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Holly Molly, everybody is a max player
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joec32033
Posts: 30632
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Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
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7/1/2016  10:44 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/1/2016  10:45 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
joec32033 wrote:The owners collectively are throwing around the GNP of a medium sized country. Maybe one fortuitious owner will sign Greece and Detroit to get them out of their financial difficulties.

No, they aren't.

The teams throwing the money around have cap room, which means they're basically spending the money the CBA requires them to spend.

The players were REQUIRED to get a HUGE windfall of the new TV revenue. Owners HAVE to pay it to them one way or another.

People just weren't prepared for how much the players were going to get and are reacting how it's being divided up.

In other words, the size of the pie was predetermined by the CBA. All we're seeing right now is how the pie is being divided up.

I get your whole schpiel. And you are right to a degree salaries were going to scale upawrds. BUT, you aren ignoring the fact there is still some type of fiscal responsibility that NEEDS to be excercised. A zero time all star, zero time MVP, zero time all NBA, Zero finals appearances, Zero time DPOY, not even the best player on his team (Gasol, up to this season Randolph-and that is based more on Randolph's decline than Conley's rise) guy just got the richest contract in NBA history! At 29! Im not saying he isnt a good player. He is. He was probably the best PG on the FA market this year. That is fiscal irresponsibility.

His value goes up because the scale of contracts went up. But that doesnt turn a 50 million dollar player in the old system to triple that. Mike Conley had his value go up by 200% because the scale went up by what 25%-30%?

The salary floor excuse is a convenient, cheap way to say " well, uh, we had to pay somebody and these were who was available to be paid". Im sure the guys that are gonna get the minimum this season arent going to appreciate that salary floor "reasoning".

~You can't run from who you are.~
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Knickoftime
Posts: 24159
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Joined: 1/13/2011
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7/1/2016  10:58 PM
joec32033 wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
joec32033 wrote:The owners collectively are throwing around the GNP of a medium sized country. Maybe one fortuitious owner will sign Greece and Detroit to get them out of their financial difficulties.

No, they aren't.

The teams throwing the money around have cap room, which means they're basically spending the money the CBA requires them to spend.

The players were REQUIRED to get a HUGE windfall of the new TV revenue. Owners HAVE to pay it to them one way or another.

People just weren't prepared for how much the players were going to get and are reacting how it's being divided up.

In other words, the size of the pie was predetermined by the CBA. All we're seeing right now is how the pie is being divided up.

I get your whole schpiel. And you are right to a degree salaries were going to scale upawrds. BUT, you aren ignoring the fact there is still some type of fiscal responsibility that NEEDS to be excercised. A zero time all star, zero time MVP, zero time all NBA, Zero finals appearances, Zero time DPOY, not even the best player on his team (Gasol, up to this season Randolph-and that is based more on Randolph's decline than Conley's rise) guy just got the richest contract in NBA history! At 29! Im not saying he isnt a good player. He is. He was probably the best PG on the FA market this year. That is fiscal irresponsibility.

His value goes up because the scale of contracts went up. But that doesnt turn a 50 million dollar player in the old system to triple that. Mike Conley had his value go up by 200% because the scale went up by what 25%-30%?

The salary floor excuse is a convenient, cheap way to say " well, uh, we had to pay somebody and these were who was available to be paid". Im sure the guys that are gonna get the minimum this season arent going to appreciate that salary floor "reasoning".

I get the appeal of that rational. I do.

The problem is professional sports remind us time and time again what occurs when demand greatly outpaces supply in a highly competitive market.

No matter what the sport, we continue to think the owners are crazy and irresponsible. But fans demonstrate they don't want to understand what are market forces at play.

Okay, is Conley the best player in the game? No, not even close. But Memphis has a good team in a really competitive conference.

Standing on a principle while someone ELSE gives Conley the max (maybe even their conference) accomplishes what for them?

That's the market forces at play. If they don't, someone else will.

Memphis has a nice roster, and if healthy, Parsons makes them better.

But they don't have a LBJ or a Curry or a Durant. They can't put a solid bargain basement roster around a superstar and compete.

