crzymdups wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:KP and O'Quinn. Early might be back. Also Rambis is still here.

I was going to make a larger post about this, and obviously I caught a lot of flack for speculating at the time - but I do think Phil underwent a MAJOR philosophy shift between the end of the season in April when it sounded like Rambis would be the coach and he didn't want to invest in point guards... and now when he have made major moves for DRose and a quality risk signing in Jennings and hired Hornacek at head coach who may run the Triangle, but will feature pick and rolls and faster pace.

I believe Phil never was going to hire Rambis. He loves to say one thing and do another when it comes to the media. He made a career out of it. Mind games. I never took the Rambis stuff serious. Why didn't he hire Rambis over Fish or Kerr if he was so great a leader? Phil knew where Rambis could help - an assistant and someone that reports back to Phil.

Where I agree with you is the change of thinking. I believe this is all on Hornachek and their meeting. I believe Hornachek approached it in a way that made Phil realize he had to try something differently than how he won as a coach because the talent the Knicks have or could have realistic all is vastly different than than that Lakers. You saw this free agency and summer everything happen the way Hornachek wants it. He wanted a real driving point guard and that's what he got. He wanted a backup who has starting ability and they got that. With the option to even run 2 point guard lineups. He wanted a big that didn't post up at 5, instead be a facilitating big.

It will be a very interesting year. I won't say anything with confirmation or conviction in regards to where we will end up but I do believe a playoff run is realistic.

Yes, perhaps it was Hornacek. I am not sure. Chris Herring and Seth Rosenthal have posted that they talked to people in the Knicks organization who believed Rambis was on the verge of being hired. I think Phil underwent a major philosophy change, even to interview Hornacek. I'm not saying it was not Phil's decision to make that philosophy change - who knows what precipitated it - but I do think there was a major change from the end of the season to about mid-May when he hired Hornacek. I'm in favor of the moves. To me, before he was trying to do a slow build with almost no draft picks and Melo signed to a max deal and it made no sense. Going for it during Melo's window makes sense to me. But the shift was notable to me.

Just think - as recently as three-four weeks ago we were all talking about a potentiaal starting backcourt of Wroten and Jerian Grant side by side - there were multiple reports that Phil Jackson thought Wroten might be the starting PG. Now we have DRose, Jennings, Courtney Lee.

We live in an age where everyone seems to believe that life should be transparent and all answers should be given to use when we want them. Jackson talks a lot of philosophy, but he keeps his cards well hidden from the press, and he's done a pretty good job keeping info he doesn't want out there covered up.

I'm not even sure how open he is to some of the folks who Herring and Rosenthal talked to.

I get no sense of what he wants, other than that he prefers players who are willing to sacrifice themselves for the greater good in order to build a winning team.

WaltLongmire wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

nyknickzingis wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:KP and O'Quinn. Early might be back. Also Rambis is still here.

I was going to make a larger post about this, and obviously I caught a lot of flack for speculating at the time - but I do think Phil underwent a MAJOR philosophy shift between the end of the season in April when it sounded like Rambis would be the coach and he didn't want to invest in point guards... and now when he have made major moves for DRose and a quality risk signing in Jennings and hired Hornacek at head coach who may run the Triangle, but will feature pick and rolls and faster pace.

I believe Phil never was going to hire Rambis. He loves to say one thing and do another when it comes to the media. He made a career out of it. Mind games. I never took the Rambis stuff serious. Why didn't he hire Rambis over Fish or Kerr if he was so great a leader? Phil knew where Rambis could help - an assistant and someone that reports back to Phil.

Where I agree with you is the change of thinking. I believe this is all on Hornachek and their meeting. I believe Hornachek approached it in a way that made Phil realize he had to try something differently than how he won as a coach because the talent the Knicks have or could have realistic all is vastly different than than that Lakers. You saw this free agency and summer everything happen the way Hornachek wants it. He wanted a real driving point guard and that's what he got. He wanted a backup who has starting ability and they got that. With the option to even run 2 point guard lineups. He wanted a big that didn't post up at 5, instead be a facilitating big.

It will be a very interesting year. I won't say anything with confirmation or conviction in regards to where we will end up but I do believe a playoff run is realistic.

