BRIGGS wrote:

nixluva wrote:This is just pure BULL ISH. You can't just cherry pick the one time the guy has a down set of games and make that the proof that he's not worth Signing.

Playoffs Stats
Season	Age Pos  G   GS  MP   FG   FGA   FG%   3P   3PA   3P%   2P   2PA   2P%   eFG%   FT   FTA   FT%   ORB   DRB   TRB   AST   STL   BLK   TOV   PF   PTS
2010-11	23  SG   4   0   1.8  0.5  1.5   .333  0.3  1.0   .250  0.3  0.5   .500  .417   0.0  0.0   0.0   0.0   0.3   0.3   0.5   0.3   0.3   0.3   0.3  1.3
2011-12	24  SG   14  12  20.6 2.7  6.5   .418  1.4  4.1   .345  1.3  2.4   .545  .527   0.5  0.7  .700   0.2   3.0   3.2   1.1   0.5   0.7   1.1   1.7  7.4
2012-13	25  SG   21  21  31.9 4.0  8.9   .446  2.6  5.4   .482  1.3  3.4   .389  .594   0.6  0.7  .800   0.9   3.3   4.1   1.5   1.0   1.1   0.9   2.4  11.1
2013-14 26  SG   23  23  23.0 3.4  6.9   .491  2.1  4.4   .475  1.3  2.5   .517  .642   0.4  0.5  .818   0.4   2.6   3.0   0.9   1.4   0.7   0.9   2.2  9.3
2014-15	27  SG   6   6   28.2 2.5  8.2   .306  1.5  5.5   .273  1.0  2.7   .375  .398   0.5  0.8  .600   0.8   1.5   2.3   2.0   0.8   0.3   0.8   1.3  7.0

Advanced Stats
Season	Age Tm  Lg  Pos G  MP  PER   TS%   3PAr  FTr   ORB% DRB%  TRB%  AST%  STL%  BLK%  TOV%  USG%  OWS  DWS  WS  WS/48  OBPM  DBPM  BPM  VORP
2010-11	23  SAS NBA SG	4  7   26.0  .417  .667	 .000  0.0  17.0  8.3   70.8  7.6   10.3  14.3  46.9  0.0  0.0  0.0 .027   11.4  12.0  23.4 0.0
2011-12	24  SAS NBA SG	14 289 11.7  .540  .637  .110  1.3  16.3  9.1   7.9   1.3   2.5   13.6  17.8  0.1  0.3  0.4 .065   -0.2  1.6   1.4  0.2
2012-13	25  SAS	NBA SG	21 669 15.2  .605  .613  .081  3.2  11.5  7.5   7.4   1.8   2.6   9.0   15.0  1.2  0.9  2.1 .154   3.7   2.1   5.8  1.2
2013-14 26  SAS	NBA SG	23 529 16.5  .650  .635  .069  2.0  13.0  7.6   5.9   3.1   2.6   10.9  16.1  0.9  1.0  1.9 .172   3.9   3.4   7.3  1.2
2014-15	27  SAS	NBA SG	6  169 6.8   .410  .673  .102  3.1  5.8   4.4   10.5  1.5   0.9   8.9   14.9 -0.1  0.1  0.0 .010		

Look at his full history in terms of his career performance. Last 3 years he was showing great production as a "role player" for his team. Look at his

3pt%, eFG%, TS% and WS/48 in the previous playoffs.

Hes a role player and he cant get to the FT line. Many of his shots are created by the spacing the Spurs receive by having Tim Duncan in the post. On the other end same rules apply--he can play up on his man because he has two 7 footers protecting the basket. So he can make plays by over extending without thinking twice.

Now I agree that Danny Green is not a strong penetration guard, but that is not to say that he never drives or scores inside.

nixluva wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:nix, you can post all the shotcharts in the world. danny green is nothing more than a system guard who shoots 3's, most of the time wide-open. he looks especially good because he's playing next to tim duncan, ginoboli, parker kawhi. the guy doesn't deserve big money, if he's wise, he'll stay in san antonio where the the system and players around him, suit him.

Who said anything about paying him "big money"? I'm saying that he's a much better player than anyone we have playing SG. He's a very good defender and a very efficient scorer. I think people seem to think that somehow him being a role player is a negative, when in fact if we did draft a big and add another big in FA, then we would need a SG who can be effective without having to run a ton of plays for him. Green has a role where he is moving and cutting and then catching and shooting. This is no different than Wesley Matthews, Ray Allen or Kyle Korver! 3 and D guards are a very real and useful thing in the NBA.

I'd like to know which SG do you guys think we can get this summer who would be better than Danny Green?

Rk  Player        Pos Age Tm   G   MP    PER   TS%   3PAr  FTr   ORB%  DRB%  TRB%  AST%  STL% BLK% TOV%  USG%  OWS  DWS  WS   WS/48 ▾ VORP
1   Jimmy Butler  SG  25  CHI  65  2513  21.3  .583  .212  .508  5.1   11.2  8.2   14.4  2.3  1.0  7.7   21.6  8.2  3.0  11.2  .214    4.2
2   Danny Green	  SG  27  SAS  81  2312  16.5  .596  .619  .172  2.7   13.9  8.4   10.3  2.2  2.8  10.5  17.5  4.0  3.9  7.8   .163    4.1
3   W. Matthews	  SG  28  POR  60  2024  16.1  .586  .592  .193  2.1   9.5   5.9   10.8  1.9  0.4  9.0   19.8  4.0  2.2  6.2   .147    3.0
4   Alexey Shved  SG  26  TOT  42  767   19.5  .541  .415  .448  3.3   11.7  7.3   25.7  2.0  0.6  10.7  26.3  1.7  0.5  2.2   .135    0.5
5   Mar Belinelli SG  28  SAS  62  1388  12.4  .553  .489  .211  2.2   10.5  6.4   10.3  1.1  0.2  10.6  18.8  1.5  1.4  2.9   .100    0.5

well to leave the spurs, he's doing to require big money. of course guys who shoot the 3 and play defense are synonymous with any contending team, but we're better off finding our own instead of paying for one, especially one who is playing on a team that makes ALL players look good. our money is much better utilized in other places than buying role players.

