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fishmike
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7/14/2014  2:39 PM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
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Dagger
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7/14/2014  2:45 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.
smackeddog
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7/14/2014  2:47 PM
Kind of off topic, but am I the only one who's really excited about this season? The east was so boring last year, but this year it looks much better and more balanced- can't wait! (and it's been a long time science I've felt that way)
Vmart
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7/14/2014  2:56 PM
smackeddog wrote:Kind of off topic, but am I the only one who's really excited about this season? The east was so boring last year, but this year it looks much better and more balanced- can't wait! (and it's been a long time science I've felt that way)

I finally feel the East is wide open. I think the Knicks have an excellent chance next year.
bernard
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7/14/2014  2:57 PM
[/quote]when you see him get 6 steals and take over a game with that athleticism I can 100% see where your coming from. My reasoning was risk/reward. Also he's in a contract year and if we dont trade him we are looking at the David Lee conundrum. We have a good player due to get paid, but want to use that money for higher impact guys. Thats why my thought was to pump and dump and get something back. I certainly hear you though... and we have seen him lock down all 3 wing spots. We have also seen him go a week without scoring a point. Tough call for Phil to make.
[/quote]

Yup. Hadn't really considered that if he shows he's good on D again, we'd have to pay him to keep him :). In any event, I'd like to see him get plenty of run at the 2 and hopefully play well so his trade value goes up or Phil likes him too much to part with him. I don't like him at the 3.
mreinman
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7/14/2014  2:58 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/14/2014  3:00 PM
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

I don't know if RPM's (Real Plus Minus) are what they are made out to be but with any stat, if a player is 88th out of 89 at his position something smells rotten. Do you realize or quantify how many points/rebounds he is giving up?

He is very likable just not very good. I never pick on him personally.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
nixluva
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7/14/2014  3:03 PM
Dagger wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.


This is not true. From what i've been able to see STAT had an Offensive rating of 118 and a defensive rating of 108 in 2012-13 and last year it was 112-110. Most of his career he's been a plus player. I think with a better defensive philosophy he'll be a better defender in the team concept. He's got to do better but he is in fact an efficient scorer and he is in fact one of the best ALL TIME in that regard. He's not just dunking to get high numbers. STAT in this system could be quite a good player.
nyk4ever
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7/14/2014  3:15 PM
7) ban tkf and dk7
"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
Dagger
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7/14/2014  3:30 PM
nixluva wrote:
Dagger wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.


This is not true. From what i've been able to see STAT had an Offensive rating of 118 and a defensive rating of 108 in 2012-13 and last year it was 112-110. Most of his career he's been a plus player. I think with a better defensive philosophy he'll be a better defender in the team concept. He's got to do better but he is in fact an efficient scorer and he is in fact one of the best ALL TIME in that regard. He's not just dunking to get high numbers. STAT in this system could be quite a good player.

I don't think those stats take into account how bad he is on a personal level because they are tied heavily to team success. 2012-2013 I'm sure almost everyone had a good OR/DR rating because the team won almost 2/3 of its games. Besides, now he is no longer playing with Tyson. When I watch Amare play D I see someone who has no idea what he's doing. He will never be an average defender. Maybe we can bring him to passable level where he doesn't totally disrupt defensive chemistry. He will not be a very good big in the triangle because he is an abysmal passer, we can only hope his scoring is slightly spiked by the system. I always appreciate your optimism, but amare has a lot of holes in his game people overlooked because he was an incredible athlete. He admits to this himself.
fishmike
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7/14/2014  3:32 PM
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

I don't know if RPM's (Real Plus Minus) are what they are made out to be but with any stat, if a player is 88th out of 89 at his position something smells rotten. Do you realize or quantify how many points/rebounds he is giving up?

He is very likable just not very good. I never pick on him personally.

82 games does a nice breakdown of what guys do vs. what the guys opposite of them do. Amare at PF was very good last year and his eFG% is much higher than his opponents.

He's got a skill set and its scoring at a very high %. Thats why I like him off the bench for 25 minutes a game. What bench guys can give you 14-15 a game while shooting over 55%? Thats a great piece to bring in, especially when Melo rests. I picture him and Larkin working some nice P&R off the bench.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
knicks1248
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7/14/2014  3:45 PM
Dagger wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.

He also gets to the line more then any player not name melo (and he's in the bottom half of minutes played), I seriously doubts he goes 1 on 3, cause he doesnt hold the ball and wait for the double like melo.

