CrushAlot wrote:Probably won't pass on Okafor in that case.

Russell may be the better pro.

Assuming the Lakers take Russell. Philly takes OK4 and we get mudiay, Winslow or porzingis. Nothing changed

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Probably won't pass on Okafor in that case.

Russell may be the better pro.

Assuming the Lakers take Russell. Philly takes OK4 and we get mudiay, Winslow or porzingis. Nothing changed

This is getting pretty strange, IMO.

If LA takes OK4, who wanst to be a Laker, allegedly, and Philly then goes big for Porzingis- and not they have a better reason to take him, we might actually have a chance for Russell, another guy nobody expected us to have a chance to draft.

Stranger things have happened.

We don't control our fate in this draft, but something real good is going to fall into our lap at 4, I think, and there may even be some trade down offers because of this.

FistOfOakley wrote:there wasn't anything wrong with hinkie's thinking... if you look at the draft past the first two guys.. wiggins and parker... taking a gamble on embiid was pretty logical at that point... even with all the setbacks it might even still be preferable to have him than just about any other guy in the first round...

there's still time altho it doesn't look good at the moment...

Embiid might have gone higher that year without the injuries, no?

We all talk about high risk/high reward picks, well this was one of them, no doubt about it.

He and Noel would have been some pair to have to handle.

smackeddog wrote:

wargames wrote:I heard a rumor on another forum that the reason the scan was performed was LA was looking to trade down from #2 to #3 to take Russell and gain an asset and in return Philly would of had Okafor available at #3 to put besides Noel. Same rumor says depending on the potential recovery time of Embiid the Lakers & Philly might still do the trade.

All of this leaves the knicks in the same damn spot though or trying to figure out what to do with #4

Interesting- Lakers should still do it if true- they would get the player they want (Russell) AND Embiid (worth taking a chance on, simply because he would just be a freebie). Though maybe they would have to give up

Still not sure what is going on with the 76ers and Russell- why did they book him in for a workout the day they were going to see Porzingis in Las Vegas. And then he cancelled.

Stuff like that adds to the rumor. If LA told him that was their plan I could see why he wouldn't want to workout for Philly because it would be a pointless workout. Especially if they made him aware he would be traded after being drafted. Embiid, Randle, and Russell would be a real nice young core if Embiid & Randle can stay healthy. Okafor and Noel would fit well too if Noel could manage to make a reliable shot from outside the paint, he's shown flashes of the jumper in games so its a possibility.

He might end up becoming a younger version of the older Amare...too brittle physically to ever count on.

I could just here the howls around here if Phil gave up something significant for Embiid...it would be his Eddie Curry moment,

TripleThreat wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:It would seem that the Hinkie analytic model does consider preexisting injuries for large players into the metrics he uses for evaluation.

What Hinkies team building model does account for IMHO is "margin of error"

If the 76ers miss on a lottery pick, the guy just doesn't pan out, it's not great news, but they have the warchest and asset base to recover from it.

The Knicks, have so few assets and are so draft pick barren, that this specific draft, there is immense pressure to "hit" on this pick.

Hinkie took the best overall value at the time off the board. If Embiid doesn't pan out, he doesn't. The 76ers are armed to the teeth with more picks to keep trucking along. At least Hinkie has a plan that exploits the current system and he's stuck to it. And he'll be there, if ownership wants him there, for the next decade or two.

Phil Jackson wanted to make the playoffs, failed, then reshifted to tank, only to jeopardize that tanking with a couple of needless wins at the end of the season. He made two heavily criticized trades and now Melo has a no trade clause. He's got one foot out the door to retirement and there's no guarantee he'll even be alive in ten years, much less be the Knicks key decision maker.

I'm pretty sure every team at the top in the draft had to weigh out Embiid's injury situation. But positional value is positional value. Bigs are always valued and valued to the point where teams take risks on them that they wouldn't for smaller players.

