LivingLegend wrote:In his prime STAT was one of my favorite all-time players -- top 10 explosive/talent.

But today -- for every STAT dunk or spinning jump hook or 15 foot face-up jumper --- you get a travel, or a bad pass or a missed defensive assignment, a slow reaction to a high screen and roll, a turnover or some other net-negative player.

At this point in his career (on this Knick team) I think STAT is a net-negative player.

Put him on the Spurs and he'll probably look like SuperMan but with the Knicks - his weaknesses always seemed magnified.

He'd be a role player on the Spurs at best.

TripleThreat wrote:

RonRon wrote:I would be willing to give up

STAT
Tim Hadaway JR

3.6m trade exemption (if needed but would try to keep it, possibly trading it for nonguaranteed contracts in the deadline to use in the summer as ours has a 1 year time limit to use or lose)
3m cash
2018 2nd round pick

if they need a 1st rounder, would have to reconsider, but then they must take back Pablo too we take back 3m cash, if not we get back some 2nd round picks in the next couple years as they have way too many anyway

for

Wroten
23m trade exemption

This move would help us with our PG depth, save us 60m and reset our penalties from being over the luxury right now, and allow us to have a large trade exemption to persue Durant or whoever in the summer

So you want to surrender possibly a FIRST ROUND DRAFT PICK AND A YOUNG COST CONTROLLED PLAYER IN THJ for the ability to dump STAT earlier than just a little bit later and for essentially cap space and tax relief?

While factoring in that the current CBA gives lots of teams flexibility with cap space? While factoring in the next labor war, given the giant TV contract just signed, will likely raise the salary cap yet again, giving teams even more space?

You say moving STAT would save luxury tax bills ( if Dolan wanted to save 60 million, he wouldn't have spent that much and more on Zen Master and Fisher) and open up sign and trade opportunities. Sign and Trade WITH WHAT? You just traded future draft assets and one of the very few ( if the only) young cost controlled player who seems somewhat trade worthy at the moment.

It's making the very kind of move you are proposing, over and over again, that got the Knicks into this position, this horrible team/franchise position, in the first place.

That proposal cant be right....we're fleecing ourselves with a proposal like that.

TripleThreat wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:Amare Stoudemire and 3mm$ to Philly for Jason Richardson and their 2015 2nd round pick. They really could use the tough veteran NBA player Amare is. He could play starting PF and allow Noel to freelance and take pressure off of him. It would really give Philly fans somethingt o watch. It brings Philly above the minimum threshold and gives Amare all the minutes he can handle to do his thing--to show leadership to the younger players on Philly and to help make them competitive.. We can simply waive Richardson.

The only reason the 76ers would trade for STAT is for reaching the salary floor mandated by the CBA.

Philly is clearly in tank mode. The 76ers aren't looking to be competitive. At all. STAT is going to be playing for his next contract, which means he will actually try ( as much as is possible for him) on defense and to establish himself a 3rd or 4th big on a contender ( he's probably a 5th big in reality at this point for any team) He also will chew up minutes from younger players ( Moultrie, Grant, Davies) that the 76ers will either try to develop or feature for trade purposes.

If STAT makes it to the 76ers, odds are he will be firmly planted on their bench. Since the money savings roll both ways, I don't see how the Knicks get assets, but I guess they can get a heavily protected conditional 2nd ( which would likely end up as no pick) for face saving purposes.

I suppose an argument could be made that STAT would help Philly lose more than win, which would help their end goal. Sadly, he's a ball stopper. Every shotjack is an opportunity to develop Noel and Sims wasted. He will also clog up the paint, which hinders Noel's development in the post. Helping you lose to tank is great. Doing such at the cost of minutes and development to players that the Sixers want in their future core is not.

If the Sixers wanted to be competitive, they wouldn't have offloaded Hawes and Turner at the last deadline. And wouldn't have jettisoned Thaddeus Young this offseason.

I think what Amare would bring them is a guy who has been a first team all NBA player into the locker room. I don't agree that" Amare stinks" hes just not a right fit here anymore. He's a guy who has worked extremely hard just to be playing basketball anymore--my bet is 80-90% of players in stats position wouldve taken the cash and retired with the injuries he has had. There is no way that Nerlens Noel coming off knee surgery is prepared to play 40 minutes a night and Henry Sims is not a player that they are really going to charge fans 100 bucks a night to see--my guess? Taking Amare now gets them over the threshold--we take back 6.5mm give them 3--it really breaks out even. They get a name player who can entertain the fans show the rookies how to be a pro in and out of the locker room. Im sure the Knicks could buy Amare out--but Id like to see us trade him to a team like Philly.

TripleThreat wrote:

RonRon wrote:I would be willing to give up

STAT
Tim Hadaway JR

3.6m trade exemption (if needed but would try to keep it, possibly trading it for nonguaranteed contracts in the deadline to use in the summer as ours has a 1 year time limit to use or lose)
3m cash
2018 2nd round pick

if they need a 1st rounder, would have to reconsider, but then they must take back Pablo too we take back 3m cash, if not we get back some 2nd round picks in the next couple years as they have way too many anyway

for

Wroten
23m trade exemption

This move would help us with our PG depth, save us 60m and reset our penalties from being over the luxury right now, and allow us to have a large trade exemption to persue Durant or whoever in the summer

So you want to surrender possibly a FIRST ROUND DRAFT PICK AND A YOUNG COST CONTROLLED PLAYER IN THJ for the ability to dump STAT earlier than just a little bit later and for essentially cap space and tax relief?

