BRIGGS wrote:

Hector wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Hector wrote:Any team could have has this guy 3 different times this year. I think all teams know what this guy is about.

Do you think it was just divine intervention that The Knicks got him?
Some people may have him as an all star next year but safe to say the GM's out there aren't
sweating trying to sign him out from under The Knicks.

He didnt get the burn anywhere like he is getting here. I also see this guy somewhere in the next 15 having a real eye opening game--like 32 points 8 assists 6 rebounds type. If this kid commits to weight training and honing that jumper--he'll be a very nice player for a team for the next 7-8 years.

Id rather see us keeping his minutes at 24 and keeping the numbers down. I think they can see what he is capable of.

Hector clearly doesn't know much about Shved but Phil and his staff did. The reason you know that is cuz they didn't just get Shved as a throw in. They actually used part of one of the Trade Exceptions in order to get Shved. Those who are pissin on the idea of Shved don't realize that he was targeted and not just a throw in. He's always had talent. He just didn't have the right situation to show what he could do. Here has had that chance and you can see his skills are legit. Like you said BRIGGS, if he can get with a real conditioning program he can really improve his game going forward. I don't think Phil will let him get away. He's a very good fit for this team as Phil had hoped when he used that Trade Exception to get him.

Yeah, okay genius. Keep slurping your knick kool aid, maybe you'll get a pat on the head from Alexey while your waiting out side the garden for an autograph.

He's got to raise his fg 5% just to hit 39 for his career - keep working at it son, you'll be at 50% by the time your 60.

Amazing. I'm not even trying to kill this guy, it's just the ways some of you guys suck on him, like you knew all along that he was gonna be some future hall of famer. It's a joke. He was traded twice this year, anyone could have got him, but they're gonna wait 'till the summer just to out bid the Knicks.

Anytime someone does something, they're the next coming of one hall of famer or another.

If you don't suck Knick penis at this place, you're either a troll, or you know nothing, right?

Suckers.

Thats kind of inappropriate type talk there--I'm sure you'd be smart to delete some of that.

I don't know what these same people would do if the player we drafted turned into a superstar. It just defies logic to watch a player do well and still have a negative take on that player. These guys that we have are all rejects who have been thrust into this situation and are trying to make the best of it. They're really trying to prove themselves and we should be proud of that.

Hector wrote:I'm sure you knew all along about Shved - just like BRIGGS.
Only problem with him, he throws so much **** at the wall, one day some of it is gonna stick.

BRIGGS wrote:There are 30 teams out there with a full MLE and dire need for PG play. A 30 game high quality sample is much more than enough for any one of these teams to commit 4 years 24mm for Alex. Knick have to be careful here balancing down the last 15 games unless their goal is to lose pole position in the draft and actually drive up the cost of their own players they couldve owned for real cheap if we keep their minutes at 50% output.

IMHO, point guard has quite a bit of league wide depth. It's just that the badly run franchises tend to struggle to fill the point guard position. Bledsoe dangled on the market, Rondo was in a holding pattern, lots of PGs moved at the deadline precisely because they are considered replaceable, except the very top shelf elite guys, across the board.

What might have a high demand structure in the NBA marketplace is LOW COST/LOW COMMITMENT backup point guards. There might be strong competition there for a heady veteran who isn't asking to break the bank and who can stabilize the 2nd unit offense on most teams.

Schved is a career 37 percent shooter. He has a three ball, it's not elite. Right now he's shooting a bit over his career norms so over time, a bit of regression is likely. If the Knicks offered him 4 for 24, IMHO, they'd be bidding against themselves.

Teams aren't going to be salivating over a poor shooting combo guard who doesn't offer the desirable "3 And D" combo that teams want from their reserve backcourt unit.

His value to another team has to be tempered against what he will do in a reserve role, with fewer minutes, with a higher expectation of efficiency. I've said this before, the Knicks could sign a street free agent like Byron Mullens for the league vets minimum, and if you gave him 35 minutes a game and a pure green light, he could start bombing away and give you 20 points and 10 rebounds a night. Except he'd hurt you in so many ways other than those few counting stats that you'd consistently lose with a guy like him in your lineup as a starter. And as a reserve, he has limited utility for the kind of role that teams need from their 2nd unit guys. Which is why he's a street free agent in the first place.

Volume has to be seen in context.

I think Schved does a lot of things well, including penetrating to the cup and breaking down a perimeter defense, something sorely lacking for the Knicks, but other players can give you that, the Knicks just have to go out and draft them/mine them from less expensive sources than a 6 million AAV over four years.

What Briggs suggests and his methodology is EXACTLY why the current Knicks are in this franchise hell in the first place. Reactionary and impulsive. Just looking at the latest hot flavor of the week without any real context. Taking a miniscule sample size and trying to project it into something completely incongruent to a players career trends and norms.

Other than Galloway, it's spare parts, journeymen and roster churn. Don't get me wrong, I can appreciate a guy who wants to stay in the league as long as he can and try to carve out a niche. But the reason Admundson, Smith, Thomas, Schved and such were available was because they were roster churn that wouldn't make the 15 man unit in just about every other NBA roster.

Can Schved have a future, even a long term one, with the Knicks? Yes

But it doesn't mean the Knicks should literally bid against themselves for him and commit against such a small sample size for a guy who was likely on the edge of having to go back to Europe to play ball. I'm sure we've all been well versed when Old Man Steinbrenner was alive, watching him bid against himself, driving up the price, hurting the team for it, because he wanted a new shiny bauble for the collection.

franco12 wrote:He may follow a similar career arc to Goran Dragic who was a no body his first 4 years in the league.

