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New mock on dx just came out they moved Stein to 11
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nixluva
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6/22/2015  12:34 PM
BRIGGS wrote:Espn has also moved him down to 11 This am

Meh! This is the kind of thing that is expected at this time of the process. It doesn't mean WCS is not a worthy player but it's mostly about what analysts think is likely to be the preferences of teams as the tea leaves indicate right now. It's actually good news for Phil if he looks to try and make a deal to get more assets. He can get WCS and another player out of this if he plays it right.

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WaltLongmire
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6/22/2015  12:34 PM
blkexec wrote:You see this alot...especially when certain teams want him to slide like the Pacers. It's very easy to put out reports around this time, becasue it's crunch time before the draft. It could also be based on what they think the knicks will do. That has a trickle affect on the other picks. And since Phil is all over the place every other day, I'm not surprised on WCS going from 4 to 11....

I still believe he's the 1 player that would impact this team the most. He's not the best player at 4 and he doesn't have the most upside at 4, but he will be a positive impact on this team for years. He's that security blanket every team needs, which allows you to add almost anybody you want after him, because you know he will bring it on defense. The perfect player Melo needs, next to Winslow, who I still think could be the pick. Melo and Winslow would make each other better! You can't go wrong with either player. Don't sleep on Winslow shot blocking as well.....He's not like WCS, but if I'm not mistaken, he had more blocks than OK4 during thier championship run....

Oh, and if you like HS stats....I beleive Winslow was murdering everybody.....I read a story about a game where he had 40 something, and won the game on a last minute play. So he has a history of winning....and he's a legit two way player. Might be the safest pick at 4.

There was also a play in the state tournament where he broke down his defender, drove, and then passed off to his brother for the game winner when his guy peeled off to stop Winslow.

If you follow the philosophy that you build your team to beat the best opponent in your conference- the Cavs- Winslow might be the only guy coming out of the draft who is quick enough and strong enough to match up with James 1/1.

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blkexec
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6/22/2015  12:47 PM
BRIGGS wrote:Espn has also moved him down to 11 This am

Might just mean Phil is mostlikely to trade the 4th pick....I doubt anybody is looking to trade up for WCS.

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nixluva
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6/22/2015  12:55 PM
blkexec wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Espn has also moved him down to 11 This am

Might just mean Phil is mostlikely to trade the 4th pick....I doubt anybody is looking to trade up for WCS.

If Towns, Okafor, Russell happens I think Phil will likely trade down. WCS would still be in play but nothing is guaranteed. Really depends on what teams offer Phil at that point.

WaltLongmire
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6/22/2015  1:07 PM
wargames wrote:
Speaking on the radio show he shares with former Louisville coach Denny Crum on AM-790 in Louisville, Hall said he’d recently asked Cauley-Stein at a UK practice about the extent of his injury. The junior big man told Hall he’d had a metal plate and three screws inserted to stabilize his ankle.

A UK spokesman could not confirm Hall’s account of Cauley-Stein’s procedure or elaborate in any way.

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/29/willie-cauley-stein-sheds-light-on-injury-he-suffered-in-ncaa-tournament/

It could just be the plate and screws in his ankle and the athletic way he plays....

Why would that come up now, though, since it was known?

Have to figure that teams would already know about it because he was a high profile player at a high profile school. Not like it could be hidden or overlooked.

Seems suspicious to me.

EnySpree: Can we agree to agree not to mention Phil Jackson and triangle for the rest of our lives?
blkexec
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6/22/2015  2:07 PM
WaltLongmire wrote:
wargames wrote:
Speaking on the radio show he shares with former Louisville coach Denny Crum on AM-790 in Louisville, Hall said he’d recently asked Cauley-Stein at a UK practice about the extent of his injury. The junior big man told Hall he’d had a metal plate and three screws inserted to stabilize his ankle.

A UK spokesman could not confirm Hall’s account of Cauley-Stein’s procedure or elaborate in any way.

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/29/willie-cauley-stein-sheds-light-on-injury-he-suffered-in-ncaa-tournament/

It could just be the plate and screws in his ankle and the athletic way he plays....

Why would that come up now, though, since it was known?

Have to figure that teams would already know about it because he was a high profile player at a high profile school. Not like it could be hidden or overlooked.

Seems suspicious to me.

If you were the Pacers, you do what you can to make a player fall in the draft. There's too much money involved with the NBA to not think people will do whatever they can to diminish a players value or increase their value. A simple statement saying, "Mudiay is willing to go up against anybody in the draft" could be a good strategy by an agent, eventhough he would never play against anybody. It's all talk and using Social Media to your advantage. I'm sure there will be more reports coming out as we lead up to draft day.

