nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:spurs have earned the right to keep chugging along. a strong culture of winning is attractive. my god gasol and duncan in the same front court LOL the horror!

how's that knicks culture change coming along?

It's still a bit early to be snickering at the Knicks don't you think? Gasol isn't yet on the Spurs and we have drafted or signed any Free Agents. So what's the point of kicking dirt on the rebuilding process? I could understand the criticism if Phil wasn't clearly trying to improve the franchise from top to bottom, but he is. We're at the very beginning of this process and the Spurs are almost 2 decades into their process.

no snickering need be inferred from my statement. as one who has been clamoring for leadership and culture change i am simply asking for a progress report. rookies not named bird, duncan, or johnson are not going to step in and provide leadership and will simply be brought along by those veteran free agents who all just can't wait to come here and play in melo's shadow.

see what i did there?

dk7th wrote:spurs have earned the right to keep chugging along. a strong culture of winning is attractive. my god gasol and duncan in the same front court LOL the horror!

how's that knicks culture change coming along?

Spot on

Panos wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:spurs have earned the right to keep chugging along. a strong culture of winning is attractive. my god gasol and duncan in the same front court LOL the horror!

how's that knicks culture change coming along?

It's still a bit early to be snickering at the Knicks don't you think? Gasol isn't yet on the Spurs and we have drafted or signed any Free Agents. So what's the point of kicking dirt on the rebuilding process? I could understand the criticism if Phil wasn't clearly trying to improve the franchise from top to bottom, but he is. We're at the very beginning of this process and the Spurs are almost 2 decades into their process.

Early? The Knicks have been snicker-worthy for TWO DECADES! Since 1999. That's almost since APARTHEID! Since before Google existed, Since before Mudiay WAS FREAKING BORN!
Even broken clocks are right twice a day, you haven't been right about the Knicks being good since you uploaded your opinion on a 1200 baud modem through America Online

Because you were so adamant in making this point and used your caps, I have to point out that Mudiay was born March 5, 1996, and was therefore alive and well in 1999.

Apartheid ended in the mid-1990s, 1994 is a suggested date, so you have to define the concept of "almost" as it is applied to the fixed period of years you are examining, which is actually 16 years. If you agree that Apartheid ended in 1994, 5 years before 1999, you are talking about an amount of time-5 years- that is a whopping 31% of your 16 year total. I'm not sure you can use the word "almost" when using a 16 year span as your frame of reference and a there is a 5 year, or 31%, distance between the 2 points you are comparing.

Google existed prior to 1999, by the way,
, so you are wrong about that too.

A stopped clock, not a broken one, is right twice a day. A "broken" clock might be too fast or too slow and actually be correct more than twice a day.

I love a well-crafted insult-post, but making your case with blatantly false hyperbole just does not work in a forum where metrics and statistics are so important.

I know that you'll do better next time, slugger.

WaltLongmire wrote:

Panos wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:spurs have earned the right to keep chugging along. a strong culture of winning is attractive. my god gasol and duncan in the same front court LOTurkeyL the horror!

how's that knicks culture change coming along?

It's still a bit early to be snickering at the Knicks don't you think? Gasol isn't yet on the Spurs and we have drafted or signed any Free Agents. So what's the point of kicking dirt on the rebuilding process? I could understand the criticism if Phil wasn't clearly trying to improve the franchise from top to bottom, but he is. We're at the very beginning of this process and the Spurs are almost 2 decades into their process.

Early? The Knicks have been snicker-worthy for TWO DECADES! Since 1999. That's almost since APARTHEID! Since before Google existed, Since before Mudiay WAS FREAKING BORN!
Even broken clocks are right twice a day, you haven't been right about the Knicks being good since you uploaded your opinion on a 1200 baud modem through America Online

I have no desire to over-examine your rant, but you made many mistakes which make me question the validity of your original point.

Because you were so adamant in making this point and used your caps, I have to point out that Mudiay was born March 5, 1996, and was therefore alive and well in 1999.

Apartheid ended in the mid-1990s, 1994 is a suggested date, so you have to define the concept of "almost" as it is applied to the fixed period of years you are examining, which is actually 16 years. If you agree that Apartheid ended in 1994, 5 years before 1999, you are talking about an amount of time-5 years- that is a whopping 31% of your 16 year total. I'm not sure you can use the word "almost" when using a 16 year span as your frame of reference and a there is a 5 year, or 31%, distance between the 2 points you are comparing.

Google existed prior to 1999, by the way,
, so you are wrong about that too.

