knicks1248 wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

martin wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

“What we felt was it was time. We felt Joakim wasn’t going to be a frontline guy anymore. I was pretty confident that Pau (Gasol) was going to leave. So it was important for us to get the center in (Robin) Lopez.”

4 y
This guy just signed wade and rondo, who are close to Rose level as far as (games missed) and has the nerve to point out Noah's status...As if he's won anything since MJ left

Truth be told, i hope this doesn't turned into a Amare/camby/Mcdyess/Rasheed Catastrophe the knicks are so famous for.

I would be happy with 2 boarder line all star years from Noah, good enough to attract another big name FA.

I'm not a fan of those signings but there's much less risk with a 2 year contract than a 4 year one.

Feel like that they are at worst on par with each other. Wade will be 35 and Noah 32 mid-season; Wade seems to base more of his talents on athleticism playing a position that demands it more. Also, at the tail end of Noah's contract there is no doubt in my mind that his role with the team would be diminished by the presence of KP playing same position.

I'm saying the risk (worst possible outcome) is worse in our case. The possible reward is also higher if Noah stays healthy and productive all 4 years.

If we had signed wade, phil would have been killed for signing a bunch of players with major health issues,but the way I see it, your a risk the minute you step on the field, court, as long as your playing sports, it's like a 99% chance of you getting some kind of injury.

so signing wade is the same risk as signing a younger healthier player? Injury history and/or age plays a big part in predicting future success.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Funny, Reinsdorf wanted him back before free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-bulls-want-to-re-sign-joakim-noah-rather-than-pau-gasol/

Though front-office meetings have yet to finalize the Bulls' Plan A for this offseason, there is strong internal desire to re-sign Noah on a short-term deal. Noah long has been a favorite player and ambassador of Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf. Executive vice president John Paxson drafted Noah, and their bond is genuine.

It will take work, not to mention money, to win back Noah, who disliked the false story Fred Hoiberg spread at the start of the season that he volunteered to come off the bench. He then disliked playing just 20 minutes per game and not finishing them more.

But Hoiberg had started to play Noah more before his first shoulder injury in December. And Noah remains invested enough in the team to question Jimmy Butler and Derrick Rose for their silence at the April 3 team meeting, according to several people present.

Noah is all in as a leader. The bulls just added Rondo. They also seemingly got rid of a ball dominant player to appease another guy that needs the ball in Butler. Why do you bring in Wade and Rondo if you are remaking the team? I wish he would have commented on that.

Great Points Crush!!! Butler and Rose supposedly didn't work because Butler also needed the ball. How's that supposed to work with Rondo and Wade? It may be fine but the reasons they put out early seem to contradict these things.

Rondo is a creator which Rose was definitely not. Rondo needs the ball but his primary goal is to get it to other players in scoring positions. And btw, I am not a Rondo fan but compared to Rose, he is a hottie.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Funny, Reinsdorf wanted him back before free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-bulls-want-to-re-sign-joakim-noah-rather-than-pau-gasol/

Though front-office meetings have yet to finalize the Bulls' Plan A for this offseason, there is strong internal desire to re-sign Noah on a short-term deal. Noah long has been a favorite player and ambassador of Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf. Executive vice president John Paxson drafted Noah, and their bond is genuine.

It will take work, not to mention money, to win back Noah, who disliked the false story Fred Hoiberg spread at the start of the season that he volunteered to come off the bench. He then disliked playing just 20 minutes per game and not finishing them more.

But Hoiberg had started to play Noah more before his first shoulder injury in December. And Noah remains invested enough in the team to question Jimmy Butler and Derrick Rose for their silence at the April 3 team meeting, according to several people present.

Noah is all in as a leader. The bulls just added Rondo. They also seemingly got rid of a ball dominant player to appease another guy that needs the ball in Butler. Why do you bring in Wade and Rondo if you are remaking the team? I wish he would have commented on that.

Great Points Crush!!! Butler and Rose supposedly didn't work because Butler also needed the ball. How's that supposed to work with Rondo and Wade? It may be fine but the reasons they put out early seem to contradict these things.

Rondo is a creator which Rose was definitely not. Rondo needs the ball but his primary goal is to get it to other players in scoring positions. And btw, I am not a Rondo fan but compared to Rose, he is a hottie.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Funny, Reinsdorf wanted him back before free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-bulls-want-to-re-sign-joakim-noah-rather-than-pau-gasol/

Though front-office meetings have yet to finalize the Bulls' Plan A for this offseason, there is strong internal desire to re-sign Noah on a short-term deal. Noah long has been a favorite player and ambassador of Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf. Executive vice president John Paxson drafted Noah, and their bond is genuine.

