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Reggie Jacksons market value is not as high as people believed
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TPercy
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1/6/2015  2:25 PM
mreinman wrote:
TPercy wrote:If we are dumping the triangle then I'd get him.

why?

for how much $?


Because the Triangle,from what I have seen, the pg is mainly required to have a pass first mentaliy, and SHOOTING ABILITY and as a last resort to cut to the basket. Reggie plays fast and dynamic basketball and gets to the rim. (Also if you go on [url]http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/202704/stats/[url]And click on his shot chart, it shows that he takes most of his shots in the paint and makes a decent number of them( 92/168) He also attempts around 14 shots a game). My point is the triangle will not get the best out of him, in fact, it could make him look worse than he was at OKC if he came here.

Another reason why is that we must keep in my mind that we are the worst team in the NBA so it would be hard luring the better pgs out there, not impossible, but harder and I think we should keep all options( provided we dump the traingle for now and run either a very modfied verson or just a system that better suits the players.
I would want him around in the 7mm even less would be greater but still, we have to keep in my that we are ny.

The Future is Bright!
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nixluva
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1/6/2015  2:30 PM
mreinman wrote:
nixluva wrote:If OKC is out of the running to resign Jackson that could really put NY in a prime position. We have to think of the market in terms of teams that will actually be buyers! Not all teams will actually be buyers even if they have the cap space. Philly for example likely won't be looking to get in the top FA fight. Some teams already have PG's and won't be looking for a guy like Reggie Jackson or Brandon Knight. It looks like the competition will thin out if you take out teams that have PG's already. It might come down to only some of these teams competing with us.

Heat
Pacers
Spurs
Lakers
Pelicans
Magic

how much do you pay for jackson?


I'd hope to pay less than the Max but in the end I want to land one of either Jackson or Knight. I just want to improve at the position and get younger. I don't want to overpay but that is a matter of the market place. I would pay between $7-10 Mil.
mreinman
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1/6/2015  2:34 PM
TPercy wrote:
mreinman wrote:
TPercy wrote:If we are dumping the triangle then I'd get him.

why?

for how much $?


Because the Triangle,from what I have seen, the pg is mainly required to have a pass first mentaliy, and [b]SHOOTING ABILITY[b] and as a last resort to cut to the basket. Reggie plays fast and dynamic basketball and gets to the rim. (Also if you go on [url]http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/202704/stats/[url]And click on his shot chart, it shows that he takes most of his shots in the paint and makes a decent number of them( 92/168) He also attempts around 14 shots a game). My point is the triangle will not get the best out of him, in fact, it could make him look worse than he was at OKC if he came here.

Another reason why is that we must keep in my mind that we are the worst team in the NBA so it would be hard luring the better pgs out there, not impossible, but harder and I think we should keep all options( provided we dump the traingle for now and run either a very modfied verson or just a system that better suits the players.
I would want him around in the 7mm even less would be greater but still, we have to keep in my that we are ny.

I am in @ 7m

so here is what phil is thinking ....
mreinman
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1/6/2015  2:34 PM
nixluva wrote:
mreinman wrote:
nixluva wrote:If OKC is out of the running to resign Jackson that could really put NY in a prime position. We have to think of the market in terms of teams that will actually be buyers! Not all teams will actually be buyers even if they have the cap space. Philly for example likely won't be looking to get in the top FA fight. Some teams already have PG's and won't be looking for a guy like Reggie Jackson or Brandon Knight. It looks like the competition will thin out if you take out teams that have PG's already. It might come down to only some of these teams competing with us.

Heat
Pacers
Spurs
Lakers
Pelicans
Magic

how much do you pay for jackson?


I'd hope to pay less than the Max but in the end I want to land one of either Jackson or Knight. I just want to improve at the position and get younger. I don't want to overpay but that is a matter of the market place. I would pay between $7-10 Mil.

Ok ... but not worth more than 10? 12?

so here is what phil is thinking ....
F500ONE
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1/6/2015  2:36 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:
F500ONE wrote:
mreinman wrote:
F500ONE wrote:His market will be high for Payday

But maybe not so high for trade


Nothing really has changed in terms of his cash value

He's going to get $11-15mil/yr no matter what

nope ... don't think he will


He will because the upper tier point guards make 30-40% more

And the metrics suggest the upper tier point guard % will continue to climb


He's a 2nd tier point guard you know how the metrics suggested

Kemba Walker to get 4yrs $48mil


When Jackson plays as a starter, which this will be 1a in his decision making process

His numbers suggest he's a double digit mil per yr salary maker

There is a big difference between Jackson and Kemnba. Kemba was wanted by his own team. The guard that will get Kemba money with an inflation bump is your boy Knight.