A stopped clock, not a broken one, is right twice a day. A "broken" clock might be too fast or too slow and actually be correct more than twice a day.

I love a well-crafted insult-post, but making your case with blatantly false hyperbole just does not work in a forum where metrics and statistics are so important.

I know that you'll do better next time, slugger.

Yes, hyperbole. The fact that you went to all that length to prove that these events actually occurred a year or two or five before the last time the Knicks were a relevant team shows just how desperate you are as a Knicks fan to grasp onto straws that they aren't that badly run. They have been a disgrace since, yes, nearly all those things I stated were reality. What's a couple years difference make in the matter?
And for all that time the Spurs have been a model franchise with multiple championships and continuity in the front office and on the bench. They deserve Marc Gssol to go play there. Why should he want to come play for this dysfunction of a team that has $26m to fill out the entire roster aside from Carmelo, THjr, a rookie and a broken down Calderon?

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:spurs have earned the right to keep chugging along. a strong culture of winning is attractive. my god gasol and duncan in the same front court LOL the horror!

how's that knicks culture change coming along?

It's still a bit early to be snickering at the Knicks don't you think? Gasol isn't yet on the Spurs and we have drafted or signed any Free Agents. So what's the point of kicking dirt on the rebuilding process? I could understand the criticism if Phil wasn't clearly trying to improve the franchise from top to bottom, but he is. We're at the very beginning of this process and the Spurs are almost 2 decades into their process.

no snickering need be inferred from my statement. as one who has been clamoring for leadership and culture change i am simply asking for a progress report. rookies not named bird, duncan, or johnson are not going to step in and provide leadership and will simply be brought along by those veteran free agents who all just can't wait to come here and play in melo's shadow.

see what i did there?

I don't see Free Agents feeling like they'd be playing in Melo's shadow. Most players have a big ego and they'd be recruited to come star in NY. It's not like Phil would say to them "don't get your hopes up about being a star in NY, that's Melo's role". There's enough glory to go around if the team starts winning games.

I just think it's a bit much to compare the Knicks stage of progress with a franchise that had Tim Duncan and David Robinson before him. They've been fortunate enough to have Franchise Players overlap, which provided an extreme level of stability and an easier process to put talent around those franchise players. It's a much easier process when you have one of those guys. They're great at what they do, but it all looks so much better when you have an all time great at the center of your team.

since i am constantly reminded that nba is a business by the numerous masters of the universe that plague this forum, here's a little research:

tim duncan, a genuine two-way player, a complete player, a three-time finals mvp, and a great leader:

1999 3.4 million wins the title
2003 12.0 million wins the title
2005 14.3 million wins the title
2007 17.4 million wins the title
2013 9.6 million wins the title, almost
2014 10.3 million wins the title

david robinson:

1999 14.8 million wins the title
2003 10.5 million wins the title

carmelo anthony:

2009 14.4 million makes a conference finals appearance

even adjusting for inflation and salary cap there is a glaring problem you don't want to include in your justifications. when one of the most overrated players in the league gets paid way more than his actual value to the team he is ostensibly employed by, and who has a no-trade clause that unduly empowers him with leverage he has never earned, it is an alienating situation for those looking for work, and likely ruins any effort at the establishing the stability you cite.

TripleThreat wrote:

nixluva wrote:So what's the point of kicking dirt on the rebuilding process?

Phil Jackson wants more slack cut his way, then earn some of that 60 million and actually show up to the freaking NBA Draft.

I see not being at the NBA Draft, esp when you only are getting one first round pick in a three year span, including the likelihood of a future lockout, to be inexcusable.

He can also chill on the Tweeting. The random pot shots at former players, whether they are instigating with Phil or not to start.

I don't think anyone is kicking dirt, there are just some guys here who believe in their own bizarre pipe dreams of gang raping some other team in some series of impossible trades and jumping back into contention in a week or simply have no idea of how the basic CBA/salary cap work and just believe any team build they conceive is possible.

And it's not a true "rebuild", but some of the folks here don't even want to admit that. A true "rebuild" would mean jettisoning veteran players for whatever future assets could be garnered, including trading Melo. What the Knicks are doing is not rebuilding, it's treadmilling. Half the process for them seems to be looking to the future, but they have a ready now player who doesn't reasonably fit any practical rebuild timeline.

