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WaltLongmire
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7/15/2016  12:19 PM
With the overused caveat "if healthy," I see a pretty interesting roster that seems to be capable of adapting to and matching up with most team styles in the league.

I'm looking at the entire roster...not just the starting 5, though.

Seem to have a good balance of power, athleticism, length, and speed.

We have two "go to" players in Melo and Rose (I expect that Jennings might also see himself as this kind of player), and hopefully KP develops into one this year.

Mix and match...seems that Honacek will have a lot of tools in his toolbox.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
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WaltLongmire
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7/15/2016  12:48 PM
Cartman718 wrote:
crzymdups wrote:
ActionJackson wrote:
fishmike wrote:Good post Eny.

nice blend of two alpha scorers surrounded by 3 defensive guys will high end skill sets.

Let us not forget the huge strides Melo made in the Defense department last season. If Lee is guarding the top of the key and Melo is holding down the wing with Porzingis & Noah cleaning up mistakes at the rim, this could be a very good defensive squad.

Not to mention the potential for KP to become a very deadly third scoring option.


Also, DRose, KP, Jennings, and Sasha are all already working out together in LA!

"Killer workout with my Knicks" - Go Jennings Go!


Good to see guys getting together already.

The relationship between Rose/Jennings and KP is a particularly important dynamic for the upcoming season...glad to see that they are already hanging out.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
Moonangie
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7/15/2016  1:04 PM
EnySpree wrote:On paper, the Knicks have a perfectly balanced starting 5.

Everything starts with your point guard. Derrick Rose pushes the ball and can't be guarded one on one regardless if he's lost a step or not. He's an adequate passer and a nba caliber defender. He's been upgraded to a decent 3pt shooter.

If you have a high use, scoring pg... you need a back court mate that is steady, can do it all but doesn't require the ball to be effective. That's Courtney Lee. He's a solid defender and he can shoot at a high percentage from 3. He has respectable take moves and can finish at the rim or short range. He can facilitate as well as spread the floor.

With that type of back court you need a big that can receive the ball and score in a variety of spots on the court. That's Kristaps. He can post up, pick and roll, pick and pop, run the floor, spot up, face up... he's going to clean up from the activity in the backcourt.

Since Kristap will be generating alot of attention, he's going to need a center to help him with rebounding and rim protection. That's Noah. Noah is also a great passer. He has great court awareness so he's going to fill lanes and be involved all over the court. He doesn't need shots but is dangerous all over the court with his ability to facilitate.

The Knicks have all bases covered. You can always use extra help inside. Extra rebounder, extra scorer. You will always need extra shooters too from the outside. Since we have a scoring point guard and offensive minded power fwd you'll need an extra passer. A small fwd that can play in any style. Plus you will always need a closer to make bad shots when you need them. That's Melo....

Health is a concern but I want to focus on the instant potential for this team to gel... it's incredible.

Our bench needs to have a hungry mix of players. Brandon Jennings wanted to be a Knick for 7 years. Willy is excited to play in nyc with his "brother". Our Lithuanian import dreamed is to play in the nba and has been trying to get in for years. Holiday is eager to make a significant impact in a rotation. Lance goal is to leave the Knicks a winner...

This is a fantastic mix we have here. It's not about kool-aid or homerism. Being realistic doesn't always have to be negative

Great post Eny. Totally agree. Balance, cap flexibility intact, no draft picks wasted. It's a new day in NYC.
Chandler
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7/15/2016  1:17 PM
good post and agree with earlier posts that the team is positioned well. If people gel and stay healthy could be real good; if not we have flexibility going forward

serious question: who get's the last shot with this team? It's always bugged me with Melo bc IMO he just doesn't have that killer instinct in the last seconds

who will be our Paul Pierce? See some promise for that in KP but not sure if it's too soon

(5)(7)
Sangfroid
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7/15/2016  1:49 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
martin wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:Was watching ESPN a few weeks ago, Sarah Spain was on, and the subject was Rose and Noah in NY. As she likes to remind people, Spain watches every Bulls game. Spain said that Noah was most effective as a passer when he's hitting his shots. Once he starts missing, defenders drop back and Noah holds on to the ball too long, and the offense stagnated.

Last season Noah had a good excuse with his shoulder, I guess we'll see what happens. Funny thing is its the same issue O'Quinn has. Hope they're both working on their jumper in the offseason.

Haven't watched the Bulls over the past years at all so I wonder about how the Paul Gasol move effected Noah, seems to be about a good a move as having Melo and Amare on the court at the same time. Also, don't know what to think of the revamped coaching staff last year for the Bulls and how it effected the team and Noah in particular.

Don't believe it was about the system. As I pointed out O'Quinn had the same problem last season in a different system. Gasol and Noah probably would have worked better when they were younger and faster. I dont believe Stat and Melo wanted to work together. Never saw much of what could be called camaraderie between them. Almost always seemed to be on their own island when they played together. Dont see that happening with Noah.