smackeddog wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

smackeddog wrote:We should only judge players on their most recent 6 games when deciding which free agents to sign- that is a recipe for success!

6 games--hes been a role player is whole career

We need role players and Phil has said the aim will not be to land the big name max guys, but likely we will target a few 2nd and 3rd their players. I'm not saying crazy money for Green, but 6 or 7 mil would be fine, if we have it left over.

nixluva wrote:

knickscity wrote:It would likely take over 10 mil starting to get Green to leave SA. he's making 4 mil now, and I can see them easily paying him 7 starting. 10 is too much for a systematic roleplayer.

Well perhaps the Knicks are willing to pay $10 mil or maybe they can get him for just under that. IMO he would be worth it. He's much more than people are trying to make him out to be. His advanced stats suggest that he's only behind Jimmy Butler among FA SG's. His defensive stats are even better than Jimmy Butler. I know people tend to make up their minds about players but that's why I post advanced stats to back up the truth about players.

Green is not an elite athletic SG, but he's 6'6.5", he's got good defensive instincts, quick hands and he's long, 6'10" wingspan. So he is more than just a role player. He's one of the best 2 way SG's in the league. He gets underrated because of the team he plays for and that he's not fancy or explosive. He's merely a highly productive and winning player.

Still wouldnt pay over 10, and I cant see him leaving for less. He's on a contender and he's already a starter. Other than money it makes no sense for him to leave.

nixluva wrote:

knickscity wrote:It would likely take over 10 mil starting to get Green to leave SA. he's making 4 mil now, and I can see them easily paying him 7 starting. 10 is too much for a systematic roleplayer.

Well perhaps the Knicks are willing to pay $10 mil or maybe they can get him for just under that. IMO he would be worth it. He's much more than people are trying to make him out to be. His advanced stats suggest that he's only behind Jimmy Butler among FA SG's. His defensive stats are even better than Jimmy Butler. I know people tend to make up their minds about players but that's why I post advanced stats to back up the truth about players.

Green is not an elite athletic SG, but he's 6'6.5", he's got good defensive instincts, quick hands and he's long, 6'10" wingspan. So he is more than just a role player. He's one of the best 2 way SG's in the league. He gets underrated because of the team he plays for and that he's not fancy or explosive. He's merely a highly productive and winning player.

yellowboy90 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I'd take Green at $8-10m over Monte "get to the basket" Ellis at $15m. I'd also take him over Aaron Afflalo.. What exactly do people expect to offer starting caliper FAs when the cap is about to explode?

Monta has never made 15 and currently makes around 8. he's definitely at great value for what he produces. Now sure why promoting bad spending is equating the cap spike. More money to spend dont mean spend it like a fool who never had it before.

No one is promoting bad spending but I am making assumption based on how players were paid in the pass and including market value inflation. J.J. Redick signed a 4 year / $27,755,000 contract in 2013-2014 and Trevor Ariza signed a 4 year / $32,000,002 contract in 2014-2015, those two player are similar to Green. He has the 3pt shooting track record like(not exactly) Redick and w defensive track record like Ariza, so shouldn't we expect him to get similar money? Keep in mind the ages of those FAs and those players were signed in a lower cap than what next year will be. Redick and Ariza are just two examples there are more past wing signings that will help get a clearer picture. On top of that you probably need to look around the league and examine the 2 guard market.

Re Ellis: thats a number I think he will ask for this summer if he opts out.

knickscity wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:

knickscity wrote:

yellowboy90 wrote:I'd take Green at $8-10m over Monte "get to the basket" Ellis at $15m. I'd also take him over Aaron Afflalo.. What exactly do people expect to offer starting caliper FAs when the cap is about to explode?

Monta has never made 15 and currently makes around 8. he's definitely at great value for what he produces. Now sure why promoting bad spending is equating the cap spike. More money to spend dont mean spend it like a fool who never had it before.

No one is promoting bad spending but I am making assumption based on how players were paid in the pass and including market value inflation. J.J. Redick signed a 4 year / $27,755,000 contract in 2013-2014 and Trevor Ariza signed a 4 year / $32,000,002 contract in 2014-2015, those two player are similar to Green. He has the 3pt shooting track record like(not exactly) Redick and w defensive track record like Ariza, so shouldn't we expect him to get similar money? Keep in mind the ages of those FAs and those players were signed in a lower cap than what next year will be. Redick and Ariza are just two examples there are more past wing signings that will help get a clearer picture. On top of that you probably need to look around the league and examine the 2 guard market.

Re Ellis: thats a number I think he will ask for this summer if he opts out.

Actually I dont think it's expected, I do think he'll stay in SA.

That's higly likely but why would they want some guy at 8m-10m when they can get a D-leaguer.

The Spurs are in such great shape they can do so many things in FA.