Drawing fouls is skill, just like shooting and rebounding. A defender has to believe you're a threat before he commits enough to foul. These are still some of the best refs in the world. They don't just hand out fouls, especially to scrubs.

knicks1248 wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:Teams know that our guards, for the most part, have little to no presence inside the paint. Prigs is the best case example, but the same could be said for Calderon and Larkin. That and the fact that we have no post presence makes it easier of defenses to dictate the shots we take. Run our guys off the three point line and it's no big deal. The opposing team's big men can help out without fear of giving up the dunk in the paint. Jason Smith is trying to pump fake and drive more, but that part of his game is still a work in progress.

thank you. This squad is easy to defend. They are playing tougher D and thats great but as a group they are painfully limited offensively.

There is not a system or a coach that can cover for a lack of talent. 3 of the rotation guys just came off 10 day contracts, and they have IMPROVED the level of play!

I don't care weather they can finish around the rim or not, all you gotta do is be aggressive and draw contact, hell... you can throw up any kind of shot that doesn't have a pray, but if you get bump on the way up, pump fake your shot, you will get the call.

I have seen our guards get all the way to the rim, and as soon as the see contact coming they kick the ball out. Especially prigioni, calderon, and larkin. whats wrong with a coach telling the player, Hey man, take that shot, draw that contact, why kick out for a low % shot, especially if it's not a 3, their more likely to turn the ball over.

If i'm a coach, and I see my team is losing games because of lack of FT shooting, is it not my responsibility to instruct the player to keep going to the hole, or should I say, hey man, why are going to the hole when you know you can't finish. Thats not developing a player, that limiting his game to just jump shooting.

clealy FT's has a major impact on the game, so I should except the fact that we have players that are petrified of contact

So JSmith, Calderon, Galloway, LThomas, THrj, Larkin... all these guys are jump shooters, its their strength. So you want them to just charge the basket and chuck up any shot in hopes of drawing contact, rather than doing what has brought them success through their whole BB careers.

Sorry dude. I get your not happy with the play right now but this is called squeezing blood from a stone.

The solution is balancing the roster with some guys who can slash and dribble penetrate. NOT asking guys to do something that is not in their skill set. Your off base here. Bigtime

knicks1248 wrote:

What brought Crawford to the Garden? “I was going to watch the game anyway,’’ Crawford told The Post. “I said why not just go. New York always has a place in my heart. It was good to see old faces.’’
— A recurring problem: The Knicks have been ranked near the bottom of the league in free-throw attempts all season. Four of the five starters didn’t even take one free throw Tuesday night. Anthony was just 2 of 2.
— New starting center Jason Smith’s offensive rise continued. He’s been excellent starting out games during this improved stretch. Smith had 12 points on 6-of 8 shooting with seven rebounds and five assists. His contract expires after the season, but is starting to make a case for himself. Derek Fisher has blamed Smith’s miserable first half in part on Smith having a newborn at home.

Everybody in the league realizes this..like i said earlier in the thread..we are making history, there have been 1000's of players, and 100's of different roster, you want me to believe we have the most passive set of players in the history of the NBA.

Fish, it's not just a roster issue, it's a mind set, it's the system. In the NY Times article, where phil mention that Fitch told him, the triangle is a mid range game, and how the league (10 years from 1999) style of play would be 3 point shooting and penetration. He is still hell bent on force feeding the triangle to players that don't fit, yet you can't force guys to not settle for jumpers, that sound contradictive.

If you look back at Phil's team, they were usually in the top 10 in free throw attempts. I don't think our predicament has anything to do with Phil's mindset.

knicks1248 wrote:

What brought Crawford to the Garden? “I was going to watch the game anyway,’’ Crawford told The Post. “I said why not just go. New York always has a place in my heart. It was good to see old faces.’’
— A recurring problem: The Knicks have been ranked near the bottom of the league in free-throw attempts all season. Four of the five starters didn’t even take one free throw Tuesday night. Anthony was just 2 of 2.
— New starting center Jason Smith’s offensive rise continued. He’s been excellent starting out games during this improved stretch. Smith had 12 points on 6-of 8 shooting with seven rebounds and five assists. His contract expires after the season, but is starting to make a case for himself. Derek Fisher has blamed Smith’s miserable first half in part on Smith having a newborn at home.