Yes, perhaps it was Hornacek. I am not sure. Chris Herring and Seth Rosenthal have posted that they talked to people in the Knicks organization who believed Rambis was on the verge of being hired. I think Phil underwent a major philosophy change, even to interview Hornacek. I'm not saying it was not Phil's decision to make that philosophy change - who knows what precipitated it - but I do think there was a major change from the end of the season to about mid-May when he hired Hornacek. I'm in favor of the moves. To me, before he was trying to do a slow build with almost no draft picks and Melo signed to a max deal and it made no sense. Going for it during Melo's window makes sense to me. But the shift was notable to me.

Just think - as recently as three-four weeks ago we were all talking about a potentiaal starting backcourt of Wroten and Jerian Grant side by side - there were multiple reports that Phil Jackson thought Wroten might be the starting PG. Now we have DRose, Jennings, Courtney Lee.

Hard to figure Jackson out, and he's tricked us a number of times- especially before the 2016 draft. Our early interest in KP, the secret Russell workout, trading to get Hernangomez and Grant. Add the Hornacek hiring to this list and the Rose trade. Few rumors about any of this stuff.

We live in an age where everyone seems to believe that life should be transparent and all answers should be given to use when we want them. Jackson talks a lot of philosophy, but he keeps his cards well hidden from the press, and he's done a pretty good job keeping info he doesn't want out there covered up.

I'm not even sure how open he is to some of the folks who Herring and Rosenthal talked to.

I get no sense of what he wants, other than that he prefers players who are willing to sacrifice themselves for the greater good in order to build a winning team.

True. Someone made the point that Jackson is a west coast guy and had few contacts on the east coast and in NYC who he really confides in, so things don't leak. That said, even Ramona Shelburne, who is best friends with Jeannie Buss, wrote an article about how Rambis was almost certainly the coach.

But, yes, I find it weirdly comforting that Phil is hard to predict and doesn't seem to care what other people think.

That said, I do feel like there was a major philosophy shift sometime in the past two months. I know we will never get the full story, but I am very curious.

Malcolm wrote:What a mess.

The Triangle "philosophy" is about individuals working toward a common goal. I think the group of guys we hired will buy into this and Hornacek will stress this way of thinking even if he does some tinkering with the Triangle.

Malcolm wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:I get no sense of what he wants, other than that he prefers players who are willing to sacrifice themselves for the greater good in order to build a winning team.

I think asking a good guy like Lopez to "sacrifice himself for the greater good" by leaving town . . . is asking too much. My respect for Jackson has taken a big hit.

I was a teacher for many years...and would have been a much better department administrator than the person who was an AP at the time I left, but I never wanted to be in a position where I had to be critical of and ruthless toward other teachers, or have to suck up to and perform for a principal who was, and is, a true bytch.

Phil's job is a tough one.

You are upset with the Lopez trade, but how many players who have tried out for the Knicks in SL have NOT been asked to training camp? How many guess on a training camp contract have been released? This is a job where you can only keep 15 players on your roster. Last year Phil gave some contracts to players he wanted to see on our DL team- contracts which gave them a little more than the standard $25G DL contract. He did not invite any of them of SL this year.

This is the life of a team GM/President/whatever Phil is

I became a pretty strong supporter of Lopez, who really surprised me this past season. I also feel really bad for him, and for Grant too, since I'm the type who looks at draft picks like they're your children. They also have a good situation in Chicago, though, and I hope they both do well...except when they play the Knicks. Phil has usually put the guys he traded into good situations, by the way.

Resigning Anthony and not having a draft pick this year hindered any ideas of building a team more gradually, and as someone pointed out- Rose begat Noah and Noah begat Lee, so things are interdependent (a word from my teacher days).

My gut feelings is that he's created a very competitive team.

That is Phil's job...trade for or groom players...find the right coach, and then sit back a hope for success.

We will see what happens, but it seems to me that he's gone above and beyond to put together a very competitive team, and now we all get to sit back and see how it plays out on the court.

CrushAlot wrote:

Malcolm wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:I get no sense of what he wants, other than that he prefers players who are willing to sacrifice themselves for the greater good in order to build a winning team.

I think asking a good guy like Lopez to "sacrifice himself for the greater good" by leaving town . . . is asking too much. My respect for Jackson has taken a big hit.

Lopez was great but he understands it is a business. He was the second choice for Phil and had to wait until DeAndre Jordan signed with another team before he got his deal. Lopez is on his fifth team. He knows how things work.

Chicago has a big comic con of their own. He'll be fine.