BRIGGS wrote:

TripleThreat wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Not even listed on NBA mocks anywhere. I believe very strongly that Rakeem Christmas is the #1 MOST under rated basketball player compared to posted mock drfat positioning #54 DX #30 NBA draft.net--I think he's an Antonio Mcdyess clone

It's not just his age.

Always a troubling issue to see in a young big man is his footwork. While no one expects Tim Duncan like fundamentals out of a potential fringe draft/possible sleeper prospect, my take on Christmas is his general footwork is mediocre. There's a reason he's fallen off the map a bit. A lot of his bread and butter is around the rim, and while that might fly in the college game, without an expanded offensive arsenal, he would be much easier to neutralize in the pro game.

Another reason IMHO that big men tend to fall from the college ranks is that many have poor use of leverage concepts. Lots of big men play much smaller than their true size/potential and many players ( like a Dwayne Wade or Chuck Hayes) use their leverage to play much bigger and against bigger counterparts. From a leverage standpoint, there are things that Christmas gets away with at the college level that won't work for him in the pros. The margin for error for being out of position then relying on your athleticism to recover for you, for most players and esp players in Christmas' range, in the NBA is miniscule.

There are aspects of situational awareness that seems lacking from Christmas on the defensive end. IMHO, he does a poor job of reading the base offensive set and compounded with his footwork, would make him much easier to exploit at the pro level. It's not just having the ability to play above the rim, it's knowing when you should be playing above the rim.

Can he hit the three ball? No. Which means he's going to kill your spacing and efficiency since his around the rim game will be severely challenged at the NBA level.

Being older also means there's less likely room for leaps in development at the pro level. It's not impossible, but the expectation is that an older college player, where much of his more talented peers have left the team, should step up and start to dominate the competition. A 23 year old should be more physically developed and experienced to hammer out some 18-19 year olds who are still growing/developing their raw skills.

Well they are called "prospects" for a reason.

Can he pan out? Yes.

Is it likely? My take is No.

Would he be worth trying to acquire a late first round pick to acquire? My take is No.

Would he be a good get as a 2nd rounder? My take is Maybe, depending on what's left in the field and if the Knicks can buy some 2nd rounders.

Would he be a good get as an UDFA? Yes. Maybe some D League time will show that there were other mitigating factors to Christmas' more open flaws and he will be able to counter adjust and adapt.

I'd rather the Knicks took a guy who could show a higher floor, esp on the defensive end. My take on it.

You are looking at different years. Christmas's footwork this year has been excellent. He uses his powerful and athletic frame to get good position and he uses either hand to score from a variety of post moves. This is a guy who primarily scored as a secondary break runner/opportunistic scorer his first 3 years. This is now a 6-9 250 pound beast with long arms and hops and every game he faces the double team yet produces in volume and efficiency on both ends.

TripleThreat wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:You are looking at different years. Christmas's footwork this year has been excellent. He uses his powerful and athletic frame to get good position and he uses either hand to score from a variety of post moves. This is a guy who primarily scored as a secondary break runner/opportunistic scorer his first 3 years. This is now a 6-9 250 pound beast with long arms and hops and every game he faces the double team yet produces in volume and efficiency on both ends.

I'm not looking at different years. I just don't like his footwork. Maybe we have different standards of what there is to like or dislike about a prospects footwork, which is fine.

He should be overpowering the competition, he's a fourth year player where the cream of the crop each year previous left as One And Dones. I'm sure Pete Roses kid looked polished in Double A ball compared to peers who were 8-9 years younger than him.

I don't see his game translating as well to the pro level as you do, again, nothing wrong with that, people are going to sometimes disagree on prospects. I'll say this though, there are reasons why his draft stock has fallen, it's not totally arbitrary.

My take on your methodology is you are looking for the next "home run" prospect and my contention is that dangerously leaves a tendency to keep looking at what a player could be under the most ideal conditions compared to what he is likely to do at the pro level given what he has proven he can do so far.

You seem to also just skirt around the issue that his bread and butter is around the basket, and frankly a lot of those shots he's taking and making aren't going to be there for him at the NBA level. Again, his defensive instincts aren't great IMHO and he can't hit the three ball at an NBA league average rate.

You can't just look at a four year college players last year, you have to look at his first three in context as well. You see a guy who maybe didn't get enough opportunity. I see a guy who was limited for reason. Again, if we disagree, that's fine. People disagree about prospects all the time.

Personally, I think the Knicks should be gunning for players with a higher floor. Esp considering they have no draft picks next year and have had a spotty draft record in the current era.

The problem with Christmas more than anything is that he doesnt fit the style of player here and I have to remember that. Guys like Portis and Wood--who have longer range games. But we have to remember were not talking about pick #2 here--this IF it even happened would be 18 or down. There are some big PG like Wright and Grant---maybe a Wood or Portis slip--someone has to right? If were talking realism Larry Nance JR who will be a 2nd round pick might be a nice guy to pick up. We may not get another # 1 pick--we both know that.