Everybody in the league realizes this..like i said earlier in the thread..we are making history, there have been 1000's of players, and 100's of different roster, you want me to believe we have the most passive set of players in the history of the NBA.

Fish, it's not just a roster issue, it's a mind set, it's the system. In the NY Times article, where phil mention that Fitch told him, the triangle is a mid range game, and how the league (10 years from 1999) style of play would be 3 point shooting and penetration. He is still hell bent on force feeding the triangle to players that don't fit, yet you can't force guys to not settle for jumpers, that sound contradictive.

Its not a midrange game. Its a spacing game and if you can hit the midrange jumper that should be there all day. So if you have a good midrange game yea.. the triangle is a system that should provide you a lot of open looks (see Jason Smith of late). Look at the "scorers" who have played in the triangle. They have midrange games which COMPLIMENT their ability to attack the basket and score in iso. Big difference.

Again.. tell me who on this roster has these skills (on the NBA level):
1) Dribble penetration
2) slasher

Im going to disagree with you here... totally. So the difference between the Knicks and winning teams is mindset? That makes ZERO sense to me. When this roster has more than Melo, Calderon and guys coming off 10 day contracts we can talk mindsets and coaching.

the best teams all have one thing in common.... really good players.

knicks1248 wrote:Here's a some info to prove my point. The Bulls during the MJ/Triangle ERA, took the least amount of FT's in the league. In fact, (97/98 season) MJ took 723 FTA, the person close to him was Toni kukoc who 500 less FTA

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CHI/1998.html#all_roster

So now, is it the players or the system?

The difference with the bulls and the current knicks, is the defense, and obviously the players, but they were 3rd in points against, 29th in point per game..so in areas where they lacked, they made up for it in other area's like rebounding and overall defense.

You tell me. Look at the Bull's roster... and the answer is its the PLAYERS. Michael Jordan didnt have a problem getting to the line 9 times a game did he? Aside from Pippin who else attacks the basket? No post players. No slashers. They had MJ, Pip and nothing but jump shooters.

According to your logic the Bull's would have been better is Kukoc, Kerr, Harper passed up those open jumpers and instead attacked the basket to draw contact even if its a terrible shot?

Coaching and systems wont turn Jason Smith into Blake Griffin.

Phil coached this team also:
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/LAL/2000.html

That team was #3 in the league in FT attempts. So you tell me.... same coach, same system. One team is #3 in FTAs. The other is near the bottom.

Its the players dude.

fishmike wrote:

nixluva wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:Here's a some info to prove my point. The Bulls during the MJ/Triangle ERA, took the least amount of FT's in the league. In fact, (97/98 season) MJ took 723 FTA, the person close to him was Toni kukoc who 500 less FTA

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/CHI/1998.html#all_roster

So now, is it the players or the system?

The difference with the bulls and the current knicks, is the defense, and obviously the players, but they were 3rd in points against, 29th in point per game..so in areas where they lacked, they made up for it in other area's like rebounding and overall defense.

I don't know why you would go so far back in time in order to make your point. YES the Triangle does tend to lead to more mid range jumpers, but just going back to Phil's last stint with the Lakers is a bit more relevant. In 2007-08 the Lakers were #5 in FTA's. In 2008-09 the Lakers were #8 in the league in FTA's. In 2009-10 they were just below league avg. in FTA's at #17 in the league.

you beat me to it. The Shaq teams were among tops in FTAs. Know why? They had Shaq. Shaq was fanstastic in the triangle. great passer. Players.

We need to stop having fans follow the lead of the Media in assuming that the Triangle is a fraud and Phil is a fraud Yadda Yadda Yadda! WE NEED BETTER TALENT!!! It's that simple. Yes you need good coaching and a solid system of style of play that leads to team ball, but before any of that you need to have great talent on your team. This is what will make the biggest difference for this team. =

Moreover, Phil is going to be looking for players who can excel in this style of play. Bigs that can do a little of everything including posting and passing. That's a huge part of the mix that is missing. We need a guard who can break down a defense and get to the hole, but also pass and shoot at a decent level. Overall we need players who can not only score but defend. All of this is pretty basic stuff. The same kind of players the Spurs have are what Phil will need here. Smart well rounded players.

We have 1 legit NBA starter then maybe one 8th-10th guy and the rest are 3rd string players..Lots of work to do in the offseason.