I always considered the Amar'e - Melo mix as a bad one. If he wasn't injured, he played the "Black Hole" on the team. He rarely played a good game when paired with Melo. He never passed the ball, instead he looked for every and any scoring opportunity. And let's not get started on his defense. After his first year here, it was all downhill. To his credit, he did try to improve his game by going to the "Dream" school, but he still wasn't the player we needed him to be.

"We are playing a game. We are playing at not playing a game..."
newyorker4ever
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7/15/2016  3:55 PM
EnySpree wrote:On paper, the Knicks have a perfectly balanced starting 5.

Everything starts with your point guard. Derrick Rose pushes the ball and can't be guarded one on one regardless if he's lost a step or not. He's an adequate passer and a nba caliber defender. He's been upgraded to a decent 3pt shooter.

If you have a high use, scoring pg... you need a back court mate that is steady, can do it all but doesn't require the ball to be effective. That's Courtney Lee. He's a solid defender and he can shoot at a high percentage from 3. He has respectable take moves and can finish at the rim or short range. He can facilitate as well as spread the floor.

With that type of back court you need a big that can receive the ball and score in a variety of spots on the court. That's Kristaps. He can post up, pick and roll, pick and pop, run the floor, spot up, face up... he's going to clean up from the activity in the backcourt.

Since Kristap will be generating alot of attention, he's going to need a center to help him with rebounding and rim protection. That's Noah. Noah is also a great passer. He has great court awareness so he's going to fill lanes and be involved all over the court. He doesn't need shots but is dangerous all over the court with his ability to facilitate.

The Knicks have all bases covered. You can always use extra help inside. Extra rebounder, extra scorer. You will always need extra shooters too from the outside. Since we have a scoring point guard and offensive minded power fwd you'll need an extra passer. A small fwd that can play in any style. Plus you will always need a closer to make bad shots when you need them. That's Melo....

Health is a concern but I want to focus on the instant potential for this team to gel... it's incredible.

Our bench needs to have a hungry mix of players. Brandon Jennings wanted to be a Knick for 7 years. Willy is excited to play in nyc with his "brother". Our Lithuanian import dreamed is to play in the nba and has been trying to get in for years. Holiday is eager to make a significant impact in a rotation. Lance goal is to leave the Knicks a winner...

This is a fantastic mix we have here. It's not about kool-aid or homerism. Being realistic doesn't always have to be negative

Is Rose an NBA caliber defender and a decent 3 point shooter?? I guess it depends on what you consider decent for the 3 point shooting but i would put him at decent for being a defender as well.

I love this team and think we have a chance to really surprise on how far we could go in a playoff run.
newyorker4ever
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7/15/2016  3:59 PM
fishmike wrote:Good post Eny.

Knicks have concerns, but moving forward we finally have a team in year 3 under Phil. The SL is a nice blend of two alpha scorers surrounded by 3 defensive guys will high end skill sets. We have flexibility moving forward, good prospect to develop, some veteran depth and all our first rounders moving forward. We have a team that has the talent to catch lighting, get hot and make a deep run. Or if guys go down we can potentially see our prospects grow. Of if total disaster strikes maybe its a chance to land another young gem in the draft.

For the first time in my Knick fandom since the 90s we are clean of past mistakes directing our future. Slate is clean. We have a real team. We have future flexibility... It just seems like we are doing this the right way.

We have Phil to thank for this. All the crap he's been taking the past two years but all along he was doing things the right way and didn't trade away draft picks along the way.
dk7th
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7/15/2016  4:00 PM
EnySpree wrote:On paper, the Knicks have a perfectly balanced starting 5.

Everything starts with your point guard. Derrick Rose pushes the ball and can't be guarded one on one regardless if he's lost a step or not. He's an adequate passer and a nba caliber defender. He's been upgraded to a decent 3pt shooter.

If you have a high use, scoring pg... you need a back court mate that is steady, can do it all but doesn't require the ball to be effective. That's Courtney Lee. He's a solid defender and he can shoot at a high percentage from 3. He has respectable take moves and can finish at the rim or short range. He can facilitate as well as spread the floor.

With that type of back court you need a big that can receive the ball and score in a variety of spots on the court. That's Kristaps. He can post up, pick and roll, pick and pop, run the floor, spot up, face up... he's going to clean up from the activity in the backcourt.

Since Kristap will be generating alot of attention, he's going to need a center to help him with rebounding and rim protection. That's Noah. Noah is also a great passer. He has great court awareness so he's going to fill lanes and be involved all over the court. He doesn't need shots but is dangerous all over the court with his ability to facilitate.

The Knicks have all bases covered. You can always use extra help inside. Extra rebounder, extra scorer. You will always need extra shooters too from the outside. Since we have a scoring point guard and offensive minded power fwd you'll need an extra passer. A small fwd that can play in any style. Plus you will always need a closer to make bad shots when you need them. That's Melo....