It will take work, not to mention money, to win back Noah, who disliked the false story Fred Hoiberg spread at the start of the season that he volunteered to come off the bench. He then disliked playing just 20 minutes per game and not finishing them more.

But Hoiberg had started to play Noah more before his first shoulder injury in December. And Noah remains invested enough in the team to question Jimmy Butler and Derrick Rose for their silence at the April 3 team meeting, according to several people present.

Noah is all in as a leader. The bulls just added Rondo. They also seemingly got rid of a ball dominant player to appease another guy that needs the ball in Butler. Why do you bring in Wade and Rondo if you are remaking the team? I wish he would have commented on that.

Great Points Crush!!! Butler and Rose supposedly didn't work because Butler also needed the ball. How's that supposed to work with Rondo and Wade? It may be fine but the reasons they put out early seem to contradict these things.

Rondo is a creator which Rose was definitely not. Rondo needs the ball but his primary goal is to get it to other players in scoring positions. And btw, I am not a Rondo fan but compared to Rose, he is a hottie.

My point is that neither Wade nor Butler are really Catch and Shoot guys. They want to handle the ball in order to get their shots off. So basically the same kind of issues can develop even with Rondo in the mix.

I think that wade and butler can both be catch and shoots guy. They just would like PG who is willing to pass. Wade is not that good of a long range shooter so he may do some of his own creating but that worked fine with lebron dominating the ball as much as anyone does.

Just so we're clear what a TRUE Catch and Shoot SG is, let's compare the Frequency of Catch and Shoot from Wade and Butler with Courtney Lee. Look at the differences in how they all score and you can see that it's not something we should expect that Wade and Butler will be comfortable doing.

Dwayne Wade 2015-16
	                                    Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	74	48	6.4%	0.4	1.0	42.1	45.4	5.1%	0.4	0.8	45.0	1.4%	0.1	0.2	31.3
Pull Ups	74	73	40.8%	2.3	6.5	34.8	35.0	38.5%	2.2	6.2	36.5	2.4%	0.0	0.4	7.1
Less than 10 ft	74	74	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	54.9	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        74	6	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	16.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Jimmy Butler 2015-16
                                      	   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	67	62	17.8%	0.9	2.8	34.2	44.3	5.7%	0.4	0.9	44.1	12.1%	0.6	1.9	29.6
Pull Ups	67	67	37.8%	2.1	5.8	36.3	39.5	30.5%	1.8	4.7	37.1	7.4%	0.4	1.1	32.9
Less than 10 ft	67	67	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	58.6	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        67	18	1.8%	0.1	0.3	36.8	42.1	1.4%	0.1	0.2	35.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	40.0
Courtney Lee 2015-16
	                                   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	79	75	40.5%	1.3	3.3	40.5	56.2	9.1%	0.3	0.7	41.4	31.5%	1.0	2.5	40.3
Pull Ups	79	74	30.2%	1.0	2.4	42.5	42.7	28.3%	1.0	2.3	44.8	1.9%	0.0	0.1	8.3
Less than 10 ft	79	69	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	56.9	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        79	5	0.9%	0.0	0.1	0.0	0.0	0.3%	0.0	0.0	0.0	0.6%	0.0	0.1	0.0

Further Lee's usage was only 15% and Wade's was 31.5% and Butler's 24.5%.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Funny, Reinsdorf wanted him back before free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-bulls-want-to-re-sign-joakim-noah-rather-than-pau-gasol/

Though front-office meetings have yet to finalize the Bulls' Plan A for this offseason, there is strong internal desire to re-sign Noah on a short-term deal. Noah long has been a favorite player and ambassador of Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf. Executive vice president John Paxson drafted Noah, and their bond is genuine.

It will take work, not to mention money, to win back Noah, who disliked the false story Fred Hoiberg spread at the start of the season that he volunteered to come off the bench. He then disliked playing just 20 minutes per game and not finishing them more.

But Hoiberg had started to play Noah more before his first shoulder injury in December. And Noah remains invested enough in the team to question Jimmy Butler and Derrick Rose for their silence at the April 3 team meeting, according to several people present.

Noah is all in as a leader. The bulls just added Rondo. They also seemingly got rid of a ball dominant player to appease another guy that needs the ball in Butler. Why do you bring in Wade and Rondo if you are remaking the team? I wish he would have commented on that.

