smackeddog wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

The New York Knicks were en route to their fifth straight loss last week against Brooklyn when a frustrated Tim Hardaway Jr. screamed angrily, "Get the rebound!''

I told everyone last night in the game thread

Going into a timeout this kid looked defeated

And I'm talking about discouraged quit the team down

He walked off the court so deflated and dejected

It's really really sad because I know this guy is a good kid

Then seeing the picture of Wear on The Daily News[I think just sitting there no burn]

These guys have to feel so miserable

Melo has essentially nailed the coffin shut on our free agency this summer

It's too difficult to play with him whether he's in the wrong or not

On how you feel about him personally

The thing is, does Tim Jr really have the right to tell other people to grab rebounds, stop chucking and play defense? Thats why I take umbrage at players pointing the finger rather than looking in the mirror.

You know what? WTF knows and why should you care?

Players yell stuff during games all the time!

Its communication one way or another, whether it rubs the teammate the right way or not.

The anecdote's irony is clearly that Timmy the non-rebounder yelled "rebound", but in the larger scheme of things I thing the only point worth considering is whether they can co-exist, not whether they are buddies or whether a junior player has a right to bark at a senior player. This is not the military. Its team ball. Players say stuff. If Melo threatens his teammates on the court, I'd say that is a more serious breach of conduct.

smackeddog wrote:

GoNyGoNyGo wrote:Nothing to read here...move on.

Is it really a surprise that his teammates don't think he is a team player? When Melo is out of the game the ball moves. As soon as he returns, he sets up weakside so that he can get himself into an ISO.

Melo plays the game half-heartedly. Its obvious to anyone watching. There is no passion. Let's not forget how great Linsanity was...and how the ball finally found everyone. As soon as Melo got back, it all ended. Yes, I realize that Lin has not been that great since but has Melo done anything either?

THis is just another chapter of selfish Melo stories. George Karl and MDA wrote the first few chapters and Woodson wrote the next under a pseudonym. Now its Fish's turn.

I am only shocked that the Zen Master actually re-signed Carmelo. That surprised me. I hope to be wrong because all I want is NY to win but I really cannot see it with Melo being the main piece.

As for Hardaway, GOOD for him!

Yeah, because everyone shined when Melo was injured a few weeks ago. I agree with the Melo criticisms, but like I said all the players are sucking, so instead of finger pointing it's about time they looked at themselves instead of trying to blame someone else.

As for them sucking for 2 games without him, why would you expect different? They knew he was coming back...nothing changed. Trade him and you will see the relief. you will see the team ball. Will they still suck? Yes but they will be learning and growing in the right way and a future might exist then.

Splat wrote:So.......

Melo and Tim hate each other

Nobody wants to play the triangle

Many of Melo's teammates called him a black hole to his face

No chemistry, boys been fighting

Players miss switching on defense (LOL)

Players pissed because Fish makes them practice hard and more often than Woodson

JR on trading block

Phil and Fish inherited a clusterfuk of a squad.

this is a bunch of crap, THJ can get extended minutes because he loses his man quite frequently, usually given up a wide open 3.

Jr has no lift any more, so he's resorting to his step back jumper only, he has the same problem on D as THJ

Shump is a dumb ass on both ends of the court, play hard and dumb is his story

jason smith, can't defend or doesn't give a 100% on defense and is strickly a 7 foot jump shooter.

The triangle has turn all of our bigs in to jump shooters (except for amare)

I notice when melo gets double and triple, not one single person cuts, or give him help, they all stay on the weak side forcing him to throw cross court passes(not to mention he waits for the defense to fully engulf him) which easily get intercepted.

calderon, never ever demands the ball and he's shooting close to 50% from down town..

And I would like to show me one single player who went on record and called melo a black hole.

Nalod wrote:
Great article. This core did not respond to Woodson and now Fish. Guess what, the system stays.
If this article is true, and Phil has been quoted that Melo should do more, as well well as Melo himself, then the system is working.
My take is all of Phil's team resisted. My take is even Jordan had to figure it out. It happens with discomfort and in this system its the players who figure it out.
Phil used to take time out and while not the norm, at times the players would talk it thru, figure it out and then go back out. The epicenter of that was leadership from Kobe and Jordan.
Melo either has simply taken the money or he agreed to a strong leadership position. 21 games is not enough to say he can't do this. 21 games is not a career. Maybe Karl never asked him to, MDA might have just wanted him to respond, and Woodson I think Coddled him.

My take is Melo wants this and its not easy. Im ok with all of this. Let them fight, let the those who can't be banished. THjr might just earn Melo's respect in the long run. Maybe THjr is asking for melo to step up and be the leader.

Wanting Fish to yell more? Show more emotion? If thats what our guys want, phuck that, they are looking for excuses. They don't like hard practices? Phuch that, they need to be in shape and get this triangle down as instinct.

Other teams know its coming? Then execute it!!! If so they can't stop it. If they are, its because Knicks are not doing it right.

Im fine with this article and perhaps this is how you change the culture!!! Somtimes its peaceful, sometimes its hard.