I also don't recalled opposing bigs having big games agaisnt him on a nightly basis, his help defense is horrible, but his man defense is reasonable.

He'wasn't the one getting lit up by every pg in the league, oh wait a minute, with the amount of switching we did, maybe he was.

Once again another poster who judges a player not the sysytem

ES
djsunyc
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7/14/2014  3:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/14/2014  3:58 PM
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

we were 6-12 before the rudy deal. post rudy deal, 42-22 - 0.656 winning %. translates to a 52+ win season. returning everyone...while improving the bench. and also having an improving ross + jonas + demar...i think toronto is the team to beat in the division and with all the built in chemistry...will challenge for 50+ wins this year.

how long do you think it will take the knicks to "get" the triangle? if it takes them 20 games and they are 7-13 after 20 games, they'll have to go 41-28 the rest of the way to get to 48 wins. amare would have to play 75+ games at a high level. imho, i think this year will be a wash in many ways. alot of the roster will be turned over again and it will probably cost them a higher pick in the process.
fishmike
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7/14/2014  4:15 PM
nyk4ever wrote:7) ban tkf and dk7
no need... like most hot air baloons they will make a lot of whining and farting noises while they bounce off the walls but eventually the air runs out and they land on the ground stretched and useless. Sad and silly. Its Phil Jackson. Watch and have an open mind. If we suck in 4 years go streaking through the quad and let us all know how right you were.. zzZZzzzz
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
F500ONE
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7/14/2014  4:17 PM
This sounds no better than where we were 4yrs ago...
knicks1248
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7/14/2014  4:19 PM
djsunyc wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

we were 6-12 before the rudy deal. post rudy deal, 42-22 - 0.656 winning %. translates to a 52+ win season. returning everyone...while improving the bench. and also having an improving ross + jonas + demar...i think toronto is the team to beat in the division and with all the built in chemistry...will challenge for 50+ wins this year.

how long do you think it will take the knicks to "get" the triangle? if it takes them 20 games and they are 7-13 after 20 games, they'll have to go 41-28 the rest of the way to get to 48 wins. amare would have to play 75+ games at a high level. imho, i think this year will be a wash in many ways. alot of the roster will be turned over again and it will probably cost them a higher pick in the process.

Well the summer league squad is picking it up quite nicely, when you have a month of trianing camp, video tape, and guys that are willing to buy in, that makes it much more easier.

people are really forgetting how bad the coaching staff was, how much we miss tyson in the begining, how much we miss kmart, and how bad jr played the first 2 1/2 months, I'm ot even going to bring up felton. Wait a minute, what about the over use of melo when his legs would turned to noodles in the forth quarter, and the countless games we loss by 5 or less points.

Im telling you with a few minor changes we went from 54 to 37 wins, so it's easy to to see that we can reverse the trend, with a few minor changes and go from 37 to 54.

You see how easy it was for the raptors to get rid of one player and change the direction of their season

ES
Uptown
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7/14/2014  4:29 PM
Believe it or not, we need Amare this year because Back-to-the-basket players can thrive in the Triangle offense and he's the only one we have. (Wold love to see Melo get some looks in the post as well). Amare's summer workouts with Hakeem should really come-into-play this year, and he should be rejuvenated being that its a contract year. Obviously his health and Lack of D are a big concern, but I'm looking forward to seeing what he can do in this offense.
Uptown
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7/14/2014  4:32 PM
djsunyc wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

we were 6-12 before the rudy deal. post rudy deal, 42-22 - 0.656 winning %. translates to a 52+ win season. returning everyone...while improving the bench. and also having an improving ross + jonas + demar...i think toronto is the team to beat in the division and with all the built in chemistry...will challenge for 50+ wins this year.

how long do you think it will take the knicks to "get" the triangle? if it takes them 20 games and they are 7-13 after 20 games, they'll have to go 41-28 the rest of the way to get to 48 wins. amare would have to play 75+ games at a high level. imho, i think this year will be a wash in many ways. alot of the roster will be turned over again and it will probably cost them a higher pick in the process.

Couple of issues with the Rapts. 1.) Will Lowry continue to play at the same level as last year now that he's got his money. 2.) The east is a lot better (Wiz, Cavs, Bulls,) so reaching 50 will not be easy this year.....I do believe they should enter the season as the division fav's though....
Dagger
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7/14/2014  4:39 PM    LAST EDITED: 7/14/2014  4:44 PM
knicks1248 wrote:
Dagger wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.