Jackson proved as a starter he was not a capable shooter. He will have to prove his self. For all we know teams may see him as a Darren Collinson type. He was a backup that turned starter then backup then backup then starter.

What are other back ups not named Harden that got a big contract on poor shooting numbers.

You were off on Draymond Green and you're probably off here

Gotta stop basing all of your opinions based on a players scoring or shooting ability


I've looked at this from a player metric and market metric

He's going to get between what I posted
nixluva
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1/6/2015  2:37 PM
mreinman wrote:
nixluva wrote:
mreinman wrote:
nixluva wrote:If OKC is out of the running to resign Jackson that could really put NY in a prime position. We have to think of the market in terms of teams that will actually be buyers! Not all teams will actually be buyers even if they have the cap space. Philly for example likely won't be looking to get in the top FA fight. Some teams already have PG's and won't be looking for a guy like Reggie Jackson or Brandon Knight. It looks like the competition will thin out if you take out teams that have PG's already. It might come down to only some of these teams competing with us.

Heat
Pacers
Spurs
Lakers
Pelicans
Magic

how much do you pay for jackson?


I'd hope to pay less than the Max but in the end I want to land one of either Jackson or Knight. I just want to improve at the position and get younger. I don't want to overpay but that is a matter of the market place. I would pay between $7-10 Mil.

Ok ... but not worth more than 10? 12?


I don't see the Market pushing him that high. We are actually one of the few teams with a clear need and enough money to offer a max and I would hope that we wouldn't pay more than we had to in order to land the guy. His problem is that there are other PG's out there too. He's not some established star either.
TPercy
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1/6/2015  2:44 PM
mreinman wrote:
TPercy wrote:
mreinman wrote:
TPercy wrote:If we are dumping the triangle then I'd get him.

why?

for how much $?


Because the Triangle,from what I have seen, the pg is mainly required to have a pass first mentaliy, and [b]SHOOTING ABILITY[b] and as a last resort to cut to the basket. Reggie plays fast and dynamic basketball and gets to the rim. (Also if you go on [url]http://stats.nba.com/player/#!/202704/stats/[url]And click on his shot chart, it shows that he takes most of his shots in the paint and makes a decent number of them( 92/168) He also attempts around 14 shots a game). My point is the triangle will not get the best out of him, in fact, it could make him look worse than he was at OKC if he came here.

Another reason why is that we must keep in my mind that we are the worst team in the NBA so it would be hard luring the better pgs out there, not impossible, but harder and I think we should keep all options( provided we dump the traingle for now and run either a very modfied verson or just a system that better suits the players.
I would want him around in the 7mm even less would be greater but still, we have to keep in my that we are ny.

I am in @ 7m


Me too, the problem is is that the Knicks a will likely over pay but not much so you would see him with around a 9-11m contract.
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BRIGGS
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1/6/2015  2:47 PM    LAST EDITED: 1/6/2015  2:48 PM
Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.
RIP Crushalot😞
mreinman
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1/6/2015  2:54 PM
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
yellowboy90
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1/6/2015  2:56 PM
F500ONE wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
F500ONE wrote:
mreinman wrote:
F500ONE wrote:His market will be high for Payday

But maybe not so high for trade


Nothing really has changed in terms of his cash value

He's going to get $11-15mil/yr no matter what

nope ... don't think he will


He will because the upper tier point guards make 30-40% more

And the metrics suggest the upper tier point guard % will continue to climb


He's a 2nd tier point guard you know how the metrics suggested

Kemba Walker to get 4yrs $48mil


When Jackson plays as a starter, which this will be 1a in his decision making process

His numbers suggest he's a double digit mil per yr salary maker

There is a big difference between Jackson and Kemnba. Kemba was wanted by his own team. The guard that will get Kemba money with an inflation bump is your boy Knight.

Jackson proved as a starter he was not a capable shooter. He will have to prove his self. For all we know teams may see him as a Darren Collinson type. He was a backup that turned starter then backup then backup then starter.

What are other back ups not named Harden that got a big contract on poor shooting numbers.

You were off on Draymond Green and you're probably off here

Gotta stop basing all of your opinions based on a players scoring or shooting ability


I've looked at this from a player metric and market metric

He's going to get between what I posted

I have been wrong about many things in my life everyone has. Being wrong about a player who suddenly shoots well and what they are going to make on the open market is two different things.