Great Points Crush!!! Butler and Rose supposedly didn't work because Butler also needed the ball. How's that supposed to work with Rondo and Wade? It may be fine but the reasons they put out early seem to contradict these things.

Rondo is a creator which Rose was definitely not. Rondo needs the ball but his primary goal is to get it to other players in scoring positions. And btw, I am not a Rondo fan but compared to Rose, he is a hottie.

My point is that neither Wade nor Butler are really Catch and Shoot guys. They want to handle the ball in order to get their shots off. So basically the same kind of issues can develop even with Rondo in the mix.

I think that wade and butler can both be catch and shoots guy. They just would like PG who is willing to pass. Wade is not that good of a long range shooter so he may do some of his own creating but that worked fine with lebron dominating the ball as much as anyone does.

Just so we're clear what a TRUE Catch and Shoot SG is, let's compare the Frequency of Catch and Shoot from Wade and Butler with Courtney Lee. Look at the differences in how they all score and you can see that it's not something we should expect that Wade and Butler will be comfortable doing.

Dwayne Wade 2015-16
	                                    Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	74	48	6.4%	0.4	1.0	42.1	45.4	5.1%	0.4	0.8	45.0	1.4%	0.1	0.2	31.3
Pull Ups	74	73	40.8%	2.3	6.5	34.8	35.0	38.5%	2.2	6.2	36.5	2.4%	0.0	0.4	7.1
Less than 10 ft	74	74	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	54.9	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        74	6	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	16.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Jimmy Butler 2015-16
                                      	   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	67	62	17.8%	0.9	2.8	34.2	44.3	5.7%	0.4	0.9	44.1	12.1%	0.6	1.9	29.6
Pull Ups	67	67	37.8%	2.1	5.8	36.3	39.5	30.5%	1.8	4.7	37.1	7.4%	0.4	1.1	32.9
Less than 10 ft	67	67	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	58.6	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        67	18	1.8%	0.1	0.3	36.8	42.1	1.4%	0.1	0.2	35.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	40.0
Courtney Lee 2015-16
	                                   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	79	75	40.5%	1.3	3.3	40.5	56.2	9.1%	0.3	0.7	41.4	31.5%	1.0	2.5	40.3
Pull Ups	79	74	30.2%	1.0	2.4	42.5	42.7	28.3%	1.0	2.3	44.8	1.9%	0.0	0.1	8.3
Less than 10 ft	79	69	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	56.9	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        79	5	0.9%	0.0	0.1	0.0	0.0	0.3%	0.0	0.0	0.0	0.6%	0.0	0.1	0.0

Further Lee's usage was only 15% and Wade's was 31.5% and Butler's 24.5%.

wait! those number were not with rondo and why are we just talking about catch and shoot? How about all other assisted scoring opps?

We're talking about HOW these guys actually play the game. You are acting like the way they play isn't well established already. We're talking about Catch and Shoot because only one of them is gonna have the ball and the other guys are not Catch and Shoot guys. They will have to change how they play in order to make it work. Rondo and Wade aren't likely to change at this point and Butler is pretty set as well. You can't really ignore the way these guys prefer to play the game and what their strengths are. Their strength is not Catch and Shoot.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Funny, Reinsdorf wanted him back before free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-bulls-want-to-re-sign-joakim-noah-rather-than-pau-gasol/

Though front-office meetings have yet to finalize the Bulls' Plan A for this offseason, there is strong internal desire to re-sign Noah on a short-term deal. Noah long has been a favorite player and ambassador of Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf. Executive vice president John Paxson drafted Noah, and their bond is genuine.

It will take work, not to mention money, to win back Noah, who disliked the false story Fred Hoiberg spread at the start of the season that he volunteered to come off the bench. He then disliked playing just 20 minutes per game and not finishing them more.

But Hoiberg had started to play Noah more before his first shoulder injury in December. And Noah remains invested enough in the team to question Jimmy Butler and Derrick Rose for their silence at the April 3 team meeting, according to several people present.

Noah is all in as a leader. The bulls just added Rondo. They also seemingly got rid of a ball dominant player to appease another guy that needs the ball in Butler. Why do you bring in Wade and Rondo if you are remaking the team? I wish he would have commented on that.

Great Points Crush!!! Butler and Rose supposedly didn't work because Butler also needed the ball. How's that supposed to work with Rondo and Wade? It may be fine but the reasons they put out early seem to contradict these things.