He also gets to the line more then any player not name melo (and he's in the bottom half of minutes played), I seriously doubts he goes 1 on 3, cause he doesnt hold the ball and wait for the double like melo.

I also don't recalled opposing bigs having big games agaisnt him on a nightly basis, his help defense is horrible, but his man defense is reasonable.

He'wasn't the one getting lit up by every pg in the league, oh wait a minute, with the amount of switching we did, maybe he was.

Once again another poster who judges a player not the sysytem


Check yourself, I always talked about what I disliked about Woodson's coaching. I'm well aware he was a big part of the problem, and if you took the time to read what other people say, maybe you wouldn't be making wild generalizations that have no basis in reality.

If you doubt he goes 1-on-3 maybe watch some games... I mean there's no retort to that, he forced it a ton and if you didn't see it I honestly have a hard time believing you were watching closely.
mreinman
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7/14/2014  4:43 PM
Dagger wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Dagger wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.

He also gets to the line more then any player not name melo (and he's in the bottom half of minutes played), I seriously doubts he goes 1 on 3, cause he doesnt hold the ball and wait for the double like melo.

I also don't recalled opposing bigs having big games agaisnt him on a nightly basis, his help defense is horrible, but his man defense is reasonable.

He'wasn't the one getting lit up by every pg in the league, oh wait a minute, with the amount of switching we did, maybe he was.

Once again another poster who judges a player not the sysytem


Check yourself, I always talked about what I disliked about Woodson's coaching. I'm well aware he was a big part of the problem, and if you took the time to read what other people say, maybe you wouldn't be making wild generalizations that have no basis in reality.

If you doubt he goes 1-on-3 maybe watch some games... I mean there's no retort to that, he forced it a ton and if you didn't see I honestly have a hard time believing you were watching.

Of course he goes 1 on 3 and forces horribly!

Its not easy to have a 4+ : 1 USG -> Ast ratio

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Dagger
Posts: 22065
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7/14/2014  4:44 PM
mreinman wrote:
Dagger wrote:
knicks1248 wrote:
Dagger wrote:
fishmike wrote:
mreinman wrote:
fishmike wrote:
nixluva wrote:WIN THE ATLANTIC DIVISION!!!

They just need to buy into the system and play team oriented BB and they should have a shot to win this div. Toronto won 48 games last year to win the Div. I don't think they will be unbeatable this year. Knicks closed the season 16-7 in March and April last year. Knicks were 10-6 vs the Atlantic last year. IMO this team can be much better than last year when they lost so many games in the 4th qtr that were winnable if they simply play smart BB. They literally pissed away a good 10 games just being stupid. 46-50 games should win the Atlantic this year.

I tend to agree but every season has its own set of challenges. I to think the Knicks *can* win the division, but that doesnt mean they will or they should.

I agree 100% with Vmart's comments on Amare, and if he can give anything he will. He finished the season very strong last year. 26 games post all star he put up 15/6 and shot 57%. If we could get close to that kind of EF% from him it would be a huge help. Im not holding out much hope for Bargs.

Amare gives up far more than he gets. Just looking at his offensive stats does not tell the story.

So unfortunately, I think that the knicks will be a better team with him occupying the IR.

I understand you dont like him, but thats just not accurate. Knicks need some high % scorers. Amare brings that. Especially off the bench.

Yeah but what he's saying is amare is so bad on defense that he gives up more points than he gets even if he is efficient. He also mucks up the offense because he never passes and always goes 1 on 3 forcing the issue which is why he gets more shots blocked and TOs than he should.

He also gets to the line more then any player not name melo (and he's in the bottom half of minutes played), I seriously doubts he goes 1 on 3, cause he doesnt hold the ball and wait for the double like melo.

I also don't recalled opposing bigs having big games agaisnt him on a nightly basis, his help defense is horrible, but his man defense is reasonable.

He'wasn't the one getting lit up by every pg in the league, oh wait a minute, with the amount of switching we did, maybe he was.

Once again another poster who judges a player not the sysytem


Check yourself, I always talked about what I disliked about Woodson's coaching. I'm well aware he was a big part of the problem, and if you took the time to read what other people say, maybe you wouldn't be making wild generalizations that have no basis in reality.

If you doubt he goes 1-on-3 maybe watch some games... I mean there's no retort to that, he forced it a ton and if you didn't see I honestly have a hard time believing you were watching.

Of course he goes 1 on 3 and forces horribly!

Its not easy to have a 4+ : 1 USG -> Ast ratio

The numbers don't lie!
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