BRIGGS wrote:

smackeddog wrote:Why do people have an aversion to adding "I think" when creating threads on their thoughts?

Isnt "I think" implied when you make a post? Its just someone opinion right?

...but since arguing is what folks do around here, we readily dismiss such confidence by throwing back our own strongly felt, but sometimes weakly supported, "opinions."

Just part of the game.

My opinion is the only thing that really matters, anyway...right?

Finestrg wrote:

misterearl wrote:there, The Answer Man said it.

Interesting... I don't know whether I'd take that bet or not, I actually like D-Will and think he can turn things around and start playing up to his capabilities (Shved finally started well, the best ball of his career in fact, right? Some guys just come on late), but the bottom line for me is that Maurice Ndour is a player--an impact player in the NBA on both ends. As obvious as the sky is blue.. Wish we could've had both. We SHOULD'VE had both on board... No good reason in the world not to. Comes down to thriftiness and laziness--complete miscalculation on Phil's part. 100%. Absolutely no way around it.. We've seen this pattern now with at least 3 players (that we know about)--Greg Monroe, Alexey Shved and Mo Ndour. Up to me, ALL THREE would've been Knicks and all 3 would've been KEY rotation players. The first guy's a 25-yr-old 6'11" 250 lb. PF/C that would've averaged 20/10 for this team for years to come (don't care about what MONROE couldn't do--never once concerned about that. Every player has shortcomings--20/10 is WHAT HE COULD DO!! And he would've come for a reduced max anyway compared to other players which made him an automatic bargain, a huge important element to that mistake that just gets glossed over); the 2nd guy was a big/versatile guard that EXCELLED in this triangle when others couldn't (just look at what Shane Larkin had to say about the triangle among other skeptical players/analysts/fans) and was clearly the best player we had to close out the year. As for Ndour, dude was EVERYTHING you could've hoped for in a surprise SL player worth taking a chance on--a legit 2-way energy player, potentially better than Chris Copeland or any other SL invite we've had since I've been following the team. He was worth following up on, esp. when we finally got a glimpse of the money we're talking about--read Berman saying we lost this kid over what, 400k (Cuban gave him what, 600k guaranteed year 1 and we offered 200k)?? Wow...I mean that's chump change. The first words outta my mouth when I found out we lost Ndour were 'how much did Cubes give him'? If it was several million, maybe I could see why they passed but we're talking a few hundred thousand bucks here...All I needed to know... Acy, Early, Galloway, Amundson and Lance Thomas--all made/make more money than that--Ndour has a good chance to be better than any of those guys. That's the bet I'll take...And the Garden would've loved this kid too. ABSOULTELY LOVED HIM!!! For me, the next best thing to building an honest to goodness championship roster and playing meaningful games is watching promising young players develop along the way. We had a good one here imho and pissed it away...

Just when I was starting to get over this gaffe, Knickerblogger.net puts out a great article yesterday on how losing Ndour was a mistake--it's right on the money word for word: http://knickerblogger.net/why-the-new-york-knicks-made-a-mistake-not-keeping-maurice-ndour/. And now Berman's providing good insight into the mistake too: http://nypost.com/2015/07/28/why-knicks-last-ditch-effort-to-sign-maurice-ndour-fell-short/. What are ya gonna do? Still SMH man...

If Monroe is as good as you claim - why did Detroit let him fly?

If Shved is as good as you claim - why did no other NBA team sign him?

To annoint Ndour as an IMPACT NBA player at both ends without even seeing him in an NBA game is pretty funny.

http://theknicksblog.com/knicks/knicks-pushed-for-maurice-ndour-after-he-signed-with-mavericks/

One thing about the New York Knicks is that they’re persistent.

After Maurice Ndour came to terms on a deal with the Dallas Mavericks, the Knicks continued to make a push for the power forward. The Knicks reached out to Ndour’s camp to see if they could come to an agreement, but Ndour refused to go back on his verbal agreement with Mark Cuban, a source told the New York Post.

Ndour grabbed plenty of teams’ attention during the NBA Summer League, averaging 9.6 points, 4.8 rebounds and 2.0 blocks per game. He signed with the Mavericks last week for more than the $600,000 rookie free-agent minimum, according to the report.

The Knicks offered Ndour less than $200,000 in hopes that the forward’s New York roots would persuade him to take less to stay home.

earthmansurfer wrote:We offered Ndour 200k! I can't believe that. Then we tried to negotiate with his agent but Ndour wouldn't go back on his 600k deal with Dallas.
Sorry, but offering the kid 200k and then Dallas' 600k made that first offer a bit of an embarrassment. I kind of don't blame him for sticking with his deal.
Why lowball a guy like that when you just overpaid for Amundson and Thomas AND got extra in salary cap?

http://theknicksblog.com/knicks/knicks-pushed-for-maurice-ndour-after-he-signed-with-mavericks/

One thing about the New York Knicks is that they’re persistent.