Rondo is a creator which Rose was definitely not. Rondo needs the ball but his primary goal is to get it to other players in scoring positions. And btw, I am not a Rondo fan but compared to Rose, he is a hottie.

My point is that neither Wade nor Butler are really Catch and Shoot guys. They want to handle the ball in order to get their shots off. So basically the same kind of issues can develop even with Rondo in the mix.

I think that wade and butler can both be catch and shoots guy. They just would like PG who is willing to pass. Wade is not that good of a long range shooter so he may do some of his own creating but that worked fine with lebron dominating the ball as much as anyone does.

Just so we're clear what a TRUE Catch and Shoot SG is, let's compare the Frequency of Catch and Shoot from Wade and Butler with Courtney Lee. Look at the differences in how they all score and you can see that it's not something we should expect that Wade and Butler will be comfortable doing.

Dwayne Wade 2015-16
	                                    Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	74	48	6.4%	0.4	1.0	42.1	45.4	5.1%	0.4	0.8	45.0	1.4%	0.1	0.2	31.3
Pull Ups	74	73	40.8%	2.3	6.5	34.8	35.0	38.5%	2.2	6.2	36.5	2.4%	0.0	0.4	7.1
Less than 10 ft	74	74	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	54.9	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        74	6	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	16.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Jimmy Butler 2015-16
                                      	   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	67	62	17.8%	0.9	2.8	34.2	44.3	5.7%	0.4	0.9	44.1	12.1%	0.6	1.9	29.6
Pull Ups	67	67	37.8%	2.1	5.8	36.3	39.5	30.5%	1.8	4.7	37.1	7.4%	0.4	1.1	32.9
Less than 10 ft	67	67	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	58.6	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        67	18	1.8%	0.1	0.3	36.8	42.1	1.4%	0.1	0.2	35.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	40.0
Courtney Lee 2015-16
	                                   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	79	75	40.5%	1.3	3.3	40.5	56.2	9.1%	0.3	0.7	41.4	31.5%	1.0	2.5	40.3
Pull Ups	79	74	30.2%	1.0	2.4	42.5	42.7	28.3%	1.0	2.3	44.8	1.9%	0.0	0.1	8.3
Less than 10 ft	79	69	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	56.9	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        79	5	0.9%	0.0	0.1	0.0	0.0	0.3%	0.0	0.0	0.0	0.6%	0.0	0.1	0.0

Further Lee's usage was only 15% and Wade's was 31.5% and Butler's 24.5%.

wait! those number were not with rondo and why are we just talking about catch and shoot? How about all other assisted scoring opps?

We're talking about HOW these guys actually play the game. You are acting like the way they play isn't well established already. We're talking about Catch and Shoot because only one of them is gonna have the ball and the other guys are not Catch and Shoot guys. They will have to change how they play in order to make it work. Rondo and Wade aren't likely to change at this point and Butler is pretty set as well. You can't really ignore the way these guys prefer to play the game and what their strengths are. Their strength is not Catch and Shoot.

again I ask ... how did wade play with one of the biggest ball dominators of all time? And win rings btw ...

was PP just a catch and shoot type player in Boston?

Ya know, you make some of the WORST arguments to support your points on this forum!!! First off, I could win a title playing with Lebron. Besides I'm not saying Wade isn't a great player in his career. Just pointing out that HOW Wade, Butler and Rondo play is MOSTLY with the ball in their hands. I showed their usage and low Catch and Shoot %. It's all pretty simple.

Compare how Noah with his passing fits with Melo, KP and Lee! Rose can push the ball and penetrate and Melo, KP and Lee can stretch the floor. It's a much more natural fit.

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

mreinman wrote:

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

crzymdups wrote:Funny, Reinsdorf wanted him back before free agency.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/report-bulls-want-to-re-sign-joakim-noah-rather-than-pau-gasol/

Though front-office meetings have yet to finalize the Bulls' Plan A for this offseason, there is strong internal desire to re-sign Noah on a short-term deal. Noah long has been a favorite player and ambassador of Chairman Jerry Reinsdorf. Executive vice president John Paxson drafted Noah, and their bond is genuine.

It will take work, not to mention money, to win back Noah, who disliked the false story Fred Hoiberg spread at the start of the season that he volunteered to come off the bench. He then disliked playing just 20 minutes per game and not finishing them more.

But Hoiberg had started to play Noah more before his first shoulder injury in December. And Noah remains invested enough in the team to question Jimmy Butler and Derrick Rose for their silence at the April 3 team meeting, according to several people present.

