F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

F500ONE wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Vmart wrote:The better question should be predict Melo's shooting percentage. I have him around 44-45%. I prefer 50% or better I think that is the stat that determines if he is a true superstar or just a shot happy player.

don't care about his FG%, I care about his TS%. I would like to see 58+.

I care about his FG% not sure if this

Offense calls for him shooting 3s

And not sure how often or much he will get to the line

I do care about how many FGA in comparison to makes

44-45% Melo will not suffice

48-49% Melo let's see if baby fat has what it takes

Again ... FG is a deprecated stat.

I could care less about where, when and how much he is shooting if he has a very efficient TS.

If he is shooting 38% and has a TS of 60% then that is splendid.

You mean shooting 38% from 3?

Because no way he can shoot 38% fg and have a TS% of 60

Unless he's paraded to the line at a NBA Historic level

Nope not gonna fly mreinman

Everything is predicated on how this system

Dictates what his TS% could be, it's not a statical category

A player has full control over, TS is rather overrated in many cases

But what he does have control over is making the shots

He takes and hopefully the shots he takes, he makes close to 50% of them

And they are in the category of high percentage

I'm also more concerned with his other areas of offense

Which DK alluded to, his ast/to ratio and how much he

Plays a factor in his teammates becoming better in the system

He can't continue being a 'I Got Mine" player but "What About Ya'll"

We should see an increased effort on defense although

This is a thread geared towards his offense

For the record go look up what 5 time World Champion Kobe TS% was

Now we both despise Kobe and the way he played but he only cracked

58% TS once in his career 1 time during regular season and playoffs

He was historically a 55% TS player

Yes Melo needs to be more efficient as an offensive players

Starting with his FG%

Now you are sounding a bit ignorant (like TKF?)

Of course you can't shoot 38% and have a high TS, I was just making a point.

FG% stat is for the ill-informed.

Mr world class Kobe was not efficient! We all know that. Using him as an example since he was champion is ludicrous to prove or disprove the values of TS and FG.

PP shot 44% (FG) but near 60 TS. He was obviously very efficient in ways other than the 2 point FG.

Melo is about where kobe is was efficiency wise and they both should/could be much better.

Melo, to increase his TS needs to cut down on his long contested 2's. If he does (which I don't know if he is willing to), then he can have a +58 TS. His 3 point shooting and FT shooting are certainly good enough to get him there. Its simple ...

For other players, it may mean something else, it depends where their weaknesses are.

Please stop with this FG% stuff. If you would like to make a valid TS argument with data to back it up, I am all ears.

You gotta hit shots and be efficient at the ones you take factoring in value.

Vmart wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Vmart wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Vmart wrote:The better question should be predict Melo's shooting percentage. I have him around 44-45%. I prefer 50% or better I think that is the stat that determines if he is a true superstar or just a shot happy player.

don't care about his FG%, I care about his TS%. I would like to see 58+.

If his FG% goes up his overall TS% goes up. It's very simple do what LeBron and Durant do. They shoot relatively the same from three but their midrange game is much better than Melo. Since majority of shots come from midrange or closer wouldn't you want Melo to make good on all his attempts to reduce empty trips. What you guys fail to understand is the importance of possession and the psychological effects on the other team that scoring on every trip down the floor does to them. TS% is a part of FG%. See the difference between Melo, Durant's and LeBron's TS% you will find a disparity there only because the Mid range game is the difference.

Most here expect Melo to shoot 36-40% from three, I don't see him exceeding that. But the biggest difference in TS% with other leaders is Melo's ability to shoot inside three point range. That is the area where Melo leaves a lot of points. So if Melo makes a conscious effort to shoot 50% overall his TS% will go to 62% or higher. Now that is elite level, that is fewer empty trips. That creates pressure on the opponent.

There are players with sub par FG's and very good TS such as Pierce and Harden (and of course Billups).

TS is a combination of 2's, 3's and FT's all valued accordingly. FG% values 2's and 3's equally which is stupid.

Of course if he shoots well from 2 it should help his TS.

I actually think that Melo should be able to shoot 42+ from three if he took shots that were not chucks. His assisted 3 point shooting percentage is ridiculous!

I hear what you are saying and agree with you. But will Melo get to the Free throw line more? Will Melo improve on his three point shooting because if he does, what does it help his FG%. Free throw shooting is subjective and usually based on the refs discretion so it is out of Melo's hand to get to the line more. Improved FG% is all on Melo. Last year Melo's TS% was 56.1%. You want him to have a 2% increase to 58% how is he going to do that any way you look at Getting to the line being subjective, he has to in the end increase his free throw percentage and his mid range game percentage or his three point percentage. Any way you look at it he has to have an increase in percentage to get to your number.

