callmened wrote:

Swishfm3 wrote:

callmened wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:Heard an OKC beat writer on Gottlieb's show today saying that he expects the Thunder to match any offers Kanter gets in free agency.

thats what ive been trying to say for weeks...lol...but no one is listening to me. hes not the only one who thinks hes good. OKC thinks hes good. lol

everyone has you on ignore

exactly. lol. everyone is talking about a player that wont even come here. lol

who is everyone?

Briggs creates 4 threads a day on him.

I would rather talk about how good Kelly O looked

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Enes is one of the top tier guys. In terms of statistical analysis he would be the top free agent if you took just his 26 games in OKC and you add in 22 years old--you look at what Brook Lopez has done in the east--it's a no brainer.

Id like to hear anyone critical of this to tell me a better attainable FA. Just 1.

It's not about stats but adding winning pieces..U can't max a guy out based on 26 games..Especially a center who plays no defense..Look at teams that has won Championships in the 30 years, they all have had one or more elite defenders on their front lines..

I agree with you--the problem is there is no triple threat post player available. So you go with the highest rated one--one that can get you 25-10 and like he said himself--work hard on his own footwork during the offseason for the D. Hes young--if he workds hard on D he'll be more than fine. But that doesnt mean we dont need a shot blocker on the team. I view Kanter a 4 man. I dont even mind having Okafor and Kanter on the team--we can bridge that with Cole A and a shot blocker. If we have a skilled bully like frontline--we will have HUGE advantages in the weak east. We have to accept LBJ is on the Cavs--we need to find our own strengths--to me the pivot is the smartest--because if you have a good pivot--you give space to your shooters and drivers. You open up passing lanes and higher % shots.

I know they just fired the coach and if they sign a defensive coach then kanter might be out. But okc really really likes kanter

BRIGGS wrote:Enes is one of the top tier guys. In terms of statistical analysis he would be the top free agent if you took just his 26 games in OKC and you add in 22 years old--you look at what Brook Lopez has done in the east--it's a no brainer.

Id like to hear anyone critical of this to tell me a better attainable FA. Just 1.

I would take Deandre Jordan over Kanter any day. While Jordan is more limited offensively, I don't think the Knicks are at a shortage with shots taken. His defense and rebounding are stellar. Statistically, his WS, PER and VORP crush Kanter's and he does it with a 13% usage rate. At 26 years old, age is not a factor and there is no risk that he is something different than what he is. Statistically, Deandre Jordan is the better player. Worst thing about Jordan is that he can't hit a free throw for the life of him. I would put Jordan at C next to Towns at PF and dare opposing teams to drive.

Better yet, Jordan is not a RFA. We don't need an arduous contract to get him to sign. We can give him a 1+1 contract, and let him opt out next year to get a pay increase under the new cap.

That said, the 7 year vets with the 20MM (30% of cap) contracts are hard for us to obtain at this point with all the needs we have. So his max contract costs approximately $4MM more than Kanter's.

Make any lineup you want, though, it looks pretty good with Jordan at center. Money for a PF becomes an issue if we don't get Towns.

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Knicks need top talent. This thing that were going to find 2-3 7mm $ players and somehow come back is hogwash. This is a big time player who would help others improve. We can go out and spend 26mm on guys like Green Koufus and Carroll and will still wim 22 games. We cant spend 26mm on secondary guys--we need a big dog.

Kanter is not a top talent if you look at the rest of his career outside of the 26 games in OKC where he is shooting 56% and 11 boards...His career numbers are 14 pts(49%) and 8 boards with no defense..That doesn't scream top talent to me...That screams a guy trying his hardest in a contract month and a half..The team that drafted him didn't think he was the future..Way too much risk of a max contract on a career average player with less than average defense..

What risk---a max contract is a 40 discount to the 2017 market.

Presti is scared someone will offer him that max or he wouldnt shelling out PR's.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/237537/Thunder-Confident-Enes-Kanter-Will-Re-Sign

crzymdups wrote:The thing with the rising salary cap is that every single RFA will have their offer matched this summer. It's the best off-season ever for a team to re-sign their own RFAs, because they know they are absolutely getting a discount.

The big question is - how many free agents will take a one year deal, or two year deal with a player option on Year Two to get much bigger contracts next off-season?

I've looked 4ward at OKC salary cap--IF they have to pay Kanter 16-17mm per then when Durant and Westbrook will be eligible for 28-30mm contracts each--theyd have to trade Kanter or other players. If you add in no trade clauses and big trade kickers--its kind of deterrent.

If we dont have a plan of aggression--we will be left behind. Im not even that high on free agency--just like you said--the players that matter are not going to move. OKC MIGHT be the only exception with what they have on their plate. We could potentially get Greg Monroe--but Im very skeptical about his skills and desire. Hes a numbers guy that kind of tops out at 15 points for a reason.

