WaltLongmire wrote:Scary to think of how much we might depend on KP being on the floor at this point in the season. I asked about this in the game thread, and got my answer watching the game...his 4th foul was a turning point- no doubt about it. He can't be making those foolish rookie-type fouls.

When he develops a strong game in the post at some point in the next few years, the offense will probably be run through him as he commands double teams.

All the guys who talk about the new world of 3 pt shot dominance seem to overlook the fact that a strong offensive presence down low frees up 3 pt shooters just as much a penetrating PG.

Still willing to cut Anthony some slack because of his recovery, but it does annoy me that he seems unwilling to accept the fact that the injury does not allow him to do certain things at this point in the season. I will also continue to harp on the fact that he should have been shut down and gotten the operation sooner rather than later. This is on Melo, Phil, and, I expect, a guy named Dolan. It is having an impact on this season, and it bothers me that it is on my mind all the time, but as long as he is still in the recovery process I'm going to be thinking about it.

I would think of giving Melo a game off every now and then, a la SA. Seems to be a good idea at this point.

Sasha looked pretty good yesterday- definitely not the reason for the loss.

Calderon should be getting 15 MPG at this point...and he should be coming off the bench.

Two defensive technicals for Lopez. Can't lose awareness on the court. Part of this stems from his concern with penetrating guards, I would assume.

Gallo looked solid for the most part...he is at his best playing within the flow of the offense and not forcing things. Thee was a 3 pt shot he should have taken later in the game, but he passed off. Has to take that shot. Our best perimeter defender by a large margin, IMO.

Grant still has these up and down games common to most rookies...I still get the feeling that he is holding back in terms of being the assertive player he was in college. Eventually things will come together for him...maybe that will happen when he replaces Jose at some point, and knows he is going to get consistent playing time even if he makes some rookie mistakes.

We're learning more and more about individual players and what they can and can't do as the season progresses...at some point Fisher will have to do more than just learn, he will have to make lineup and rotation changes based on what he's leaned.

When people say this it seems like they are totally missing the point and yet it keeps getting mentioned.

Nobody is arguing that there should not be a post presence. The point is that there needs to be both / balance. Its all based on matchups.

The last thing that we want to do is stick a guy in one place. That would be silly. Sometimes he will be a matchup nightmare from the perimeter and sometimes in the post.

dk7th wrote:it's hard to imagine but kristaps porzingis is showing that he serves as the ballast to this team. not only that but he and melo have good chemistry.... if melo can just stick with that. as to the game-- we have zero transition defense. anyone want to hazard a guess why? also, no fast break points either.

that is incredible: zero fast break points and yet you allow 24 fast break points. that's not coaching that's personnel... which i suppose goes back to the coaching again?

kp just blows me away how effective a defender he is, and how he seems to learn from one play to the next. for those who want him to stay out of foul trouble i have one suggestion: so long as calderon is out there do not get your hopes up. fisher HAS TO make a decision since the knicks are better whenever kp is out there. two of kp's fouls were DIRECTLY sourced in calderon's non-perimeter defense.

melo i just don't get it with him or maybe i do: he is mentally weak, very very weak. and he, like lbj, has aged. this is fisher's challenge: how do you get him to stop degenerating into a playground chucker when there are only so many face-saving timeouts he can call? four out of five games. don't care about the rebounds. i DO care about his assists. however more important than assists is his usage to assist rate ratio. it will be interesting to see the box score on basketballreference.com in the morning. my guess is that his ratio is over 2:1, instead of 1.4:1 which is what you want from him in the triangle. we shall see. meanwhile, bad shots are bad shots. seems clear that 25% of his shots are bad shots. tonight he takes 18 shots-- that is good... but i think i counted 4 bad, momentum killing, spirit snuffing, shots. if he shoots 22 times, that number goes up to 5-6 bad shots. this aspect of his game needs to be tightened up, even as he grows more collegial with the ball.

lopez again floor impact is minimal. he seems kind of lost out there on both ends of the court.

calderon/vujacic ugh

o'quinn love this guy's game but his lack of athleticism/foot speed is a liability. something to watch.

williams he needs a good dose of guile and misdirection. telegraphs passes. the three looks promising. he started playing late in life and it kind of shows.

galloway he looks to have the clutch gene but tonight he seemed a bit out of sorts. is that on fisher?

grant he really has no business taking long-range jumpshots but i guess this is part of the process and growing pains. but he absolutely needs to finish better around the basket. what's up with that tonight?

