NardDogNation wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Holy ****! The Starters are reporting that the Celtics were offering 6- count'em 6- draft picks. WTF are we doing?

The report is that this was offered to the hornets when Winslow was still available at 9. No reports are out there that any other team in the top 9 had this offer. Your question should be asked to mj

So you honestly think that the price-tag for the 4th pick was less than the price-tag for the 9th pick?

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

IMO,
That is pretty bad trade, it is contingent on Bklyn having a TOP DRAFT PICK, and I do not know if next year's draft class is strong or not
It takes time to develop a YOUNG STAR with potential as well, so it will be another year wasted if CA is actually in the plans....

As I do not expect any TOP TIER talents to choose NY under those circumstances, as we at least have a SHOT, next summer if KP surprises some or if CA demands a trade and we get back young players/assets..
Also KP does have ALL STAR potential and I do not know if ALL STAR's that ever choose going to Orlando since Tmac/Grant Hill
Other than that, it has been drafted or traded, but no major signings, a reason they needed to overpay for even Channing Frye, though he had a good stretch on The Sun's, prior to signing that deal with Orlando

With Orlando likely to let Tobias Harris walk, it is likely that would have drafted him at 5
All the drafts I saw had KP go anywhere from 3-5 and there are GM's that do think his potential could be TOP 3...

It would have made sense with KP and Vucevic

Elfrid Payton
Olindipo

SF

KP
Vucevic

NardDogNation wrote:

VCoug wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:If we could've landed the 16th, 28th and the Nets' unprotected 2016 first round pick for the 4th but didn't, Phil needs to be fired. We literally could've walked away with Sam Dekker and Kevin Looney AND STILL added Jerian Grant! That'd be a far better draft for a team in our predicament than what we did.

No way, not interested. I'm not a Porzingis fan but trading 4th overall for two mid-round firsts and another at the bottom of the draft is worse.

Think about the future man. If Lopez opts out and leaves the Nets, that's a lottery pick we'd have in 2016. Even with Lopez, there is a very distinct possibility that its a lottery pick especially if we field a playoff team next season!

And according to THE STARTERS on NBATV, the Celtics were offering 6 draft picks! So that is 3 potential picks (probably 2nd rounders) that need to be factored in!

Even if Lopez leaves it's not hard for me to imagine BK muddling there way to a 7 or 8 seed again. There's a severe dropoff in talent the further you get away from the top of the draft. I'd rather have a chance at an AllStar under our control for at least the next 5 years then multiple chances at solid contributors.

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

Seriously?? Do you follow the draft? Orlando was definitely going to pick him at 5, they were disappointed the Knicks picked Prozingis.

BigRedDog wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

Seriously?? Do you follow the draft? Orlando was definitely going to pick him at 5, they were disappointed the Knicks picked Prozingis.

Members of the New York Knicks’ front office were involved in discussions with Orlando, Phoenix and Boston in the hours leading up to the draft on Thursday, league sources with knowledge of the conversations say.

WaltLongmire wrote:

BigRedDog wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

Seriously?? Do you follow the draft? Orlando was definitely going to pick him at 5, they were disappointed the Knicks picked Prozingis.

Sometimes you have to increase the print size for folks. Perhaps he could tell us why Orlando would want to move up one slot in the draft. I wonder who they were trying to get???

Members of the New York Knicks’ front office were involved in discussions with Orlando, Phoenix and Boston in the hours leading up to the draft on Thursday, league sources with knowledge of the conversations say.

Yeah that is nonsense. From what i read most of those teams were taking Porzingis if he fell to them.

RonRon wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

IMO,
That is pretty bad trade, it is contingent on Bklyn having a TOP DRAFT PICK, and I do not know if next year's draft class is strong or not
It takes time to develop a YOUNG STAR with potential as well, so it will be another year wasted if CA is actually in the plans....

As I do not expect any TOP TIER talents to choose NY under those circumstances, as we at least have a SHOT, next summer if KP surprises some or if CA demands a trade and we get back young players/assets..
Also KP does have ALL STAR potential and I do not know if ALL STAR's that ever choose going to Orlando since Tmac/Grant Hill
Other than that, it has been drafted or traded, but no major signings, a reason they needed to overpay for even Channing Frye, though he had a good stretch on The Sun's, prior to signing that deal with Orlando

With Orlando likely to let Tobias Harris walk, it is likely that would have drafted him at 5
All the drafts I saw had KP go anywhere from 3-5 and there are GM's that do think his potential could be TOP 3...