He needs to stop forcing long contested 2's and look to facilitate more. If he does that then his TS can easily increase to 58+. EASILY!

He's gotta want it. I am not sure if he has the will power to give up those chucks.

move on with the rest of the world ... its not flat

I thought you were bright, thats why I assumed that you were not TKF with his retarded logic. Am I wrong?

I said the last game was very poorly played and a core concern was Melo reverting to his mindless bad habit BB style when the going gets tough. He reverted super quick and its presently a tiny red flag, but it is a serious cautionary note prior to game 1, because Melo's ability to play through bad stretches and be an exemplar of disciplined execution matters to this club greatly. If Melo regresses too easily, this club is going to sputter very easily. He needs to lead and hustle and stick to game plans.

This is why the dumb long 2 chucks are detrimental IMO. And why Melo needs to up his efficiency with better shot selection.

Did that elucidate the conversation any better?

mreinman wrote:and BTW, TS does NOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT factor in FG%.

Please check out its very simple formula.

Crusade? You win.

When you take PTS / FGA whether

The FGA are 2s or 3s it's factoring FG%

The only difference is the total pts in relation to

Weight on FTA generating pts and 2s and 3s generating pts

Because

If a player generates 300pts from 3s on 100FGA guess what I can tell you the FG%

If a player generates 600pts on 2s on 300FGA guess what I can tell you the FG%

So what they combined the totals into a compiled statistical measurement

Multiplying them by a summative-cumulative number

An efficient player wants to generate a helluva lot of pts

On the least amount of FGA as possible, we all get what TS% is

I'm sorry TS% pulled the oky doke on you

And disguised FG%s into a rather dubious formula

Guess who plays a major factor if Melo gets to the line

The referees which has always been a hot topic of debate in defense

Of Melo never receiving enough respect from the league

I say don't leave it in the refs hands, take better 2s and 3s and make them

Guess what dictates if Melo shoots a lot of 3s

The triangle system,and get this whether he's taking 2s or 3s

My whole pt with FG% is to hit those shots

Setting 3s apart from 2s doesn't take away the player shooting % it all comes back to FG%

What I don't want is a player taking a bunch of 3s

For all the god awful 2s they take and miss as a kiss and let's makeup

Nor do I want him playing the game looking for foul calls

So he can be serenaded to the line

Make more shots than you miss if possible

Everything else is gravy, there is some dweeb working

On another mindfulness formula to infiltrate NBA pop culture

I mean because if we want to go there

A player who shoots 92% from the line why not play every possession for a foul

Splat wrote:Per Melo being efficient, this is why I harped on the way he played in the third quarter last game when the whole unit spazzed out. Melo, Stat and JR on the floor at the same time was a recipe for [ fill in blank here ]. And Melo was chucking thos long 2s MR is speaking of.

I said the last game was very poorly played and a core concern was Melo reverting to his mindless bad habit BB style when the going gets tough. He reverted super quick and its presently a tiny red flag, but it is a serious cautionary note prior to game 1, because Melo's ability to play through bad stretches and be an exemplar of disciplined execution matters to this club greatly. If Melo regresses too easily, this club is going to sputter very easily. He needs to lead and hustle and stick to game plans.

This is why the dumb long 2 chucks are detrimental IMO. And why Melo needs to up his efficiency with better shot selection.

Did that elucidate the conversation any better?

Yes, well stated. Very clear formatting and no need to say lots of sh1ts to confuse simplicity.

If he stops those dumb, contested long 2's and ceases the hero ball and the "I can do it all by myself" narcissistic mindset, he can be very efficient and a strong net positive.

Shoot 2's, 3's, layups, dunks, FOUL SHOTS ... who cares ... /// as long as you do it efficiently.

I would really love to see 5+ assists a game as well as some second half assists for a change.

No poster is going personally attack my

Character of conversing, happens way too often here

They either want to change the way you write and/or what you write about

For crying out loud we have a poster who refers to himself in the 3rd person

Such attacks can lead to off topic situations

Which leads to people becoming heated and eventually banned

I believe this may have taken place with TKF

Shoutout to knickscity for keeping it moving, level-headed, and grown manish

Splat wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Bravo to anyone who can keep up with this conversation. I'll move on to a different thread now

Good ...

Go to another thread and tell us how fabulous shump is if only ... That is pretty easy to follow ....

