Nalod wrote:

ChuckBuck wrote:Some of my best Knicks memories were with Ewing in a Knicks uniform, flaws and choke jobs and all. Dude had the Knicks in the playoffs seemingly every single year, no matter the roster composition. Some so called superstars like Melo can't even will his team to the playoffs in a bad Eastern conference.

He was a homegrown Knick, first overall pick, had those big truck like kicks "Ewings", played on the Dream Team, went to war against the greatest bigs in his era, and never complained or bitched about any injuries he played through. Sure, he wasn't the greatest passer out of the double team. Sure, he took like 8 steps on his signature drop step move. Sure, he came up short in the clutch at times, especially that finger roll against Indiana that he should've dunked.

The fact remains, he was our greatest Knick player not named Clyde, so I'll forever salute him.

Do you include Melo in all conversations in all facets of your life?

Prototypical jilted fanboy disorder. The truly dedicated can obviously become the most psychotic anti-fan.

Nothing as terrible as a groupie scorned. I just wonder what the actual tipping point was. Or maybe I don't.
I mean, I know some still hold onto the Mardy Collins incident, but that can't apply in this case.

Mrs. ChuckBuck: Oh, you welcome!
Chuck: Seems like you put a lot of nice stuff in it!

Mrs Chuckbuck: Oh, glad you noticed
Chuck: Tastes great! But not as good as before Melo got here!

Mrs. ChuckBuck: Really?
Chuck: Sorry. Hey, is that a new dress you have on?

Mrs. ChuckBuck: Oh, that's sweet, I have had it a few years. Looks good with my new earings?
Chuck: Looked better when Melo was a free agent, could have gotten that dress for less!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: We need to go back to counseling?
Chuck: Maybe. Can we make love later?

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Oh, so you can compare me to Melo? how much better it was before we got melo?
Chuck: Naw baby, its been good all along.

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Meh.
Chuck: Oh, Oh, really? When was it better, If ever???? Tell me!!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Oh, you know, that guy who put up 50pts TWO NITES IN A ROW!
Chuck: Oh, that's cold baby!!!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Oh, I thought you'd be happy?
Chuck: really?

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Yeah, after all honey, Bernard was BEFORE MELO?
Chuck: I love you!!!!!

dk7th wrote:

Nalod wrote:Not in full agreement with Newells opinion as its hard to really measure. I mean, Ewing didn't go to see pete, so im sure he thinks he could have helped.

Really, Ewing had a history of not fully endearing himself to fans or the front office. He kind of pulled some Lebron type dyck moves. Im not even saying it was his fault but he did "Insist" knicks not rebuild and perhaps drove trades to suit his stats (I have read such things). For example he rejected Nellie because he'd get less touches on a running team. He forced Van Gundy on Knicks as well. That created the clash with JVG who catered to Ewing, with Earnie grunfeld who also wanted to go uptempo. Earnie build a run and gun team and when Ewing broke his wrist, he became untradeable. Ewing had some good stretch's of play, but the team had moved on. This is as much the knicks fault as Ewings, but its the root of the conflict in my opinion. Other than hire him as head coach, Knicks really have not been disrespectful.

Reality was fans loved him and Knicks were scared to move him earlier.
He was a warrior and a hard worker who promised us chips because its what NBA players say, and im sure he als believed. He would play hurt, which is cool, but also would not tell the team and thus he fell short. Why finger roll? Because his shoulder was burning in pain. Does it matter? I don't know.

Maybe if he was not coaching and just basking in the limelight doing other things Knicks could have bought him more into the fold. I admire his coaching ambition as he does not need the money, and from what I read he has been good with his money, and yes I wish he would get a head gig somewhere. Makes little sense to have bought him back prior. We have had other HOF players and HOF coach's fail to succeed here in that time. Patrick has not shown enough to be promoted on 29 other teams. Knicks did offer him the Dleague which he turned down. Greater men have paid higher dues. Not sure that was a good move for him, but that was his call.

Revisionist history and retro thinking is usually a nice thought, but execution is another story.
His number is retired and he is in the HOF. His ending legacy he has admitted was on him and he is on record as regretting how it ended with the knicks. Sometimes what drives us to greatness is what prevents our graceful end. Big ego is a necessary component for many to succeed.
He is loved by his fans and respected by the knicks organization to a reasonable extent. To what degree? Well, that's subjective. The more you love him, the more you want him to bring all kinds of winning promise if he returned to coach. Would fans be happier if he did coach, but then was fired? Would he have the good sense to know when to walk away? Or, would he eventually create "Another" bad departure?