2 questions:

(1) Gimmie a realistic scenario how we pry Kanter away from OKC. Fact of the matter is we had a much better chance at getting this dude if he stayed in Utah. Now that he was acquired by another team that surrendered a couple big assets to get him, I can't picture OKC letting him get away -- esp. when you consider he's a 'lower max' player as opposed to other vet types (easier to keep) AND considering he's played extremely well for the Thunder. What's the most realistic scenario where we can get this guy because I just don't see it now anymore? A poison pill deal??

(2) What's up with his knee? I saw you guys talking about him getting arthroscopic surgery on his knee yesterday. What's the severity? Minor? Major? Somewhere in the middle? Can't be that bad if he's talking about working on his D/improving his defensive footwork with smaller, much quicker PGs during the off-season. Any cause for concern here at all?

My thinking on our off-season plan hasn't changed much from weeks ago --

Step 1: Absolutely make and keep a selection in the 1-3 range -- Towns, Okafor then Winslow. That's my top 3, in that order. After that, I dunno man. I guess you take Russell with the 4th pick and be happy but I gotta tell ya, I just don't love him as much as others. I think I'd prefer a plan where we target solid role-playing 2Gs on the cheap, rather than using our draft pick or a sizable portion of our cap space on a SG. And if we drop to 5, then what? I was big on Mudiay weeks ago but I tend to agree with a lot of you guys now -- what do we really know about him or Hezonja? I think at 5, maybe you look to trade down, maybe involve a 3rd team and put THJ, Early, Galloway and cash on the table and see if we can come up with a big (Myles Turner, Kaminsky, Stein, Lyles) AND a guard (Jerian Grant)?? Or we say F it and take Mudiay or Hezonja there and see the value in moving forward with a talented, salary-controlled #5 pick. I'd just hate to see an Isiah Thomas/Scott Laden shortsighted-type move here i.e. trading away the 4th or 5th pick to a team for some package of high-cost veterans that clearly won't be good enough to win with. That's what scares me the most. I don't want that -- I say at 4 or 5 either make and keep the pick OR trade down to get 2 or more lower picks in the draft. But get something out of this draft!! Use the cap space for FA (where we don't have to surrender anything), not for trades unless it's an absolute no-brainer.

2: Max offer for Kanter right away - pleasantly surprised if we can get him but not expecting it.

3: Ditto PG Brandon Knight -- same deal.

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4: Sign Alexis Ajinca.

5: Sign PG Cory Joseph, even on an overpay (unless we get Knight). I want the team to conduct a full analysis of SA's cap situation both now and a few years out to ascertain what the Spurs' limit to keep him might be...Get a true PG upgrade. Phil's already talking about not being around for when this team turns the corner. If he leaves, he takes his triangle with him. "The triangle doesn't call for a top PG" is nonsense. It's one of the most important positions on the floor. I want that position upgraded and covered for now and future. Bringing back Jeremy Lin is a 3rd idea. Knight, Joseph and Lin in that order (unless we get a PG in the draft (Mudiay, a trade down for Grant, etc.).

6: Sign Shved. It'd be nice if we can get everything else done first and then exceed the cap to sign Shved. I thought I heard that -- don't know if that's even possible or if he'd be patient enough to wait like that. If there's an angle to work here that benefits us somehow, try to execute it. If not, sign the dude sooner with a portion of the cap space. Either way--bring him back.

7: Sign Lavoy Allen.

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8: Sign Scotty Hopson (or Kevin Murphy, Orlando Johnson, Dominique Jones, Doron Lamb).

9: Sign Khem Birch.

10: Sign Eric Griffin.

11: Sign Jordan Bachynski and/or retain Cole Aldrich.

12: Retain Ledo and Galloway.

13: Bring up/incorporate Thanasis.

14: Consider signing E'Twaun Moore and/or Cameron Bairstow if their team options aren't picked up (2 players that could exceed expectations with expanded roles).

15: Consider signing (if his team option isn't picked up) or trading for Dwight Powell (THJ and Early are on the table). Another player that could exceed expectations with an expanded role.

Probably a step or 2 too many here but this is the off-season blueprint I'd be looking to work from to improve this team.

BRIGGS wrote:

holfresh wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Knicks need top talent. This thing that were going to find 2-3 7mm $ players and somehow come back is hogwash. This is a big time player who would help others improve. We can go out and spend 26mm on guys like Green Koufus and Carroll and will still wim 22 games. We cant spend 26mm on secondary guys--we need a big dog.

Kanter is not a top talent if you look at the rest of his career outside of the 26 games in OKC where he is shooting 56% and 11 boards...His career numbers are 14 pts(49%) and 8 boards with no defense..That doesn't scream top talent to me...That screams a guy trying his hardest in a contract month and a half..The team that drafted him didn't think he was the future..Way too much risk of a max contract on a career average player with less than average defense..

holfresh, doenst it strike you as odd that Sam Presti would go out of his way to release PR about Kanter? I mean Sam Presti is a pretty smart guy right? If hes that confident why would he need to put out PR?

Good call. Maybe it is nothing more than pseudo deterrence and noise...I'd like to see us put it to the test immediately---within the first couple of days of FA, meet with Kanter and offer the dude the max, maybe even a posion pill deal.