It would have made sense with KP and Vucevic

Elfrid Payton
Olindipo

SF

KP
Vucevic

Mock drafts are usually wrong, so I'm not terribly concerned about them in this context. Yes, the word on the street was that the Magic would've taken him at 5 but just last year, they had Dante Exum as a lock to end up with them and got it wrong. And like Exum, Kristaps does not fit a particular kind of profile that the Magic seek from their players which makes me skeptical that he truly would've been the pick, especially with Aaron Gordon in the fold. To each his own though. We'll never truely know but as the years pass, we often find out that the Knicks failed to due their due
diligence on these matters.

NardDogNation wrote:

RonRon wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

IMO,
That is pretty bad trade, it is contingent on Bklyn having a TOP DRAFT PICK, and I do not know if next year's draft class is strong or not
It takes time to develop a YOUNG STAR with potential as well, so it will be another year wasted if CA is actually in the plans....

As I do not expect any TOP TIER talents to choose NY under those circumstances, as we at least have a SHOT, next summer if KP surprises some or if CA demands a trade and we get back young players/assets..
Also KP does have ALL STAR potential and I do not know if ALL STAR's that ever choose going to Orlando since Tmac/Grant Hill
Other than that, it has been drafted or traded, but no major signings, a reason they needed to overpay for even Channing Frye, though he had a good stretch on The Sun's, prior to signing that deal with Orlando

With Orlando likely to let Tobias Harris walk, it is likely that would have drafted him at 5
All the drafts I saw had KP go anywhere from 3-5 and there are GM's that do think his potential could be TOP 3...

It would have made sense with KP and Vucevic

Elfrid Payton
Olindipo

SF

KP
Vucevic

Mock drafts are usually wrong, so I'm not terribly concerned about them in this context. Yes, the word on the street was that the Magic would've taken him at 5 but just last year, they had Dante Exum as a lock to end up with them and got it wrong. And like Exum, Kristaps does not fit a particular kind of profile that the Magic seek from their players which makes me skeptical that he truly would've been the pick, especially with Aaron Gordon in the fold. To each his own though. We'll never truely know but as the years pass, we often find out that the Knicks failed to due their due
diligence on these matters.

CrushAlot wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

RonRon wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

IMO,
That is pretty bad trade, it is contingent on Bklyn having a TOP DRAFT PICK, and I do not know if next year's draft class is strong or not
It takes time to develop a YOUNG STAR with potential as well, so it will be another year wasted if CA is actually in the plans....

As I do not expect any TOP TIER talents to choose NY under those circumstances, as we at least have a SHOT, next summer if KP surprises some or if CA demands a trade and we get back young players/assets..
Also KP does have ALL STAR potential and I do not know if ALL STAR's that ever choose going to Orlando since Tmac/Grant Hill
Other than that, it has been drafted or traded, but no major signings, a reason they needed to overpay for even Channing Frye, though he had a good stretch on The Sun's, prior to signing that deal with Orlando

With Orlando likely to let Tobias Harris walk, it is likely that would have drafted him at 5
All the drafts I saw had KP go anywhere from 3-5 and there are GM's that do think his potential could be TOP 3...

It would have made sense with KP and Vucevic

Elfrid Payton
Olindipo

SF

KP
Vucevic

Mock drafts are usually wrong, so I'm not terribly concerned about them in this context. Yes, the word on the street was that the Magic would've taken him at 5 but just last year, they had Dante Exum as a lock to end up with them and got it wrong. And like Exum, Kristaps does not fit a particular kind of profile that the Magic seek from their players which makes me skeptical that he truly would've been the pick, especially with Aaron Gordon in the fold. To each his own though. We'll never truely know but as the years pass, we often find out that the Knicks failed to due their due
diligence on these matters.

Really? Is that the case with the new regime? The reports are that Gaines was scouting Kristaps this past winter and that he was blown away. Kristaps also had a private work out with the Knicks. The Knicks worked out a lot of guys. Gaines is Phil's guy. I think they thoroughly scouted this pick and I also think they worked out a ton of guys in case they had a great offer to move the pick. Apparently nothing was offered for the pick that matched the potential of Prozingis.