SO what is this player metric and market metric you use? How has it worked in the past. What parameters are you using for Reggie compared to past similar players?
yellowboy90
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1/6/2015  3:00 PM
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

I agree $7m offer is generous. I would rather offer that to Beverley with some strong language to boot and put him on the triangle. For Reggie to be successful in the triangle he would have to play more like a 2 guard(kobe) and they would need a great catch shoot guard to play opposite of him.
mreinman
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1/6/2015  3:05 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

I agree $7m offer is generous. I would rather offer that to Beverley with some strong language to boot and put him on the triangle. For Reggie to be successful in the triangle he would have to play more like a 2 guard(kobe) and they would need a great catch shoot guard to play opposite of him.

beverly is a nut job but I would agree.

would not mind some nasty.

And Bev can shoot the 3.

I don't think Phil goes for his height though.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
BRIGGS
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1/6/2015  3:09 PM
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

I think Jackson at 9mm or so is fair. Free agency is going to have a degree of overpayment somewhere right--you have to outbid others? RJ is just one possibility Free Agency is a tough game.

RIP Crushalot😞
yellowboy90
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1/6/2015  3:11 PM
mreinman wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

I agree $7m offer is generous. I would rather offer that to Beverley with some strong language to boot and put him on the triangle. For Reggie to be successful in the triangle he would have to play more like a 2 guard(kobe) and they would need a great catch shoot guard to play opposite of him.

beverly is a nut job but I would agree.

would not mind some nasty.

And Bev can shoot the 3.

I don't think Phil goes for his height though.

He is the same height as Fisher plus Phil loves to talk about defense at the point. It's triangle team principle.
mreinman
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1/6/2015  3:12 PM
BRIGGS wrote:
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

I think Jackson at 9mm or so is fair. Free agency is going to have a degree of overpayment somewhere right--you have to outbid others? RJ is just one possibility Free Agency is a tough game.

I agree that we will have to overpay. I just hope its not for him.

Too risky for me.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
mreinman
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1/6/2015  3:16 PM
yellowboy90 wrote:
mreinman wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:Actually I changed it to 9-10mm. He still has upside to be a 21/22-6-5 45% G. No reason why he can become a better 3 pt shooter. The nice thing about RJ as well is he's 24. He plays hard he has elite level athleticism. He's still a young player. 9-10mm for RJ over 4 years is fair. He had opportunity to raise that and he didnt. OKC will never match that. If you want to value your money--he might be a smart choice.

we already did our share of assuming with players like shump. we need to get players who can shoot, not who will learn how to shoot ... landry fields etc ...

you priced Dragic @ 15 x 4. You are an overpaying GM.

Also 45% is a meaningless number. His TS is a putrid 50%.

And just an FYI, his FG is 42.

7 million and that is being generous and because he plays at least some dee

BTW, you may end up being right but I hope its not from the knicks.

I agree $7m offer is generous. I would rather offer that to Beverley with some strong language to boot and put him on the triangle. For Reggie to be successful in the triangle he would have to play more like a 2 guard(kobe) and they would need a great catch shoot guard to play opposite of him.

beverly is a nut job but I would agree.

would not mind some nasty.

And Bev can shoot the 3.

I don't think Phil goes for his height though.

He is the same height as Fisher plus Phil loves to talk about defense at the point. It's triangle team principle.

maybe you're right. What would you pay him? Whats his max?

so here is what phil is thinking ....
fishmike
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1/6/2015  3:20 PM
mreinman wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:First off the OKC are not going to match anything from this player now that they have committed 5+mm to Waiters next year. He's essentially done in OKC.

I don't see any teams paying much more than 7mm tops now. That also may drop the cost of other players

yes ... teams are actually using metrics now and not their overrated EYES

nice to see.


What metrics are OKC using?

we will find out by seeing how much they offer.

A guard who shoots 3's worse than Toney Douglass will probably be alarming for most clubs.

Rondo?
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
mreinman
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1/6/2015  3:22 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:
mreinman wrote:
BRIGGS wrote:First off the OKC are not going to match anything from this player now that they have committed 5+mm to Waiters next year. He's essentially done in OKC.

I don't see any teams paying much more than 7mm tops now. That also may drop the cost of other players

yes ... teams are actually using metrics now and not their overrated EYES

nice to see.


What metrics are OKC using?

we will find out by seeing how much they offer.

A guard who shoots 3's worse than Toney Douglass will probably be alarming for most clubs.

Rondo?

Rondo is not getting paid as much as people think. He has been personally tanking.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Finestrg
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1/6/2015  3:27 PM
Eric Bledsoe signed a 5-yr/$70mm contract with the Suns in September. I betcha that's what Jackson and his agent shoot for. I personally think Bledsoe's the better player but they're similar..
mreinman
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1/6/2015  3:28 PM
Finestrg wrote:Eric Bledsoe signed a 5-yr/$70mm contract with the Suns in September. I betcha that's what Jackson and his agent shoot for. I personally think Bledsoe's the better player but they're similar..

and lets hope to hell that we are not the idiots to pay that.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
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