What the 76ers are doing and what the Knicks are doing is like night and day.

At the end of the day, would you rather have Phil Jackson as the key decison maker for the past couple of years, or would have rather have had Hinkie?

I think Hinkie as the Knicks GM and head man would have put the Knicks in a far better position compared to Phil Jackson.

Armed to the teeth with more picks to replace Embiid? He has 2 first rounders and a third one which will likely end up being a second rounder. He is the ultimate case of the emperors new clothes- he has somehow convinced his followers that even when he fails, he wins. His strategy is to build through the draft, but he's blown 2 high picks. Yet his followers are cool with it because he pretends it's all about mathematics. Hilarious stuff! He's the metrics version of Isaiah Thomas!

wargames wrote:

stopstandthere wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Probably won't pass on Okafor in that case.

Sad for Okafor. He does not want to see that.

best case is if Towns and Okafor are off the board Philly takes Porzingis and Russell drops to NY. This news just makes Russell falling more of a possibility.

TripleThreat wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:It would seem that the Hinkie analytic model does consider preexisting injuries for large players into the metrics he uses for evaluation.

What Hinkies team building model does account for IMHO is "margin of error"

If the 76ers miss on a lottery pick, the guy just doesn't pan out, it's not great news, but they have the warchest and asset base to recover from it.

The Knicks, have so few assets and are so draft pick barren, that this specific draft, there is immense pressure to "hit" on this pick.

Hinkie took the best overall value at the time off the board. If Embiid doesn't pan out, he doesn't. The 76ers are armed to the teeth with more picks to keep trucking along. At least Hinkie has a plan that exploits the current system and he's stuck to it. And he'll be there, if ownership wants him there, for the next decade or two.

Phil Jackson wanted to make the playoffs, failed, then reshifted to tank, only to jeopardize that tanking with a couple of needless wins at the end of the season. He made two heavily criticized trades and now Melo has a no trade clause. He's got one foot out the door to retirement and there's no guarantee he'll even be alive in ten years, much less be the Knicks key decision maker.

I'm pretty sure every team at the top in the draft had to weigh out Embiid's injury situation. But positional value is positional value. Bigs are always valued and valued to the point where teams take risks on them that they wouldn't for smaller players.

What the 76ers are doing and what the Knicks are doing is like night and day.

At the end of the day, would you rather have Phil Jackson as the key decison maker for the past couple of years, or would have rather have had Hinkie?

I think Hinkie as the Knicks GM and head man would have put the Knicks in a far better position compared to Phil Jackson.

I agree with the fact that him missing on Embild doesn't hurt as much since they are armed to the teeth in picks. But at the same this isn't NBA2k. And at some point all these assets are going to have to turn into results on the court. Hinkie is great at collecting assets but can he actually build a team that can win on a night to night basis or a championship?

Boston with less assets acquired KG, Ray Allen, Rondo to put together with Pierce and won a championship. Lakers with less assets acquired Gasol, Bynum, Odom, Ariz to go with Kobe and won multiple championships.

Philly has used 2-3 yrs collecting assets yet still don't have a Pierce or a Kobe. MCW produced but wasn't what they wanted and Embild may not recover from all these injuries. They are basically back to the drawing board again. And there is no guarantee that they get one in this draft either. If Embild panned out at least they would have had a franchise player to put all these assets to use to go along with a top 3 pick for a side kick and actually start building a team. Maybe throw max at a Leonard and use some other assets to get a 4th piece. Utah Jazz have more proven young talent with Favors, Hayward, Gobert, Burks, Burke. As well as Exum, Hood, Booker in the wings. Another lottery pick in this yr draft. A 2017 first from OKC and 2nd from Detroit (Kanter trade) and actual competitive basketball showing improvement. Minny is farther along as well with actual proven basketball talent. Boston has a ton of assets as well going forward, yet made the playoffs in the weak east playing competitive basketball to go along with there young talent and ton of future assets.