While factoring in that the current CBA gives lots of teams flexibility with cap space? While factoring in the next labor war, given the giant TV contract just signed, will likely raise the salary cap yet again, giving teams even more space?

You say moving STAT would save luxury tax bills ( if Dolan wanted to save 60 million, he wouldn't have spent that much and more on Zen Master and Fisher) and open up sign and trade opportunities. Sign and Trade WITH WHAT? You just traded future draft assets and one of the very few ( if the only) young cost controlled player who seems somewhat trade worthy at the moment.

It's making the very kind of move you are proposing, over and over again, that got the Knicks into this position, this horrible team/franchise position, in the first place.

Because a trade exemption would allow us to trade for ONE player equivalent or less than the trade exemption
Philly is the only team in the entire NBA that could give us a trade exemption because overall team salary at about 30m, while the salary cap is about 63m
They (Philly must pay a total of over 50m in salaries (I believe they just pay their own players more if not)
Philly is obviously looking to develop

MKG
Noel
Embid

While grabbing the pieces, asset's, and focus the development of the players above, their future draft picks, the draft right to the players that they previously drafted, players signed/traded with cap space with the asset's obtained in their future

Dario Saric
KJ McDaniels (signed a 1 unguaranteed deal, so whether he will be a piece in their future is up in the air but he has good upside as well)

Tony Wroten has plenty of potential and easily the most talented G with MKG, despite being able to play both PG and SG, they seem determined to NOT start Wroten when MKG returns, moving him to their bench, so I don't know if they see him as a piece in their future but I would be very much interested in his abilities as I value his ability to penetrate, finish with contact, facilitate, push the tempo, and combination of speed/quickness/handle/strength/athleticism/ and ability to finish with contact/facilitate very much
Standing at 6-5 to about 6-6, 210 pds, in terms of speed and quickness, size and versatility, ability to fnish with contact, and athleticism, is ranked right up there with Harden/Ginobili (young one), John Wall, and those type of franchise talents, however, Philly seems to want better shooters in which Tim Hardaway JR could provide while being cheap with his rookie contract, so it would allow them to preserve their cap space for future players
IF he develops a decent 3pt shot, I believe he has the ability to be a FUTURE ALL STAR

So if they can see Tim Hardaway JR as a SG of their future because they will need shooters to spread the floor while they have excellent defenders in their BIG 3 of their future to hide JR's weakness
Why the Knick's should do it

1- We have one year to use the exemption from the date acuired, while the trade exemption does not count against the cap, so we will have about 30m in combined salaries to use in 2015 + the trade exemption
2- We have a salary of 87m and are repeat tax offenders, a trade to acquire a trade exemption would allow us to instantly save money and more importantly regain the privaleges of being under the cap like doing sign and trades and much more...

3- Depending on the player we are targetting, it would determine the price we could pay, but it can range dramatically, again remember that we can use our own 30m this summer before using this trade exemption of 20m +
It doesn't mean we must use it all of it, it could be used for a player of 10m etc, and we still have a 3.6m trade exemption which expires from the date when Chandler/Felton got traded from (1 year later)
AFTER we use our 30m in salaries and MLE this coming summer, here is a list of players we can target, each player would have different value/price range in terms of salary and trade value

Kevin Durant
Noah

Marc Gasol (sign and trade, wouldn't pay him max though)
LA

Blake Griffen, with Hawes/DeAndre Jordan

David Lee
Roy Hibbert/McGee/Asik/Deandre Jordan/Pekovic

Battum

Ryan Anderson
Tyreke Evans

Millsap/Al Jefferson/ Horford

Larry Sanders

Josh Smith/Monroe

Paul George?
Iggy

Bledsoe or Dragic

Lopez/Morris brothers

Bklyn players, Deron Williams/Joe Johnson/ Lopez

Kobe

Favors/Kanter/Hayword

Injured players talents or recovering

Paul George/Durant/McGee/Gallo/Kobe

Asset that could be used include, the draft rights of our 2015 draft pick, 2018 1st round draft pick, 2020 1st round draft pick, 2018 and anything over 2nd round draft picks, players rights and draft rights to previous players drafted like Tenacious (hope to keep), Lous Lafayette (especially if he improves much after being drafted by NYK's which is 19 right now and still developing like Koustas Pap did...

Some teams might want to clear salary and we wouldn't have to give us assets but still gain talent like players in Golden State, because they might rather sign a FA in the summer, so we could buy Lee or Iggy for a low price, even Kobe Bryant and his 23m salary, while FIRST we have used our 30m in signing players, still have a MLE to use, and we could actually sign STAT or AB back if they are traded to rejoin the team (the best part for the posters that like to keep them because of their talents)

So 30m in salary to use
Whatever players are kept that we can develop or some players could be traded for picks/other players, especially ones in rookie contracts
MLE (could be used on one players or devided him for 2 players like say Randy Foye and Hickson, at 2m and 4m) or Gereld Green and Danny Green, looking at this summer steals, Sessions/Blair/James Johnson signed for 2-3 year deals at 2m - 2.5m and the full MLE could rise over 6m next summer

JR Smith will opt out and we could release his rights and resign him if we want or replace him with other players like Foye/Affalo or/and with players above, with the addition of Tenacious
We could sign a 3 year deal with Tenacious with either cap space or part of the MLE if we want a 3 year deal over a 2 year deal while paying him more than the 500k 1st year rookie deal to make up for taking less money to learn to Triangle with the D League instead of going overseas
In any case, I we could resign Smith at about 5m per year with most of the MLE while using part of it on Tenacious