"New regime" and yet the same bull**** of trading for overrated/overpaid players that are past their prime (Jose Calderon), while trading viable assets for cents on the dollar (Tyson Chandler) is still occurring. I'm willing to give it a chance but I can't shake the feeling that we again went for the sexy pick. And once again, I have no problem doing that but I just hate doing that so high in the draft.

nixluva wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

RonRon wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:Personally, I think there was a realistic chance for Prozingis to have dropped out of the top 10 had Boston went with Winslow at 4.

Again I couldn't see the Magic taking him at 5 because they draft gritty, defensive guys that are NBA ready, which Porzy is none of. I couldn't see the Kings taking him because they are dumb and are trying to win-now. I couldn't see the Nuggets taking Porzy because Mudiay was higher on their picking order. Couldn't see the Pistons taking him because Van Gundy has tended to be averse to taking on projects. The Hornets definitely were not taking him because they only take 3-4 year college players only. At 10, he becomes more of a realistic pick but Riley tends to shy away from projects and European players, so if he's taken here, I think it is part of a trade. I got a feeling though that they would've taken Cameron Payne instead and call it a day. The Pacers still take Myles Turner if he's available; Cameron Payne if he's not. The Jazz definitely take Prozy if he's available.

At 12 though, I definitely think the Knicks could've traded back up using the 16th and 28th to get Kristaps. We still would've walked away with the same players but would've had the benefit of having the Nets' 2016 1st round pick too!

IMO,
That is pretty bad trade, it is contingent on Bklyn having a TOP DRAFT PICK, and I do not know if next year's draft class is strong or not
It takes time to develop a YOUNG STAR with potential as well, so it will be another year wasted if CA is actually in the plans....

As I do not expect any TOP TIER talents to choose NY under those circumstances, as we at least have a SHOT, next summer if KP surprises some or if CA demands a trade and we get back young players/assets..
Also KP does have ALL STAR potential and I do not know if ALL STAR's that ever choose going to Orlando since Tmac/Grant Hill
Other than that, it has been drafted or traded, but no major signings, a reason they needed to overpay for even Channing Frye, though he had a good stretch on The Sun's, prior to signing that deal with Orlando

With Orlando likely to let Tobias Harris walk, it is likely that would have drafted him at 5
All the drafts I saw had KP go anywhere from 3-5 and there are GM's that do think his potential could be TOP 3...

It would have made sense with KP and Vucevic

Elfrid Payton
Olindipo

SF

KP
Vucevic

Mock drafts are usually wrong, so I'm not terribly concerned about them in this context. Yes, the word on the street was that the Magic would've taken him at 5 but just last year, they had Dante Exum as a lock to end up with them and got it wrong. And like Exum, Kristaps does not fit a particular kind of profile that the Magic seek from their players which makes me skeptical that he truly would've been the pick, especially with Aaron Gordon in the fold. To each his own though. We'll never truely know but as the years pass, we often find out that the Knicks failed to due their due
diligence on these matters.

Really? Is that the case with the new regime? The reports are that Gaines was scouting Kristaps this past winter and that he was blown away. Kristaps also had a private work out with the Knicks. The Knicks worked out a lot of guys. Gaines is Phil's guy. I think they thoroughly scouted this pick and I also think they worked out a ton of guys in case they had a great offer to move the pick. Apparently nothing was offered for the pick that matched the potential of Prozingis.

"New regime" and yet the same bull**** of trading for overrated/overpaid players that are past their prime (Jose Calderon), while trading viable assets for cents on the dollar (Tyson Chandler) is still occurring. I'm willing to give it a chance but I can't shake the feeling that we again went for the sexy pick. And once again, I have no problem doing that but I just hate doing that so high in the draft.

You're fear is based on a lack of knowledge about the Knicks staff. Clarence Gaines Jr. is a legit long time NBA scout. This regime is not like the previous ones. They come from championship organizations. We need to stop believing they are incompetent. They're extremely capable men with proven track records. Eventually everyone will come to recognize this.

Don't ever take the liberty of presuming anything about what I know or don't know. Time will tell what becomes of this move but I have not been encouraged by anything this management has done, aside from acquiring Jerian Grant.