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jbeachboy
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6/22/2015  2:44 PM
take mudiay
nixluva
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6/22/2015  2:55 PM
jbeachboy wrote:take mudiay

That may end up being the pick, but Phil could also use the #4 to extract more value than just Mudiay alone. The smart play is to see if a team is willing to open up the vault like Boston who have tons of picks or a team that has a current NBA player you like and picks to offer. A player like Hezonja might end up being just as good as Mudiay. It's not about where you pick the player as much as how good the player will actually be and if you can get a good player PLUS picks that's great value.

Moonangie
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6/22/2015  3:02 PM
nixluva wrote:
jbeachboy wrote:take mudiay

That may end up being the pick, but Phil could also use the #4 to extract more value than just Mudiay alone. The smart play is to see if a team is willing to open up the vault like Boston who have tons of picks or a team that has a current NBA player you like and picks to offer. A player like Hezonja might end up being just as good as Mudiay. It's not about where you pick the player as much as how good the player will actually be and if you can get a good player PLUS picks that's great value.

I second that notion: Take Mudiay.

That said, we should CERTAINLY look at all offers pre-draft and see if we can improve our talent via some deal that's "can't be refused". Doubtful anyone in the EC helps out the Knicks, but stranger things have happened.

blkexec
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6/22/2015  3:29 PM
Mudiay at 4 (The next MJ for Phil to mold)
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Stein at 11 (Pacers get their man)
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Kaminsky at 17 (Could be in range if phil gets a second pick)

Monroe
Kaminsky
Melo
Harris / Carroll
Mudiay

http://www.nbadraft.net/2015mock_draft

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crzymdups
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6/22/2015  3:57 PM
I'm bummed about WCS having an injury issue. That sucks.
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nixluva
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6/22/2015  4:19 PM
crzymdups wrote:I'm bummed about WCS having an injury issue. That sucks.

Don't believe the hype, he's no more injured now than he was before and teams knew about his injury history. It's the typical hit job to bring him down to teams that want him lower in the draft. It could work to our advantage having his stock drop like this.

The 2015 NBA Draft is coming up on Thursday, and Willie Cauley-Stein is considered a consensus top-eight player. However, according to a report from DraftExpress.com, his stock may be taking a slight hit heading into the event.

Particularly, the concerns are about the ankle injury he sustained in the 2014 NCAA Tournament. It was a stress fracture that occurred in the team's Sweet 16 game against Louisville.

Five separate NBA teams we spoke with all indicated varying degrees of concern after consulting with their team doctors this week, with some saying it may cost the Kentucky big man a few spots on draft night. “There is some maintenance that needs to be done there, as it's not completely clear whether the injury healed in a proper way. The pin that was inserted is supposed to be sitting at a 90 degree angle, but instead it's at 45 degrees. That, plus some question marks about his background that came up could cause him to drop a few slots.”

DraftExpress.com's president, Jonathan Givony, also reached out to Cauley-Stein's agent for comment, who said this:

“Willie is not stressing about where he goes in this draft, and teams that have done their research know that there is nothing to be concerned about. Martin O'Malley, a renowned ankle and foot specialist in New York, checked his foot out last week and said he's completely fine. Doctor O'Malley is used by almost every team in the NBA, including working with our client Kevin Durant. The fracture has healed and is asymptomatic. Teams who are overly cautious may want to look into an offseason cleanup if we agreed to it, but currently Willie is 100% pain free and not limited in any way. Any team that really looks at this will have no reason for concern. Teams rely on their doctors, and we rely on ours. I told them they can call Doctor O'Malley and many have already.”

Okay, so there's a bit to unpack here. First and foremost, it's worth noting that as Kristaps Porzingis stock has seemingly risen to where he'll probably be taken in the top-five on Thursday, Cauley-Stein's has fallen simply due to team need. The Knicks, Magic and Kings -- teams occupying the No. 4 through No. 6 spots on draft night -- could all use Cauley-Stein, but then the next three teams in the draft order don't actually have a great need for a big man.

He doesn't fit the Nuggets at No. 7 with both Kenneth Faried and Jusuf Nurkic there. The Pistons at No. 8 already have Andre Drummond. At No. 9, the Hornets need shooting and offense more than anything, and Cauley-Stein isn't the kind of guy who is going to create for himself. Once Porzingis stock was affirmed to be as high as it was within NBA front offices, there simply are and will be a limited number of spots for someone like Cauley-Stein to go. That's why in my most recent mock draft, I had Cauley-Stein falling to the Pacers, who traded up to No. 9 to get him from No. 11.