What does Jeremy Lin at $12m do for them? More depth isn't their team need.

And look at the money being thrown at OTHER margin players? Even a solid bargain basement roster isn't a bargain anymore.

And again, they HAVE to spend one way or another anyway. So it makes sense to pay market price for the guy they know, they're comfortable with, is a team leader, already has chemistry with their roster, is popular with fans, and btw, is good.

Him leaving does nothing for them.

joec32033
Posts: 30632
Alba Posts: 37
Joined: 2/3/2004
Member: #583
USA
7/1/2016  11:15 PM
Knickoftime wrote:
joec32033 wrote:
Knickoftime wrote:
joec32033 wrote:The owners collectively are throwing around the GNP of a medium sized country. Maybe one fortuitious owner will sign Greece and Detroit to get them out of their financial difficulties.

No, they aren't.

The teams throwing the money around have cap room, which means they're basically spending the money the CBA requires them to spend.

The players were REQUIRED to get a HUGE windfall of the new TV revenue. Owners HAVE to pay it to them one way or another.

People just weren't prepared for how much the players were going to get and are reacting how it's being divided up.

In other words, the size of the pie was predetermined by the CBA. All we're seeing right now is how the pie is being divided up.

I get your whole schpiel. And you are right to a degree salaries were going to scale upawrds. BUT, you aren ignoring the fact there is still some type of fiscal responsibility that NEEDS to be excercised. A zero time all star, zero time MVP, zero time all NBA, Zero finals appearances, Zero time DPOY, not even the best player on his team (Gasol, up to this season Randolph-and that is based more on Randolph's decline than Conley's rise) guy just got the richest contract in NBA history! At 29! Im not saying he isnt a good player. He is. He was probably the best PG on the FA market this year. That is fiscal irresponsibility.

His value goes up because the scale of contracts went up. But that doesnt turn a 50 million dollar player in the old system to triple that. Mike Conley had his value go up by 200% because the scale went up by what 25%-30%?

The salary floor excuse is a convenient, cheap way to say " well, uh, we had to pay somebody and these were who was available to be paid". Im sure the guys that are gonna get the minimum this season arent going to appreciate that salary floor "reasoning".

I get the appeal of that rational. I do.

The problem is professional sports remind us time and time again what occurs when demand greatly outpaces supply in a highly competitive market.

No matter what the sport, we continue to think the owners are crazy and irresponsible. But fans demonstrate they don't want to understand what are market forces at play.

Okay, is Conley the best player in the game? No, not even close. But Memphis has a good team in a really competitive conference.

Standing on a principle while someone ELSE gives Conley the max (maybe even their conference) accomplishes what for them?

That's the market forces at play. If they don't, someone else will.

Memphis has a nice roster, and if healthy, Parsons makes them better.

But they don't have a LBJ or a Curry or a Durant. They can't put a solid bargain basement roster around a superstar and compete.

What does Jeremy Lin at $12m do for them? More depth isn't their team need.

And look at the money being thrown at OTHER margin players? Even a solid bargain basement roster isn't a bargain anymore.

And again, they HAVE to spend one way or another anyway. So it makes sense to pay market price for the guy they know, they're comfortable with, is a team leader, already has chemistry with their roster, is popular with fans, and btw, is good.

Him leaving does nothing for them.

In the case of Conley i get team worth vs real worth. But I dont even think anyone could have offered Conley that much.

I get the market being the market but no matternwhat every owner in professional sports says, the owners set the market. There are ways to hit the salary floor without overpaying giving out ludicrous deals using a CBA as an excuse. Philly didnit in a way it harmed their rep with players. Other teams do it by paying foe depth. Some teams overpay top talent. And that is fine. But when owner overpayment makes the ceiling the floor (this Conley deal does just that-he is a top 15 PG at worst, maybe top 10 at best) what the hell are guys like Curry and Westbrook gonna want?


Im not saying your wrong about salaries having to go up. What i disagree with is when someone gets overpaid, the excuse has to be salaries had to go up.

~You can't run from who you are.~
Holly Molly, everybody is a max player

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