then walsh and I T.

Early, Grant, Willy, KP are his picks in three drafts. THJ was before. Yes, he traded him.
Early didn't pan out and his gunshot did set him back even more. THJ got him Grant, Grant was not what he thought.

Your casting a wide net over the concept that Phil is the same as all before him. Last Nite we had two players in the rising stars challenge. Did that not translate to you at all? How many picks did the Knicks have consecutively in the past? Im not gonna look it up, but I think we know the history.

So while you want to connect every dot and somehow think that Phil is the problem, it should be noted that:
He has yet to sacrifice the future and trade picks.
If he should not be in charge, what makes you think some magical shaman will somehow change things either? A different GM gets better trades for Felton, Tyson, Shump and JR? Prove it. You can't. You have the benefit of hindsight to say Melo and the NTC, but what else that clearly would have the team is much better shape? Keeping THJ? CLee is better. Keeping Ropez? Are you not happy with KOQ and Willy getting open minutes? Noah's contract sucks. I agree, but not a franchise killer. Grant the answer at pt? We had a full look at a former MVP at a small price. Not terrible, and we have him, or cap space. All our no. 1 picks forward.

Phil has battered and abused Melo by saying he is trying hard to play team ball, doing some things really well, but is a ball stopper. Oh, what an awful abusive situation!! And he said "Posse" relative to his Bromantic friend!!!! What an awful environment to work in!!!!!!

“We’re still trying to find that connection between us, where we know exactly where the guy’s going to be,’’ Porzingis said before the World squad beat the U.S., 150-141, on Friday in the Rising Stars Challenge. Porzingis scored 24 points and grabbed 10 rebounds in 33 minutes. “I’ve been trying to roll to the basket more. That’s another adjustment for the guards. I’m not always at the 3-point line. We have to get a really good feel for each other. That doesn’t happen overnight. We’re still trying to work on that.’’

It's a system that's old, and more than anything, it take a yr or 2 or 3, to really master it, so when you bring in 10 new guys every yr, and a new coach, there's just no way their going to get it. When the ball goes to melo, no one cuts hard consistently, it's like they give up and watch melo do his thing.

Draft picks

The bottom line is David Lee, Hill, Shumpert, Nate, Douglas, gallo, chandler, ariza, mosgov, Grant, 10 yrs worth of picks that amounted to jack sht as far as win/losses record..I mean really man, it's sad.

smackeddog wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Listen, as long as the triangle is the system we run, players will struggle A LOT. just today I'm reading KP saying they still haven't figure it out.

“We’re still trying to find that connection between us, where we know exactly where the guy’s going to be,’’ Porzingis said before the World squad beat the U.S., 150-141, on Friday in the Rising Stars Challenge. Porzingis scored 24 points and grabbed 10 rebounds in 33 minutes. “I’ve been trying to roll to the basket more. That’s another adjustment for the guards. I’m not always at the 3-point line. We have to get a really good feel for each other. That doesn’t happen overnight. We’re still trying to work on that.’’

It's a system that's old, and more than anything, it take a yr or 2 or 3, to really master it, so when you bring in 10 new guys every yr, and a new coach, there's just no way their going to get it. When the ball goes to melo, no one cuts hard consistently, it's like they give up and watch melo do his thing.

Draft picks

The bottom line is David Lee, Hill, Shumpert, Nate, Douglas, gallo, chandler, ariza, mosgov, Grant, 10 yrs worth of picks that amounted to jack sht as far as win/losses record..I mean really man, it's sad.

He wasn't talking about the triangle, read the whole article. He was talking about the lack of chemistry between players, he said he loved the triangle, and then made some comments about how this years team (i.e. Rose) don't understand it as well, which is why they've had to abandon it most of the time.

Indeed, Porzingis would like a better feel for Rose’s game.

“We’re still trying to find that connection between us, where we know exactly where the guy’s going to be,’’ Porzingis said before the World squad beat the U.S., 150-141, on Friday in the Rising Stars Challenge. Porzingis scored 24 points and grabbed 10 rebounds in 33 minutes. “I’ve been trying to roll to the basket more. That’s another adjustment for the guards. I’m not always at the 3-point line. We have to get a really good feel for each other. That doesn’t happen overnight. We’re still trying to work on that.’’

See the key line you missed out?

“We don’t really know it as well as we did last year,’’ Porzingis admitted. “We played it the whole time. We knew it much better than this year. For the triangle to really work, everybody needs to be on the same page and know how to play it. I think we have a lot of places to grow as a team that plays triangle. I love the triangle. It’s a great offense if you execute it well. We’ve been going back and forth playing both.’’

Yeah it's crystal clear where the problem is. What I don't understand is the reluctance to accept that now is the time to stop doing the same old things this franchise has done and change up. It's the right time to rebuild.

We can all see that the younger players are actually executing the way the coaches want and it's guys like Rose and Melo that are playing selfish ball. Rose is the guy who had the best opportunity to be successful in NY if he simply bought in and looked for his teammates more. Melo I could tolerate but Rose being a PG that doesn't look for his teammates is unacceptable.

knicks1248 wrote:Listen, as long as the triangle is the system we run, players will struggle A LOT. just today I'm reading KP saying they still haven't figure it out.

“We’re still trying to find that connection between us, where we know exactly where the guy’s going to be,’’ Porzingis said before the World squad beat the U.S., 150-141, on Friday in the Rising Stars Challenge. Porzingis scored 24 points and grabbed 10 rebounds in 33 minutes. “I’ve been trying to roll to the basket more. That’s another adjustment for the guards. I’m not always at the 3-point line. We have to get a really good feel for each other. That doesn’t happen overnight. We’re still trying to work on that.’’

It's a system that's old, and more than anything, it take a yr or 2 or 3, to really master it, so when you bring in 10 new guys every yr, and a new coach, there's just no way their going to get it. When the ball goes to melo, no one cuts hard consistently, it's like they give up and watch melo do his thing.

Draft picks

The bottom line is David Lee, Hill, Shumpert, Nate, Douglas, gallo, chandler, ariza, mosgov, Grant, 10 yrs worth of picks that amounted to jack sht as far as win/losses record..I mean really man, it's sad.

THIS! The knicks need to play to win - nothing else is acceptable. They land where they land in the draft and you have to trust the scouting and good judgement of the organization.

Losing results in injuries and bad habits. The NBA is overflowing with good point guards. They have to go somewhere. We'll be fine. Draft for talent not position.