After Maurice Ndour came to terms on a deal with the Dallas Mavericks, the Knicks continued to make a push for the power forward. The Knicks reached out to Ndour’s camp to see if they could come to an agreement, but Ndour refused to go back on his verbal agreement with Mark Cuban, a source told the New York Post.

Ndour grabbed plenty of teams’ attention during the NBA Summer League, averaging 9.6 points, 4.8 rebounds and 2.0 blocks per game. He signed with the Mavericks last week for more than the $600,000 rookie free-agent minimum, according to the report.

The Knicks offered Ndour less than $200,000 in hopes that the forward’s New York roots would persuade him to take less to stay home.

My thoughts exactly, EMS. HUGE head-scratcher.. We haven't shown nearly the amount of aggressiveness needed to get certain key FAs we apparently coveted and to keep other players in the fold.

Finestrg wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

Finestrg wrote:

misterearl wrote:there, The Answer Man said it.

Interesting... I don't know whether I'd take that bet or not, I actually like D-Will and think he can turn things around and start playing up to his capabilities (Shved finally started well, the best ball of his career in fact, right? Some guys just come on late), but the bottom line for me is that Maurice Ndour is a player--an impact player in the NBA on both ends. As obvious as the sky is blue.. Wish we could've had both. We SHOULD'VE had both on board... No good reason in the world not to. Comes down to thriftiness and laziness--complete miscalculation on Phil's part. 100%. Absolutely no way around it.. We've seen this pattern now with at least 3 players (that we know about)--Greg Monroe, Alexey Shved and Mo Ndour. Up to me, ALL THREE would've been Knicks and all 3 would've been KEY rotation players. The first guy's a 25-yr-old 6'11" 250 lb. PF/C that would've averaged 20/10 for this team for years to come (don't care about what MONROE couldn't do--never once concerned about that. Every player has shortcomings--20/10 is WHAT HE COULD DO!! And he would've come for a reduced max anyway compared to other players which made him an automatic bargain, a huge important element to that mistake that just gets glossed over); the 2nd guy was a big/versatile guard that EXCELLED in this triangle when others couldn't (just look at what Shane Larkin had to say about the triangle among other skeptical players/analysts/fans) and was clearly the best player we had to close out the year. As for Ndour, dude was EVERYTHING you could've hoped for in a surprise SL player worth taking a chance on--a legit 2-way energy player, potentially better than Chris Copeland or any other SL invite we've had since I've been following the team. He was worth following up on, esp. when we finally got a glimpse of the money we're talking about--read Berman saying we lost this kid over what, 400k (Cuban gave him what, 600k guaranteed year 1 and we offered 200k)?? Wow...I mean that's chump change. The first words outta my mouth when I found out we lost Ndour were 'how much did Cubes give him'? If it was several million, maybe I could see why they passed but we're talking a few hundred thousand bucks here...All I needed to know... Acy, Early, Galloway, Amundson and Lance Thomas--all made/make more money than that--Ndour has a good chance to be better than any of those guys. That's the bet I'll take...And the Garden would've loved this kid too. ABSOULTELY LOVED HIM!!! For me, the next best thing to building an honest to goodness championship roster and playing meaningful games is watching promising young players develop along the way. We had a good one here imho and pissed it away...

Just when I was starting to get over this gaffe, Knickerblogger.net puts out a great article yesterday on how losing Ndour was a mistake--it's right on the money word for word: http://knickerblogger.net/why-the-new-york-knicks-made-a-mistake-not-keeping-maurice-ndour/. And now Berman's providing good insight into the mistake too: http://nypost.com/2015/07/28/why-knicks-last-ditch-effort-to-sign-maurice-ndour-fell-short/. What are ya gonna do? Still SMH man...

If Monroe is as good as you claim - why did Detroit let him fly?

If Shved is as good as you claim - why did no other NBA team sign him?

To annoint Ndour as an IMPACT NBA player at both ends without even seeing him in an NBA game is pretty funny.