Health is a concern but I want to focus on the instant potential for this team to gel... it's incredible.

Our bench needs to have a hungry mix of players. Brandon Jennings wanted to be a Knick for 7 years. Willy is excited to play in nyc with his "brother". Our Lithuanian import dreamed is to play in the nba and has been trying to get in for years. Holiday is eager to make a significant impact in a rotation. Lance goal is to leave the Knicks a winner...

This is a fantastic mix we have here. It's not about kool-aid or homerism. Being realistic doesn't always have to be negative

NBA caliber defender? Rose? "Adequate passer" is a gloss on the truth.

knicks win 38-43 games in 16-17. rose MUST shoot no more than 14 shots per game, defer to kp6 + melo, and have a usage rate of less than 25%
martin
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7/15/2016  5:24 PM
Chandler wrote:good post and agree with earlier posts that the team is positioned well. If people gel and stay healthy could be real good; if not we have flexibility going forward

serious question: who get's the last shot with this team? It's always bugged me with Melo bc IMO he just doesn't have that killer instinct in the last seconds

who will be our Paul Pierce? See some promise for that in KP but not sure if it's too soon

Still think it will be Melo and also KP. Rose will start with the ball in his hands and go to basket and find rim, Melo or KP. Like that.

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nyknickzingis
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7/17/2016  11:52 AM
What I like about the team is there is an option to move into a much quicker lineup that can run similar offense to what Hornachek had in Pheonix a few years ago, only with a little better defense.

Talking about a Kristaps, Melo, Lee, Rose and Jennings lineup.

I think if healthy, you will see both Rose and Jennings play together and run the same 2 point guard offense that Hornachek liked to utilize in Pheonix. We should see more Triangle with the starters, more Pheonix Hornachek offense when Jennings comes in.
nixluva
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7/17/2016  1:05 PM
nyknickzingis wrote:What I like about the team is there is an option to move into a much quicker lineup that can run similar offense to what Hornachek had in Pheonix a few years ago, only with a little better defense.

Talking about a Kristaps, Melo, Lee, Rose and Jennings lineup.

I think if healthy, you will see both Rose and Jennings play together and run the same 2 point guard offense that Hornachek liked to utilize in Pheonix. We should see more Triangle with the starters, more Pheonix Hornachek offense when Jennings comes in.

Yeah there is a lot of functionality on this team for how Hornacek wants to play. He is a very aggressive coach and will want to use his best weapons without fear of playing with 2 guards as he's done in the past. JH has tricks in his bag for the kind of talent we have now. He's already talked about some of the ways he would use KP and with quality guards he's gonna try to put MAX pressure on defenses with his aggressive style.
jrodmc
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7/18/2016  12:21 PM
EnySpree wrote:On paper, the Knicks have a perfectly balanced starting 5.

Everything starts with your point guard. Derrick Rose pushes the ball and can't be guarded one on one regardless if he's lost a step or not. He's an adequate passer and a nba caliber defender. He's been upgraded to a decent 3pt shooter.

If you have a high use, scoring pg... you need a back court mate that is steady, can do it all but doesn't require the ball to be effective. That's Courtney Lee. He's a solid defender and he can shoot at a high percentage from 3. He has respectable take moves and can finish at the rim or short range. He can facilitate as well as spread the floor.

With that type of back court you need a big that can receive the ball and score in a variety of spots on the court. That's Kristaps. He can post up, pick and roll, pick and pop, run the floor, spot up, face up... he's going to clean up from the activity in the backcourt.

Since Kristap will be generating alot of attention, he's going to need a center to help him with rebounding and rim protection. That's Noah. Noah is also a great passer. He has great court awareness so he's going to fill lanes and be involved all over the court. He doesn't need shots but is dangerous all over the court with his ability to facilitate.

The Knicks have all bases covered. You can always use extra help inside. Extra rebounder, extra scorer. You will always need extra shooters too from the outside. Since we have a scoring point guard and offensive minded power fwd you'll need an extra passer. A small fwd that can play in any style. Plus you will always need a closer to make bad shots when you need them. That's Melo....

Health is a concern but I want to focus on the instant potential for this team to gel... it's incredible.

Our bench needs to have a hungry mix of players. Brandon Jennings wanted to be a Knick for 7 years. Willy is excited to play in nyc with his "brother". Our Lithuanian import dreamed is to play in the nba and has been trying to get in for years. Holiday is eager to make a significant impact in a rotation. Lance goal is to leave the Knicks a winner...

This is a fantastic mix we have here. It's not about kool-aid or homerism. Being realistic doesn't always have to be negative


+1
Great post and welcome aboard, Eny! Is this your first time on a NYC sports board?

And we're not even overly ancient, either!
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