So that's where this leak comes into play. It's always interesting how these reports come out during draft week. Everyone and everything that is said this time of year has an ulterior motive, and here there's a fairly decent chance that while the concerns are assuredly legitimate and the reporting is definitely accurate, teams around the NBA are trying to use this report as a way to get Cauley-Stein to drop to their selection either at the end of the lottery or in the mid-teens. It's a perfectly-timed release in that way, just how something similar was released last season in reference to future No. 7 overall pick Julius Randle.

Of course, there's also the flip side to this, and that's the idea that any time that a seven-footer has any sort of foot problems, it raises a question. Especially when it comes to a player that is so built on athleticism like Cauley-Stein is. So maybe teams in the No. 11 to No. 16 range of the draft get lucky to have a player of Cauley-Stein's considerable skill level fall to them, and just end up having to do a slight clean up surgery to make sure that the foot heals well this offseason.

Even with these issues, I would find it surprising if he fell out of the lottery. He's the No. 8 player on my draft board, and is more in the tier of players with Justise Winslow and Mario Hezonja than he is in the tier of those below him like Devin Booker, Stanley Johnson and Frank Kaminsky. His potential on defense is that of an All-NBA-like performer, and it's just hard to find those kind of big men, especially with the way that he guards the pick-and-roll at seven-feet tall. That's worth the risk of a slight foot injury in the back half of the lottery, given that he played so well on it this year anyway.

WaltLongmire
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6/22/2015  4:40 PM
blkexec wrote:
WaltLongmire wrote:
wargames wrote:
Speaking on the radio show he shares with former Louisville coach Denny Crum on AM-790 in Louisville, Hall said he’d recently asked Cauley-Stein at a UK practice about the extent of his injury. The junior big man told Hall he’d had a metal plate and three screws inserted to stabilize his ankle.

A UK spokesman could not confirm Hall’s account of Cauley-Stein’s procedure or elaborate in any way.

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2014/07/29/willie-cauley-stein-sheds-light-on-injury-he-suffered-in-ncaa-tournament/

It could just be the plate and screws in his ankle and the athletic way he plays....

Why would that come up now, though, since it was known?

Have to figure that teams would already know about it because he was a high profile player at a high profile school. Not like it could be hidden or overlooked.

Seems suspicious to me.

If you were the Pacers, you do what you can to make a player fall in the draft. There's too much money involved with the NBA to not think people will do whatever they can to diminish a players value or increase their value. A simple statement saying, "Mudiay is willing to go up against anybody in the draft" could be a good strategy by an agent, eventhough he would never play against anybody. It's all talk and using Social Media to your advantage. I'm sure there will be more reports coming out as we lead up to draft day.


Understand, but is this actually new stuff?

Mudiay did play against some second round talent at his second LA workout, though.

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wargames
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6/22/2015  6:33 PM
http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Cauley-Steins-Foot-Giving-Lottery-Teams-Pause-5123

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/report--concerns-about-willie-cauley-stein-s-foot--could-cause-him-to-drop-a-few-slots-205443081.html

It's his foot that has team worried.

"Five separate NBA teams we spoke with all indicated varying degrees of concern after consulting with their team doctors this week, with some saying it may cost the Kentucky big man a few spots on draft night. “There is some maintenance that needs to be done there, as it's not completely clear whether the injury healed in a proper way. The pin that was inserted is supposed to be sitting at a 90 degree angle, but instead it's at 45 degrees. That, plus some question marks about his background that came up could cause him to drop a few slots.”
The algorithm gives and the algorithm takes away
crzymdups
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6/22/2015  6:46 PM
wargames wrote:http://www.draftexpress.com/article/Cauley-Steins-Foot-Giving-Lottery-Teams-Pause-5123

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nba-ball-dont-lie/report--concerns-about-willie-cauley-stein-s-foot--could-cause-him-to-drop-a-few-slots-205443081.html

It's his foot that has team worried.

"Five separate NBA teams we spoke with all indicated varying degrees of concern after consulting with their team doctors this week, with some saying it may cost the Kentucky big man a few spots on draft night. “There is some maintenance that needs to be done there, as it's not completely clear whether the injury healed in a proper way. The pin that was inserted is supposed to be sitting at a 90 degree angle, but instead it's at 45 degrees. That, plus some question marks about his background that came up could cause him to drop a few slots.”

Question marks about his background... does that mean a failed drug test or something?

¿ △ ?
New mock on dx just came out they moved Stein to 11

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