We'll see. Decisions had to be made on the fly and I don't agree with quite a few Phil made here. These 3 players in particular -- Phil apparently wanted them but at unrealistically reduced prices and wasn't nearly aggressive enough to get them in the fold...These are players I wanted along the way. We didn't get/keep any of them. Not a one...We'll see soon enough what type of impact they have (provided their usage is what I envisioned them getting here) and whether or not they could've helped us. I say YES, they could've. A RESOUNDING YES in fact..Absolutely. I trust what my eyes and my gut tells me. No question about it...You say no. OK. LOL...What do you want me to tell ya, buddy? You're entitled to your opinion, as am I...Let's wait and see.. Gotta say though--hard to wrap my head around you and a few others supposedly being Knick fans and not having even the slightest problem with Phil's decision not to add/retain these players. That's mindboggling to me dude, honestly. People are still talking about Mo Ndour days after we let him go. What's that tell ya? Quite a few people out there thought it was a mistake letting that kid go, not just me..

1) Monroe is an offensive PF/C who plays subpar defense. The Knicks have an extremely offensive minded SF/PF who basically operates in the same space as Monroe. Monroe craves the ball to score - sound like someone else on the team? Plus the Knicks drafted a promising offensive minded PF/C. They are constructing a TEAM - this is not Fantasy Basketball. They did not miss out on Monroe - they passed on Monroe for reasons obvious to almost everyone but you.

2) Shved is a JOURNEYMAN SG who played for 4 NBA teams with below average advanced stats. He played 16 games for the Knicks during a period where the team was so out of it and so bad it made the games less than meaningless. You are laying your claim that the guy is some kind of impact player and deserved $2.8 million for a 16 game run of meaningless games. Apparently you know more than every GM in the NBA who let the guy leave to play in Russia.......and to think you question my Knick fanhood based on this obscene expession of logic.

3) Ndour is an undrafted free agent who played in 4 summer league games against D Leaguers - and based on your EYE TEST - you are proclaiming him as an impact NBA player. The only reason 99% of the people here even care about Ndour is because he played for the Knicks summer league affiliate and not some other team. Can we let the kid get through a training camp at least before we have to suffer through your continual 500 word lamentations on the state of the Knicks and how incmpetent Phil is for not signing this kid. Again - very hard to take you seriously.

foosballnick wrote:

Finestrg wrote:

foosballnick wrote:

Finestrg wrote:

misterearl wrote:there, The Answer Man said it.

Interesting... I don't know whether I'd take that bet or not, I actually like D-Will and think he can turn things around and start playing up to his capabilities (Shved finally started well, the best ball of his career in fact, right? Some guys just come on late), but the bottom line for me is that Maurice Ndour is a player--an impact player in the NBA on both ends. As obvious as the sky is blue.. Wish we could've had both. We SHOULD'VE had both on board... No good reason in the world not to. Comes down to thriftiness and laziness--complete miscalculation on Phil's part. 100%. Absolutely no way around it.. We've seen this pattern now with at least 3 players (that we know about)--Greg Monroe, Alexey Shved and Mo Ndour. Up to me, ALL THREE would've been Knicks and all 3 would've been KEY rotation players. The first guy's a 25-yr-old 6'11" 250 lb. PF/C that would've averaged 20/10 for this team for years to come (don't care about what MONROE couldn't do--never once concerned about that. Every player has shortcomings--20/10 is WHAT HE COULD DO!! And he would've come for a reduced max anyway compared to other players which made him an automatic bargain, a huge important element to that mistake that just gets glossed over); the 2nd guy was a big/versatile guard that EXCELLED in this triangle when others couldn't (just look at what Shane Larkin had to say about the triangle among other skeptical players/analysts/fans) and was clearly the best player we had to close out the year. As for Ndour, dude was EVERYTHING you could've hoped for in a surprise SL player worth taking a chance on--a legit 2-way energy player, potentially better than Chris Copeland or any other SL invite we've had since I've been following the team. He was worth following up on, esp. when we finally got a glimpse of the money we're talking about--read Berman saying we lost this kid over what, 400k (Cuban gave him what, 600k guaranteed year 1 and we offered 200k)?? Wow...I mean that's chump change. The first words outta my mouth when I found out we lost Ndour were 'how much did Cubes give him'? If it was several million, maybe I could see why they passed but we're talking a few hundred thousand bucks here...All I needed to know... Acy, Early, Galloway, Amundson and Lance Thomas--all made/make more money than that--Ndour has a good chance to be better than any of those guys. That's the bet I'll take...And the Garden would've loved this kid too. ABSOULTELY LOVED HIM!!! For me, the next best thing to building an honest to goodness championship roster and playing meaningful games is watching promising young players develop along the way. We had a good one here imho and pissed it away...