That format is very hard to follow

yeah - its horrible

Will chime in on this just this once. If F5 actually wants anyone to read their posts, and I cannot most of the time, then they will adapt their formatting.

It is just alien to the way the human system processes type. F5, your format is perceived as typographic white noise and cannot be processed. It is violently unpleasant to look at. It adds a completely unnecessary undercurrent of biological aggression to everything you post and this works against you.

So, if you really think people are reading your posts of more than say 10 of your single lines, guess again. Most will not.

This is a formatting criticism, so don't take it personally. It is merely an honest one-time comment to another person who may actually want to have conversations. If you persist, there is simply no choice but to NOT read the majority of what you post.

I can't handle your formatting either and I consider myself open-minded about these things as I've had a very solid background in matters of typesetting and design. Its not quirky or interesting. It just reads horrifically and eliminates you from the consideration of many readers.

I put him on Ignore List (the only one) just that I can collapse his post so that I can look at a thread without getting dizzy.

I still expand it when I want to see what he writes. Often he has interesting insight where I find myself on the same page.

Lately he is reminding me of a smarter version of TKF (who was pretty damn dumb).

For the most part, I like him posting here but like you, I wish that his format was readable. Seems to be a bit stubborn and sensitive about it.

mreinman wrote:

Splat wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Bravo to anyone who can keep up with this conversation. I'll move on to a different thread now

Good ...

Go to another thread and tell us how fabulous shump is if only ... That is pretty easy to follow ....

That format is very hard to follow

yeah - its horrible

Will chime in on this just this once. If F5 actually wants anyone to read their posts, and I cannot most of the time, then they will adapt their formatting.

It is just alien to the way the human system processes type. F5, your format is perceived as typographic white noise and cannot be processed. It is violently unpleasant to look at. It adds a completely unnecessary undercurrent of biological aggression to everything you post and this works against you.

So, if you really think people are reading your posts of more than say 10 of your single lines, guess again. Most will not.

This is a formatting criticism, so don't take it personally. It is merely an honest one-time comment to another person who may actually want to have conversations. If you persist, there is simply no choice but to NOT read the majority of what you post.

I can't handle your formatting either and I consider myself open-minded about these things as I've had a very solid background in matters of typesetting and design. Its not quirky or interesting. It just reads horrifically and eliminates you from the consideration of many readers.

I put him on Ignore List (the only one) just that I can collapse his post so that I can look at a thread without getting dizzy.

I still expand it when I want to see what he writes. Often he has interesting insight where I find myself on the same page.

Lately he is reminding me of a smarter version of TKF (who was pretty damn dumb).

For the most part, I like him posting here but like you, I wish that his format was readable. Seems to be a bit stubborn and sensitive about it.

And you'll notice the weaker and more strident his argument gets, the longer he strings out his posts. It's interesting, actually.

jrodmc wrote:

mreinman wrote:

Splat wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:

mreinman wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Bravo to anyone who can keep up with this conversation. I'll move on to a different thread now

Good ...

Go to another thread and tell us how fabulous shump is if only ... That is pretty easy to follow ....

That format is very hard to follow

yeah - its horrible

Will chime in on this just this once. If F5 actually wants anyone to read their posts, and I cannot most of the time, then they will adapt their formatting.

It is just alien to the way the human system processes type. F5, your format is perceived as typographic white noise and cannot be processed. It is violently unpleasant to look at. It adds a completely unnecessary undercurrent of biological aggression to everything you post and this works against you.

So, if you really think people are reading your posts of more than say 10 of your single lines, guess again. Most will not.

This is a formatting criticism, so don't take it personally. It is merely an honest one-time comment to another person who may actually want to have conversations. If you persist, there is simply no choice but to NOT read the majority of what you post.

I can't handle your formatting either and I consider myself open-minded about these things as I've had a very solid background in matters of typesetting and design. Its not quirky or interesting. It just reads horrifically and eliminates you from the consideration of many readers.

I put him on Ignore List (the only one) just that I can collapse his post so that I can look at a thread without getting dizzy.

I still expand it when I want to see what he writes. Often he has interesting insight where I find myself on the same page.

Lately he is reminding me of a smarter version of TKF (who was pretty damn dumb).

For the most part, I like him posting here but like you, I wish that his format was readable. Seems to be a bit stubborn and sensitive about it.

And you'll notice the weaker and more strident his argument gets, the longer he strings out his posts. It's interesting, actually.

Classic case of "I've got nothing" therefore

Attack poster in some way taking thread off-topic

Atypical Schmil yet conversation ongoing

Hence the replies keep coming, their format I guess stellar

But the depth of content low budget