Noah is all in as a leader. The bulls just added Rondo. They also seemingly got rid of a ball dominant player to appease another guy that needs the ball in Butler. Why do you bring in Wade and Rondo if you are remaking the team? I wish he would have commented on that.

Great Points Crush!!! Butler and Rose supposedly didn't work because Butler also needed the ball. How's that supposed to work with Rondo and Wade? It may be fine but the reasons they put out early seem to contradict these things.

Rondo is a creator which Rose was definitely not. Rondo needs the ball but his primary goal is to get it to other players in scoring positions. And btw, I am not a Rondo fan but compared to Rose, he is a hottie.

My point is that neither Wade nor Butler are really Catch and Shoot guys. They want to handle the ball in order to get their shots off. So basically the same kind of issues can develop even with Rondo in the mix.

I think that wade and butler can both be catch and shoots guy. They just would like PG who is willing to pass. Wade is not that good of a long range shooter so he may do some of his own creating but that worked fine with lebron dominating the ball as much as anyone does.

Just so we're clear what a TRUE Catch and Shoot SG is, let's compare the Frequency of Catch and Shoot from Wade and Butler with Courtney Lee. Look at the differences in how they all score and you can see that it's not something we should expect that Wade and Butler will be comfortable doing.

Dwayne Wade 2015-16
	                                    Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	74	48	6.4%	0.4	1.0	42.1	45.4	5.1%	0.4	0.8	45.0	1.4%	0.1	0.2	31.3
Pull Ups	74	73	40.8%	2.3	6.5	34.8	35.0	38.5%	2.2	6.2	36.5	2.4%	0.0	0.4	7.1
Less than 10 ft	74	74	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	54.9	52.2%	4.6	8.3	54.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        74	6	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	16.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	16.7	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Jimmy Butler 2015-16
                                      	   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	67	62	17.8%	0.9	2.8	34.2	44.3	5.7%	0.4	0.9	44.1	12.1%	0.6	1.9	29.6
Pull Ups	67	67	37.8%	2.1	5.8	36.3	39.5	30.5%	1.8	4.7	37.1	7.4%	0.4	1.1	32.9
Less than 10 ft	67	67	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	58.6	42.6%	3.9	6.6	58.6	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        67	18	1.8%	0.1	0.3	36.8	42.1	1.4%	0.1	0.2	35.7	0.5%	0.0	0.1	40.0
Courtney Lee 2015-16
	                                   Field Goals	                    2 Point Field Goals	            3 Point Field Goals
General Range	GP	G	Freq	FGM	FGA	FG%	eFG%	Freq	2FGM	2FGA	2FG%	Freq	3PM	3PA	3P%
Catch and Shoot	79	75	40.5%	1.3	3.3	40.5	56.2	9.1%	0.3	0.7	41.4	31.5%	1.0	2.5	40.3
Pull Ups	79	74	30.2%	1.0	2.4	42.5	42.7	28.3%	1.0	2.3	44.8	1.9%	0.0	0.1	8.3
Less than 10 ft	79	69	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	56.9	28.3%	1.3	2.3	56.9	0.0%	0.0	0.0	-
Other	        79	5	0.9%	0.0	0.1	0.0	0.0	0.3%	0.0	0.0	0.0	0.6%	0.0	0.1	0.0

Further Lee's usage was only 15% and Wade's was 31.5% and Butler's 24.5%.

wait! those number were not with rondo and why are we just talking about catch and shoot? How about all other assisted scoring opps?

We're talking about HOW these guys actually play the game. You are acting like the way they play isn't well established already. We're talking about Catch and Shoot because only one of them is gonna have the ball and the other guys are not Catch and Shoot guys. They will have to change how they play in order to make it work. Rondo and Wade aren't likely to change at this point and Butler is pretty set as well. You can't really ignore the way these guys prefer to play the game and what their strengths are. Their strength is not Catch and Shoot.

again I ask ... how did wade play with one of the biggest ball dominators of all time? And win rings btw ...

was PP just a catch and shoot type player in Boston?

Ya know, you make some of the WORST arguments to support your points on this forum!!! First off, I could win a title playing with Lebron. Besides I'm not saying Wade isn't a great player in his career. Just pointing out that HOW Wade, Butler and Rondo play is MOSTLY with the ball in their hands. I showed their usage and low Catch and Shoot %. It's all pretty simple.

Compare how Noah with his passing fits with Melo, KP and Lee! Rose can push the ball and penetrate and Melo, KP and Lee can stretch the floor. It's a much more natural fit.