Just when I was starting to get over this gaffe, Knickerblogger.net puts out a great article yesterday on how losing Ndour was a mistake--it's right on the money word for word: http://knickerblogger.net/why-the-new-york-knicks-made-a-mistake-not-keeping-maurice-ndour/. And now Berman's providing good insight into the mistake too: http://nypost.com/2015/07/28/why-knicks-last-ditch-effort-to-sign-maurice-ndour-fell-short/. What are ya gonna do? Still SMH man...

If Monroe is as good as you claim - why did Detroit let him fly?

If Shved is as good as you claim - why did no other NBA team sign him?

To annoint Ndour as an IMPACT NBA player at both ends without even seeing him in an NBA game is pretty funny.

We'll see. Decisions had to be made on the fly and I don't agree with quite a few Phil made here. These 3 players in particular -- Phil apparently wanted them but at unrealistically reduced prices and wasn't nearly aggressive enough to get them in the fold...These are players I wanted along the way. We didn't get/keep any of them. Not a one...We'll see soon enough what type of impact they have (provided their usage is what I envisioned them getting here) and whether or not they could've helped us. I say YES, they could've. A RESOUNDING YES in fact..Absolutely. I trust what my eyes and my gut tells me. No question about it...You say no. OK. LOL...What do you want me to tell ya, buddy? You're entitled to your opinion, as am I...Let's wait and see.. Gotta say though--hard to wrap my head around you and a few others supposedly being Knick fans and not having even the slightest problem with Phil's decision not to add/retain these players. That's mindboggling to me dude, honestly. People are still talking about Mo Ndour days after we let him go. What's that tell ya? Quite a few people out there thought it was a mistake letting that kid go, not just me..

And there it is. When someone does not agree with your view, you question their fanhood. Sorry, but to many of us, ALL of your posts are headscratchers. Based on what you write, it appears that you believe just putting a bunch of guys you want on the roster constitutes a contending NBA team.

1) Monroe is an offensive PF/C who plays subpar defense. The Knicks have an extremely offensive minded SF/PF who basically operates in the same space as Monroe. Monroe craves the ball to score - sound like someone else on the team? Plus the Knicks drafted a promising offensive minded PF/C. They are constructing a TEAM - this is not Fantasy Basketball. They did not miss out on Monroe - they passed on Monroe for reasons obvious to almost everyone but you.

2) Shved is a JOURNEYMAN SG who played for 4 NBA teams with below average advanced stats. He played 16 games for the Knicks during a period where the team was so out of it and so bad it made the games less than meaningless. You are laying your claim that the guy is some kind of impact player and deserved $2.8 million for a 16 game run of meaningless games. Apparently you know more than every GM in the NBA who let the guy leave to play in Russia.......and to think you question my Knick fanhood based on this obscene expession of logic.

3) Ndour is an undrafted free agent who played in 4 summer league games against D Leaguers - and based on your EYE TEST - you are proclaiming him as an impact NBA player. The only reason 99% of the people here even care about Ndour is because he played for the Knicks summer league affiliate and not some other team. Can we let the kid get through a training camp at least before we have to suffer through your continual 500 word lamentations on the state of the Knicks and how incmpetent Phil is for not signing this kid. Again - very hard to take you seriously.

And there what is, buddy?? I mean there ya go again, foo fighter -- off the rails once again with the personal ****. Look back at our exchanges here -- I didn't seek you out, YOU CHOSE AGAIN TO TAKE ME TO TASK on a position I took on something, going point by point how I supposedly don't make any sense...Says you. Go ask others--our own earthmansurfer, Marc Berman, or the guy that wrote that in-depth 100% accurate blog article on not retaining Ndour if I'm making any sense..If I make no sense to you, why do you bother to respond to everything I wish to talk about? Please don't anymore--it's annoying...I haven't responded to 1 original post or idea you've had. Not one. Nor will I. Why? Because you're out of line and wish to make this more than basketball--impossible to have a basketball conversation with you--it's always about other stuff. Why would I want to get involved in that ****? I don't care about the baby ****, bro -- couldn't care less that you disagree with me and think I make no sense, couldn't care less what you think of me as a poster...You and your buddy newyorker (if you're not the same person) have nothing to say that I wish to discuss with either of you. Your friend's already on ignore. LOL...Yet again another instance here where I comment on an issue, one a care about and feel strongly about, provide what I think is good insight along with links to two sources: a well-known beat reporter's take on matters and a very well-written internet blog article, both which substantiate what I'm talking about yet somehow, I'm an illogical head-scratcher of a poster who only cares about playing fantasy basketball with our roster, makes no sense, is speaking a different language and can't be taken seriously?? LMAO. OK...Then don't take me seriously and stop responding to my posts!! Simple. I really hope this puts an end to this nonsense. It's become tiresome.

Summer league.

there, I said it