You're on point about everything. And Melo can get ten assists, he's still not a good fit as the leader, go to guy on ANY team. His ****ty three assists a game are overrated because he basically has to be FORCED to give it up, it's not like he's making a nice move/play and creates something for his teammates. He stands there trying to get his iso and waits to SEE if he get's doubled THEN gives it up, those are his assists, nothing more.

He is just a momentum killer. What bugs me the most about this young season is that this team is actually competent enough to get him a double digit lead, and THAT'S when he decides to go get his, talking **** to 40 year old Richard Jeffersons and Jared Dudleys of the NBA to try to prove a ****ing point, this guy is a moron. The worse thing he does is he breaks plays to get his own. You can't possibly tell me that at the end of the first half, after a time out, that's what Fisher drew, when Carmelo got a shot clock violation. He got two screens, on the first he got a switch, then asked for a second screen to get Jefferson BACK ON HIM...WHAT THE FUCK? It was obvious that he wanted to hit a shot on Jefferson but this idiot took so long dribbling as if he is playing in the park that he caused a SCV.

The team is fun to watch except when this dude decides to call his own number. I'm so tired of seeing good ball movement, good shots 3 times down the floor, get a little momentum and then this shmuck throwing cold water on it by chucking a shot.

I can't WAIT till this guy is off the team. There isn't a SINGLE player like him in the NBA anymore. He is a dinosaur from the old MJ/Kobe iso mold from the past two decades. He's useless because he can't even do the one thing he is touted for....shooting/scoring.

These 4 for 18 games? Get used to them...they seem like they are the norm now and the Washington game will be a surprise here and there.

Nalod wrote:When the other guys are not hitting shots, Melo will shoot.
Its the law of the jungle.
It was an ugly game from both side. Lebron is still the man.

BTW, Jordan used to have lots of games like this. Rebounding, getting to the line and keep shooting.
Melo is not Lebron or Jordan. I thought Melo rebounded well and passed. When guys don't hit shots, the Alpha will.

How about he pass the ball when he does one of those stupid drives to the hoop where he barges into defenders going straight up? If the other guys aren't in rhythm, how about making some plays to get them going? See, he can't do that because he has tunnel vision. unless he has a hard double team come his way he doesn't look to pass or make a play AT ALL. Also, does this guy not know how to give a pump fake, an up and under? He's supposed to be the premier scorer inside and out in the game.

Also, **** Jose. Why the FUCK does he constantly dump the ball to Lopez like he's ****ing Shaq? KP is CONSTANTLY open at the free throw line but he doesn't get the ball there. Give him the ball there in a triple threat position and IT'S MONEY. But nope.

mreinman wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:Scary to think of how much we might depend on KP being on the floor at this point in the season. I asked about this in the game thread, and got my answer watching the game...his 4th foul was a turning point- no doubt about it. He can't be making those foolish rookie-type fouls.

When he develops a strong game in the post at some point in the next few years, the offense will probably be run through him as he commands double teams.

All the guys who talk about the new world of 3 pt shot dominance seem to overlook the fact that a strong offensive presence down low frees up 3 pt shooters just as much a penetrating PG.

Still willing to cut Anthony some slack because of his recovery, but it does annoy me that he seems unwilling to accept the fact that the injury does not allow him to do certain things at this point in the season. I will also continue to harp on the fact that he should have been shut down and gotten the operation sooner rather than later. This is on Melo, Phil, and, I expect, a guy named Dolan. It is having an impact on this season, and it bothers me that it is on my mind all the time, but as long as he is still in the recovery process I'm going to be thinking about it.

I would think of giving Melo a game off every now and then, a la SA. Seems to be a good idea at this point.

Sasha looked pretty good yesterday- definitely not the reason for the loss.

Calderon should be getting 15 MPG at this point...and he should be coming off the bench.

Two defensive technicals for Lopez. Can't lose awareness on the court. Part of this stems from his concern with penetrating guards, I would assume.

Gallo looked solid for the most part...he is at his best playing within the flow of the offense and not forcing things. Thee was a 3 pt shot he should have taken later in the game, but he passed off. Has to take that shot. Our best perimeter defender by a large margin, IMO.

Grant still has these up and down games common to most rookies...I still get the feeling that he is holding back in terms of being the assertive player he was in college. Eventually things will come together for him...maybe that will happen when he replaces Jose at some point, and knows he is going to get consistent playing time even if he makes some rookie mistakes.

We're learning more and more about individual players and what they can and can't do as the season progresses...at some point Fisher will have to do more than just learn, he will have to make lineup and rotation changes based on what he's leaned.

When people say this it seems like they are totally missing the point and yet it keeps getting mentioned.