In "Phish" We Trust

You mean the SHUTDOWN SYSTEM is working

djsunyc wrote:names change on the back of the jersey and in the exec suite...but same old same old.

Does it make you nostalgic? Thinking of the good old days of the Nate Robinson and Jerome James shower fight brings a tear to my eye.

Nalod wrote:Great article. This core did not respond to Woodson and now Fish. Guess what, the system stays.
If this article is true, and Phil has been quoted that Melo should do more, as well well as Melo himself, then the system is working.
My take is all of Phil's team resisted. My take is even Jordan had to figure it out. It happens with discomfort and in this system its the players who figure it out.
Phil used to take time out and while not the norm, at times the players would talk it thru, figure it out and then go back out. The epicenter of that was leadership from Kobe and Jordan.
Melo either has simply taken the money or he agreed to a strong leadership position. 21 games is not enough to say he can't do this. 21 games is not a career. Maybe Karl never asked him to, MDA might have just wanted him to respond, and Woodson I think Coddled him.

My take is Melo wants this and its not easy. Im ok with all of this. Let them fight, let the those who can't be banished. THjr might just earn Melo's respect in the long run. Maybe THjr is asking for melo to step up and be the leader.

Wanting Fish to yell more? Show more emotion? If thats what our guys want, phuck that, they are looking for excuses. They don't like hard practices? Phuch that, they need to be in shape and get this triangle down as instinct.

Other teams know its coming? Then execute it!!! If so they can't stop it. If they are, its because Knicks are not doing it right.

Im fine with this article and perhaps this is how you change the culture!!! Somtimes its peaceful, sometimes its hard.
Is anyone suprised? Im not. If IM trying to change a group I go at it hard. Pointing figures would have to be part of the process. The culture cannot change until there is buy in.
Read Phils books.

In "Phish" We Trust

Great post

TeamBall wrote:

Splat wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

Splat wrote:

TeamBall wrote:Soooo this article doesn't seem a little too far fetched to anyone? I don't doubt that guys have a problem with Melo as hes been slowly reverting to his iso ways but to tell time hes gonna beat him up when they get back to the locker room? Seems a little ridiculous...

What? 4-19, Horrific chemistry, no team spirit, team's star often dogs it and you doubt this. This team is abysmal. They could be .500 if they were cohesive. The article is giving you a clue as to why they are abysmal and not a true team. Believe it.

You're telling me things I already know.

The Melo and Tim anecdote had to be one or two sources. Teammates telling a reporter what they heard on the court. Or Melo said it loud enough for others at the game to hear it. If it was the latter, then it would be fair game to report it. If it was only the former, then that is a discretionary move by the writer to say it happened because a player said so. Either way, it hardly is the kind of thing that gets invented for the sake of an article because it is highly specific. It is not a commentary on moods. It is saying that is what happened. Seems like it would be most likely what happened then. Considering you can hear players yell "Fuk!" on TV all the time, it is not like this would be something that was not overheard if it was heated like it sounds.

I just don't believe everything that a write (Broussard no less) says that a source told them. I do think some of it is true though. Guys have to be frustrated and Melo is holding the ball so I don't doubt that there is tension, most of it directed at him. But I think some of it is a little embellished.

OK, just walking through the paces of what a writer's options are. It sounds true not because I'm clearly biased to believe and I was explaining why it sounded like reporting of something that happened and the opposite of conjecture.

Regardless, there's trouble in Tiny Town

Splat wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

Splat wrote:

TeamBall wrote:

Splat wrote:

TeamBall wrote:Soooo this article doesn't seem a little too far fetched to anyone? I don't doubt that guys have a problem with Melo as hes been slowly reverting to his iso ways but to tell time hes gonna beat him up when they get back to the locker room? Seems a little ridiculous...

What? 4-19, Horrific chemistry, no team spirit, team's star often dogs it and you doubt this. This team is abysmal. They could be .500 if they were cohesive. The article is giving you a clue as to why they are abysmal and not a true team. Believe it.

You're telling me things I already know.

The Melo and Tim anecdote had to be one or two sources. Teammates telling a reporter what they heard on the court. Or Melo said it loud enough for others at the game to hear it. If it was the latter, then it would be fair game to report it. If it was only the former, then that is a discretionary move by the writer to say it happened because a player said so. Either way, it hardly is the kind of thing that gets invented for the sake of an article because it is highly specific. It is not a commentary on moods. It is saying that is what happened. Seems like it would be most likely what happened then. Considering you can hear players yell "Fuk!" on TV all the time, it is not like this would be something that was not overheard if it was heated like it sounds.

I just don't believe everything that a write (Broussard no less) says that a source told them. I do think some of it is true though. Guys have to be frustrated and Melo is holding the ball so I don't doubt that there is tension, most of it directed at him. But I think some of it is a little embellished.

OK, just walking through the paces of what a writer's options are. It sounds true not because I'm clearly biased to believe and I was explaining why it sounded like reporting of something that happened and the opposite of conjecture.

Regardless, there's trouble in Tiny Town