I'm not saying he will be as good, just that some players take a while.

BRIGGS wrote:

Hector wrote:

nixluva wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

Hector wrote:Any team could have has this guy 3 different times this year. I think all teams know what this guy is about.

Do you think it was just divine intervention that The Knicks got him?
Some people may have him as an all star next year but safe to say the GM's out there aren't
sweating trying to sign him out from under The Knicks.

He didnt get the burn anywhere like he is getting here. I also see this guy somewhere in the next 15 having a real eye opening game--like 32 points 8 assists 6 rebounds type. If this kid commits to weight training and honing that jumper--he'll be a very nice player for a team for the next 7-8 years.

Id rather see us keeping his minutes at 24 and keeping the numbers down. I think they can see what he is capable of.

Hector clearly doesn't know much about Shved but Phil and his staff did. The reason you know that is cuz they didn't just get Shved as a throw in. They actually used part of one of the Trade Exceptions in order to get Shved. Those who are pissin on the idea of Shved don't realize that he was targeted and not just a throw in. He's always had talent. He just didn't have the right situation to show what he could do. Here has had that chance and you can see his skills are legit. Like you said BRIGGS, if he can get with a real conditioning program he can really improve his game going forward. I don't think Phil will let him get away. He's a very good fit for this team as Phil had hoped when he used that Trade Exception to get him.

Yeah, okay genius. Keep slurping your knick kool aid, maybe you'll get a pat on the head from Alexey while your waiting out side the garden for an autograph.

He's got to raise his fg 5% just to hit 39 for his career - keep working at it son, you'll be at 50% by the time your 60.

Amazing. I'm not even trying to kill this guy, it's just the ways some of you guys suck on him, like you knew all along that he was gonna be some future hall of famer. It's a joke. He was traded twice this year, anyone could have got him, but they're gonna wait 'till the summer just to out bid the Knicks.

Anytime someone does something, they're the next coming of one hall of famer or another.

If you don't suck Knick penis at this place, you're either a troll, or you know nothing, right?

Suckers.

Thats kind of inappropriate type talk there--I'm sure you'd be smart to delete some of that.

I dont think anybody will over pay for him. Unless its that Russian owner. Its clear hes backup material getting starter minutes. But his skill set fits our system and nobody knew that until he played major minutes. He was on his way out of the league and we revived him. Hopefully he learns from LINSANITY and stays put. Nobody will give him more playing on a bigger stage than NYC.

Hopefully it works out for the best. He's putting up numbers. It is March though - THE month for showing flashes of a real good game. Lots of players are killing it right now.

BRIGGS wrote:

Hector wrote:I'm sure you knew all along about Shved - just like BRIGGS.
Only problem with him, he throws so much **** at the wall, one day some of it is gonna stick.

Actually when we got Alex I said that he was tall and not very good. You can go back and look at my comments. I also one said that Rudy Gobert was not coordinated and was not interested in making the 24th pick with him. I say stuff that is wrong probably daily.

The things that continues to impress me about Shved is his passing. He's a good rebounder. His shot looks good but results may vary. He's good defender. He's a good slasher. Has an excellent handle. He's tall but not very long.. he's played very well since being here, but his passing really truly makes the game easier for other players.

What gives me promise about Shved is he's not really doing anything folks havent seen before, he's just more consistent. He's still shooting less than 40% which sucks but he's doing everything else and the Knicks are better when he's on the floor.

Lets say with Jose out we see Shved continue on the pace he's on. I think MLE is exactly right, and this is the offer we should start with. He's bounced around a ton. A 4 year $25mm is a bit above the MLE and thats a very good offer.

I do think Shved is a 'rhythm player' meaning he needs minutes to be on the floor, so I would look to play him 30 minutes a night, and you figure the good passing, rebounding and defense will balance out his bad shooting nights.

He can play the 1,2 maybe some 3 in small lineups. He could start, he could be the first guard off the bench... he could be a very nice piece moving forward.

I mean look at Hassan Whiteside... everyone around here is drooling and wondering why we dont get scrap heap guys with that kind of upside. Well, maybe now we do so the time is coming when you decide if you want to keep your talent and pay or let it walk.

So to recap:
Barring a total nosedive in quality of play YES to offering Shved the MLE. a productive PG filling out the stat sheet at $5mm a year is also a nice piece to have in deals etc as well.

nyk4ever wrote:so he went from a "tall pg who can't shoot" to a guy teams are going to bid up, in just a month? what will he be next?

nyk4ever wrote:

fishmike wrote:

nyk4ever wrote:so he went from a "tall pg who can't shoot" to a guy teams are going to bid up, in just a month? what will he be next?

what do you look for when offering the MLE? Veterans who no longer play at the level they once did but are still good in smaller stretches, or guys who might have upside. Shved strikes me as the perfect MLE type gamble for teams that can afford it. I mean what do we do around here but dig and try to find cheap guys with upside. Shved just led the Knicks to a win over the Spurs, and played very good D in doing so. People are going to start noticing very soon.

in reference to both you AND blxexec, i was more so talking about briggs, who i think totally jumped the gun on calling shved a bust before he even played a game with us. i actually love the way shved plays and think he's a perfect fit for our offense. his ability to drive and dish is almost uncanny and he always seems to find a way to penetrate and get a good shot at the hoop. i totally agree with your statement about him being a rhythym player, i feel like this offense gives him the opportunity to play in rhythm more so than any other place he's been. i would totally pay hi m to come back here, i think he fits in great as a backup PG for us

but yeah, my comment, was more directed at briggs and that i thought he jumped the gun calling him just a "tall pg who isn't very good" which i didnt think was very fair at all.