So you either have the ball in your hands or you catch and shoot? GTFOH.

Do you predict that Rose will have a better season in NY than Rondo will in Chicago?

No spin ... I will pull a fishmike, a) Yes b) No

Now back to Rondo, Wade and Butler, all high usage Guards, that aren't really big 3pt shooters or catch and shoot guys so you are limiting them if they aren't handling the ball as much. They don't make sense together basketball wise.

Here's a great breakdown of exactly what i'm talking about when it comes to the issues with Wade, Rondo and Butler.

GustavBahler wrote:

nixluva wrote:

GustavBahler wrote:

fishmike wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

“What we felt was it was time. We felt Joakim wasn’t going to be a frontline guy anymore. I was pretty confident that Pau (Gasol) was going to leave. So it was important for us to get the center in (Robin) Lopez.”

This guy just signed wade and rondo, who are close to Rose level as far as (games missed) and has the nerve to point out Noah's status...As if he's won anything since MJ left

Truth be told, i hope this doesn't turned into a Amare/camby/Mcdyess/Rasheed Catastrophe the knicks are so famous for.

I would be happy with 2 boarder line all star years from Noah, good enough to attract another big name FA.

Of all the risks Noah is the biggest in that regard, however there is a big difference and that is the role we are asking Noah to play here. Amare/McDyess were brought in to be alpha players and cornerstones. They were supposed to be the leaders on the court. Even with his large salary Noah is 100% a role player. He's the 5th scoring option in the starting lineup. He will certainly be relied on to defend the post and facilitate on offense. Ideally Noah is healthy and a big contributor for most of the year. If he isn't and we get half a season from him it would be great if he's healthy for a playoff run, but even if that doesn't happy losing Noah doesn't immediately mean the season is over. Losing McDyess mean the season was over in October.

I 100% understand why the Bulls would want to move away from Rose/Noah... plateau, get a different look, didn't want to financially commit, etc... but those are also very talented players and talent in the NBA is not easy to get. Knick fans certainly know that. Will Rondo/Wade/Lopez upgrade them from Rose/Noah/Gasol? Time will tell.

You make a good point about Noah's role on the Knicks vs the Bulls. Been posting what a big fan of Noah's Ive been since joining, but again it goes back to the length of the deal, while factoring in how that may or may not affect the quality of the team around KP down the road.

We've had many coaches in succession who threw caution to the wind when it came to keeping vets relatively healthy. I really hope Hornacek keeps the minutes of players with chronic injuries in check until a possible playoff run. Its what did in the 54 win season, dont want to see a repeat of that.

I believe Rondo respects Wade enough not to throw a wrench in the works if he doesn't get his way. Wade has more rings, more cred. Im guessing that if Wade has another strong season the Bulls will do well. Would be fun to meet them in the playoffs.

The Knicks Medical and Training Staff actually did a good job last year in terms of keeping players relatively healthy.

Tweet was deleted or there was problem with the URL:

https://twitter.com/ManGamesLostNBA/status/721121153750851584

There are your Knicks, solidly in the bottom half of the league in man-games lost to injury.

But if I may apply causation to correlation here, I reckon New York's new-ish training staff had something to do with that chart up there. Phil Jackson shifted and added some personnel (junior, not the doctors) before the 2015-2016 season, and the organization's habits seemed to change in step. We saw way fewer vague post-game injury reports, way more sudden rest days and players annoyed with the trainers. Annoying players is a good thing! Constant appraisal of "healthy" players' statuses isn't new, but the doctors' level of influence -- a coaching staff basically beholden to their recommendations -- felt unprecedented for the Knicks. And -- again, thanks in part to luck -- it paid off:

http://www.postingandtoasting.com/2016/7/3/12077630/knicks-medical-staff-joakim-noah-eric-gordon-derrick-rose

Glad to hear that the medical/training staff are getting their act together. I remember Phil wanted to do something about this not longer after he was hired, but Dolan put the kibosh on any changes. Hornacek might have some ideas he picked up from the legendary Phoenix medical/training staff.

I was referring more to putting an emphasis on the PT of some vets at the expense of some younger players. Want the starters to have something left in the tank by the end of the regular season.

I think Hornacek is going to make good use of the bench. He's talked about keeping his older vets fresh and I think we'll see some good things from the younger players on this team. Hornacek will make things easy for them with a less complicated offense. He'll use some Triangle but I don't think it's going to use all of the complicated rules that players have to try and remember.