The danger for the rest of the league is if some of these guys want to gun for a big contract hope in a few years, thus want to sign short deals, thus will sigh short, cheaper contracts with teams like the Spurs to mass build a super team for a year or two. The danger of a Gasol is any long term deal will eat into his decline phase. That being said, if the Spurs got him and built around him and Leonard and were able to get Ginobili and Duncan back at a super cheap rate, that would be interesting to see.

kahwi leonard will make a cap-crushing 4.5 million next year
tim duncan will likely settle for around 10 million next year, grossly overpaid once again, that greedy bastidge

dk7th wrote:

smackeddog wrote:

StarksEwing1 wrote:Who wouldnt go to the spurs. Lets be honest they are probably the best and most consistent franchise in the last 2 decades. I wish the knicks had half the smarts the spurs have, we would be good better shape

Its not all about winning and brilliantly run organizations- a lot of players look at marketability and also the cities

for winners it's all about winning.

others, by contrast, look at the nba as a cash cow and a marketing opportunity for their brand as digital athletes and to appease their spouses and god forbid not uproot their young children (because that is tantamount to abuse). for them, it is not all about winning.

Still blasting Melo for this? How would things have worked out if he'd signed with the Bulls like all the media claimed he should to 'win'. Oh thats right he would have sacrificed all that money and lost. Brilliant.

Panos wrote:

WaltLongmire wrote:

Panos wrote:

nixluva wrote:

dk7th wrote:spurs have earned the right to keep chugging along. a strong culture of winning is attractive. my god gasol and duncan in the same front court LOTurkeyL the horror!

how's that knicks culture change coming along?

It's still a bit early to be snickering at the Knicks don't you think? Gasol isn't yet on the Spurs and we have drafted or signed any Free Agents. So what's the point of kicking dirt on the rebuilding process? I could understand the criticism if Phil wasn't clearly trying to improve the franchise from top to bottom, but he is. We're at the very beginning of this process and the Spurs are almost 2 decades into their process.

Early? The Knicks have been snicker-worthy for TWO DECADES! Since 1999. That's almost since APARTHEID! Since before Google existed, Since before Mudiay WAS FREAKING BORN!
Even broken clocks are right twice a day, you haven't been right about the Knicks being good since you uploaded your opinion on a 1200 baud modem through America Online

I have no desire to over-examine your rant, but you made many mistakes which make me question the validity of your original point.

Because you were so adamant in making this point and used your caps, I have to point out that Mudiay was born March 5, 1996, and was therefore alive and well in 1999.

Apartheid ended in the mid-1990s, 1994 is a suggested date, so you have to define the concept of "almost" as it is applied to the fixed period of years you are examining, which is actually 16 years. If you agree that Apartheid ended in 1994, 5 years before 1999, you are talking about an amount of time-5 years- that is a whopping 31% of your 16 year total. I'm not sure you can use the word "almost" when using a 16 year span as your frame of reference and a there is a 5 year, or 31%, distance between the 2 points you are comparing.

Google existed prior to 1999, by the way,
, so you are wrong about that too.

A stopped clock, not a broken one, is right twice a day. A "broken" clock might be too fast or too slow and actually be correct more than twice a day.

I love a well-crafted insult-post, but making your case with blatantly false hyperbole just does not work in a forum where metrics and statistics are so important.

I know that you'll do better next time, slugger.

Yes, hyperbole. The fact that you went to all that length to prove that these events actually occurred a year or two or five before the last time the Knicks were a relevant team shows just how desperate you are as a Knicks fan to grasp onto straws that they aren't that badly run. They have been a disgrace since, yes, nearly all those things I stated were reality. What's a couple years difference make in the matter?
And for all that time the Spurs have been a model franchise with multiple championships and continuity in the front office and on the bench. They deserve Marc Gssol to go play there. Why should he want to come play for this dysfunction of a team that has $26m to fill out the entire roster aside from Carmelo, THjr, a rookie and a broken down Calderon?

You're too serious, I went through the lengths I did because as I was enjoying your rant, I initially saw a mathematical issue that was glaring (Mudiay is not 16). Was curious and checked out the other stuff, and though I would have some fun. There was no internet when I was a kid- it is great to have almost instantaneous access to so much information.

Used to be a teacher, a history teacher, in fact- it was my job to evaluate written material.

Many of us are writing "argumentative essays" on UK, hard to challenge a person's opinion, most of the time you have an endless back and forth. I would appreciate everyone telling me that my opinion is always "right," but don't expect this to happen in the near future around here.

However we all try to use factual info to support our opinions when we can, and anyone who does this, should expect to have their info scrutinized.