The Knicks had thoughts of trading Ewing as early as May of 1991:

http://www.nytimes.com/1991/05/02/sports/basketball-is-age-of-ewing-ending-for-knicks.html?pagewanted=all

Wow, I can't recall that article but it was pretty insightful. I suppose when Riley got to NY Ewing bought in to what could be.

mreinman wrote:

ESOMKnicks wrote:

mreinman wrote:some players are just not loved. It could be their personality or their on court persona. For me, my only issue with him was that he was a horrible and unwilling passer.

That is a criticism often levied at him, and during his playing days i subscribed to this same popular view. But now looking at old game film and his stats in retrospect i realize that this view is simply not supported by facts.

and what are your facts to refute this criticism?

Old game film and his stats

ChuckBuck wrote:

Nalod wrote:Mrs. ChuckBuck: Dinner is on the table!
Chuck: Looks great Hon, thx!

Mrs. ChuckBuck: Oh, you welcome!
Chuck: Seems like you put a lot of nice stuff in it!

Mrs Chuckbuck: Oh, glad you noticed
Chuck: Tastes great! But not as good as before Melo got here!

Mrs. ChuckBuck: Really?
Chuck: Sorry. Hey, is that a new dress you have on?

Mrs. ChuckBuck: Oh, that's sweet, I have had it a few years. Looks good with my new earings?
Chuck: Looked better when Melo was a free agent, could have gotten that dress for less!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: We need to go back to counseling?
Chuck: Maybe. Can we make love later?

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Oh, so you can compare me to Melo? how much better it was before we got melo?
Chuck: Naw baby, its been good all along.

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Meh.
Chuck: Oh, Oh, really? When was it better, If ever???? Tell me!!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Oh, you know, that guy who put up 50pts TWO NITES IN A ROW!
Chuck: Oh, that's cold baby!!!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Oh, I thought you'd be happy?
Chuck: really?

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Yeah, after all honey, Bernard was BEFORE MELO?
Chuck: I love you!!!!!

Mrs. Chuckbuck: Honey, I heard on the news the Knicks somehow traded Melo for draft p..
Chuck: I LOVE YOU! Let's phuck!

Chuckbuck alarm clock goes off.
Mrs. Chuckbuck: hey douchebag, wake up, you're gonna miss the bus again!
Chuck: *waking up, rubbing **** out of his eyes* what the....
Mrs. Chuckbuck: Great, you had another Melotrade wetdream again! Clean your own gaddam sheets!

jrodmc wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:I miss Patrick. Happy bday to him.

It's a shame his HOF career was tainted by the Melo signing.

I also think this franchise misses Allan Houston. You know my user name is named after him. I bet you didn't know that. Boy it sure would be great to have both Allan and Patrick back on this very team. We'd be championship material.

dk7th wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:I miss Patrick. Happy bday to him.

It's a shame his HOF career was tainted by the Melo signing.

I also think this franchise misses Allan Houston. You know my user name is named after him. I bet you didn't know that. Boy it sure would be great to have both Allan and Patrick back on this very team. We'd be championship material.

he sucked as a knick. 50 million per knee. shame on you.

Oh my bad. Sorry to dissapoint you. I'll change my username is dk7thIsSoooCute.

Allanfan20 wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

Allanfan20 wrote:I miss Patrick. Happy bday to him.

It's a shame his HOF career was tainted by the Melo signing.

I also think this franchise misses Allan Houston. You know my user name is named after him. I bet you didn't know that. Boy it sure would be great to have both Allan and Patrick back on this very team. We'd be championship material.

Yeah, definitely! Patrick could be the lead public relations guy and Allan could teach everyone (except Melo, of course; Hey Chuckie! Hows that Summertimehate going?) that great, pointless jab-step move! 82-0 & foh-foh-foh-foh, here we'd come! Nobody could evaporate in a second half like H20! One of the GOAT's!

Wow, "Allanfan20"! You even worked in his old number! That's really great! Did they retire that one yet? I bet you'll know when that happens.