Nobody is arguing that there should not be a post presence. The point is that there needs to be both / balance. Its all based on matchups.

The last thing that we want to do is stick a guy in one place. That would be silly. Sometimes he will be a matchup nightmare from the perimeter and sometimes in the post.

I actually believe that his greatest value will be on the defensive end, and if you are having him guard today's PFs, which he does quite well, IMO, you lose his impact in the middle.

You are looking at his offense, I am thinking that his defensive presence might end up being his most important contribution to a team.

The irony here is that by having him run around after 4s you probably tire him a bit for the offense end.

WaltLongmire wrote:

mreinman wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:Scary to think of how much we might depend on KP being on the floor at this point in the season. I asked about this in the game thread, and got my answer watching the game...his 4th foul was a turning point- no doubt about it. He can't be making those foolish rookie-type fouls.

When he develops a strong game in the post at some point in the next few years, the offense will probably be run through him as he commands double teams.

All the guys who talk about the new world of 3 pt shot dominance seem to overlook the fact that a strong offensive presence down low frees up 3 pt shooters just as much a penetrating PG.

Still willing to cut Anthony some slack because of his recovery, but it does annoy me that he seems unwilling to accept the fact that the injury does not allow him to do certain things at this point in the season. I will also continue to harp on the fact that he should have been shut down and gotten the operation sooner rather than later. This is on Melo, Phil, and, I expect, a guy named Dolan. It is having an impact on this season, and it bothers me that it is on my mind all the time, but as long as he is still in the recovery process I'm going to be thinking about it.

I would think of giving Melo a game off every now and then, a la SA. Seems to be a good idea at this point.

Sasha looked pretty good yesterday- definitely not the reason for the loss.

Calderon should be getting 15 MPG at this point...and he should be coming off the bench.

Two defensive technicals for Lopez. Can't lose awareness on the court. Part of this stems from his concern with penetrating guards, I would assume.

Gallo looked solid for the most part...he is at his best playing within the flow of the offense and not forcing things. Thee was a 3 pt shot he should have taken later in the game, but he passed off. Has to take that shot. Our best perimeter defender by a large margin, IMO.

Grant still has these up and down games common to most rookies...I still get the feeling that he is holding back in terms of being the assertive player he was in college. Eventually things will come together for him...maybe that will happen when he replaces Jose at some point, and knows he is going to get consistent playing time even if he makes some rookie mistakes.

We're learning more and more about individual players and what they can and can't do as the season progresses...at some point Fisher will have to do more than just learn, he will have to make lineup and rotation changes based on what he's leaned.

When people say this it seems like they are totally missing the point and yet it keeps getting mentioned.

Nobody is arguing that there should not be a post presence. The point is that there needs to be both / balance. Its all based on matchups.

The last thing that we want to do is stick a guy in one place. That would be silly. Sometimes he will be a matchup nightmare from the perimeter and sometimes in the post.

I'm trying to look at KPs value as a defender and as an offensive player. Has not showed the advanced post up game yet.

I actually believe that his greatest value will be on the defensive end, and if you are having him guard today's PFs, which he does quite well, IMO, you lose his impact in the middle.

You are looking at his offense, I am thinking that his defensive presence might end up being his most important contribution to a team.

The irony here is that by having him run around after 4s you probably tire him a bit for the offense end.

You keep misrepresenting my position. I have said that he can potentially be first team all nba numerous times. I would rather him not have to guard stretch 4's as I have also mentioned. I would rather him guard power forwards who take stupid shots like Aldridge.

Stretch 4's are matchup nightmares which is what will make him hard to guard.

I am not just looking at offense, I am looking at KP and all (the mismatches and value) that he brings.

TPercy wrote:Melo is not the reason why we lost the game. That is just ridicolous thinking. Was his shot off? Yes it was.

Did Melo play really good defense on lebron? Yes he did

Did he not make plays for others and grab 12 boards, block two shots and grab a couple of steals? Yes he did

Melo has had his bad games of when he is just bad on both ends, but this game was far from one and he actually was a big factor into keeping us in the game. Like ChuckBuck said, that game was purely down to the poor play by Fisher. Any attempt to bring Melo into the equation is just ridiculous stupidity and hatred.

martin wrote:so I only saw the first quarter or so of this game, and maybe I missed this in the GameThread. Only 2 observations: LeBrons shorts were much shorter than in the past, and he wasn't guarding Melo to start the game but Melo was guarding him.

And I like how a couple of guys called out the fact that he was allowed to play with a ripped jersey, that he ripped himself, despite the fact that there are rules against that. Hahahaaaa.