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Max guys.......
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CrushAlot
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7/10/2014  8:47 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:The problem is that we're not going to be picking up guys for just one year. We're blowing off the 2015, 2016, 2017, etc. free agency periods and blowing off all the trade advantages teams have when their under the cap just so that we can pick up guys whose teams don't even want them.
I think Jax will be opportunistic. I don't think he makes a Cleveland trade in anticipation of a signing but I also don't think he waits in anticipation of a brighter future if there are good moves to be made.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
AUTOADVERT
mreinman
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7/10/2014  9:12 AM
Jmpasq wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

Kenyon Martin and Jr Smith

those guys are not attractions, they are distractions.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
mreinman
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7/10/2014  9:13 AM
CrushAlot wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

Knicks haven't had cap space to bring anyone in other than mini mle guys. I guess you have to judge his recruiting potential based on next offseason when they actually have money.

that is true - but ain't done nuttin yet.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
mreinman
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7/10/2014  9:15 AM
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

so here is what phil is thinking ....
CrushAlot
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7/10/2014  9:45 AM
mreinman wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

Knicks haven't had cap space to bring anyone in other than mini mle guys. I guess you have to judge his recruiting potential based on next offseason when they actually have money.

that is true - but ain't done nuttin yet.


He didn't wait for Tyson to expire.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Nalod
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7/10/2014  10:57 AM
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

mreinman
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7/10/2014  11:00 AM
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

Yup. Forgotten during our great stretch run and playoff performances.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Nalod
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7/10/2014  11:04 AM
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

Yup. Forgotten during our great stretch run and playoff performances.

The concept was getting old ex stars to sign cheap is a formula used by Miami.

It was unsustainable of course in hindsight but the question was not the validity of whether it could, but would Melo attract the type of Veteran Talent.
54 wins and second round bounce was our best showing in 13 previous seasons.

mreinman
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7/10/2014  11:28 AM
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

Yup. Forgotten during our great stretch run and playoff performances.

The concept was getting old ex stars to sign cheap is a formula used by Miami.

It was unsustainable of course in hindsight but the question was not the validity of whether it could, but would Melo attract the type of Veteran Talent.
54 wins and second round bounce was our best showing in 13 previous seasons.

How great would it have been if Kidd stayed on for the last 2 years of his contract?

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Nalod
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7/10/2014  11:39 AM
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

Yup. Forgotten during our great stretch run and playoff performances.

The concept was getting old ex stars to sign cheap is a formula used by Miami.

It was unsustainable of course in hindsight but the question was not the validity of whether it could, but would Melo attract the type of Veteran Talent.
54 wins and second round bounce was our best showing in 13 previous seasons.

How great would it have been if Kidd stayed on for the last 2 years of his contract?

You have to look at his decision to sign on at the moment he did, not hindsight 20-20.
Im not promoting the move as the right one either. But he was bought in as a supporting role and to help Felton.
He came at 3mmper year. He had other offers. He likely had his eye on Woodsons job.

Like most fans, your looking with the benefit of hindsight.

mreinman
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7/10/2014  12:40 PM
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

Yup. Forgotten during our great stretch run and playoff performances.

The concept was getting old ex stars to sign cheap is a formula used by Miami.

It was unsustainable of course in hindsight but the question was not the validity of whether it could, but would Melo attract the type of Veteran Talent.
54 wins and second round bounce was our best showing in 13 previous seasons.

How great would it have been if Kidd stayed on for the last 2 years of his contract?

You have to look at his decision to sign on at the moment he did, not hindsight 20-20.
Im not promoting the move as the right one either. But he was bought in as a supporting role and to help Felton.
He came at 3mmper year. He had other offers. He likely had his eye on Woodsons job.

Like most fans, your looking with the benefit of hindsight.

I just a stupid fan who did not like all the oldies but GM's should know better than to sign guys to multi year contracts that can barely walk.

so here is what phil is thinking ....
Nalod
Posts: 71356
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7/10/2014  4:01 PM
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
Nalod wrote:
mreinman wrote:
PresIke wrote:i think a max contract is relative and harder to assess.

melo may be max to the knicks, because it is not just his value on the court.

it's his value to the organization and attracting other players.

this is particularly for a team with as few assets as the knicks have (more than we had before phil jax came).

so each player's salary is relative to the market, not necessarily actual performance on the court.

Who has Melo attracted?

To quote StarksEwing1IrishJCrush "I mean ... don't get me wrong, I like Melo but he has not attracted anyone"

To be fair, there has not been any room to work with. But, Rashweed and Kidd also did join and had an impact. For a while at least.

Kidd? We are just damn lucky he retired.

Rashweed was just a bundle of fun and he was fiercely competitive ...............on the bench

How quickly you forget the first 6 weeks of the 54 win season..........

Yup. Forgotten during our great stretch run and playoff performances.

The concept was getting old ex stars to sign cheap is a formula used by Miami.

It was unsustainable of course in hindsight but the question was not the validity of whether it could, but would Melo attract the type of Veteran Talent.
54 wins and second round bounce was our best showing in 13 previous seasons.

How great would it have been if Kidd stayed on for the last 2 years of his contract?

You have to look at his decision to sign on at the moment he did, not hindsight 20-20.
Im not promoting the move as the right one either. But he was bought in as a supporting role and to help Felton.
He came at 3mmper year. He had other offers. He likely had his eye on Woodsons job.

Like most fans, your looking with the benefit of hindsight.

I just a stupid fan who did not like all the oldies but GM's should know better than to sign guys to multi year contracts that can barely walk.

Walk? We pulled him out of a ditch in the hamptons, drunk!

tj23
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7/10/2014  6:30 PM
Sometimes you have to overpay for really good players even if they aren't top 10 players. Charlotte gave Al Jefferson a crazy deal(not sure if it was max) and he's a really good player but how good? That team has turned around and is a legit solid team. If not for him they are probably in the basement of the east. If we didn't pay Amare Melo possibly gets traded elsewhere, Gallo is hurt every year and we still haven't even sniffed the playoffs since 04.

It also depends on which max we are talking about. I've seen different variations of it all. If the cap is at 62 Mill you can give out around 3 max deals and if you use the bird exception you can still fill out your team without going over the tax line. I mention the tax line because all the recent talk seems to be that the owners dont want to go over that whereas I thought in the past that wasn't as big of an issue. Anyway, there's probably upwards of 50 guys I'd be willing to give out a max or close to it depending on the situation. It's just much easier to but together a big 3 than a well rounded core of 5 or 6 ok players you'll be overpaying anyway due to the cap restrictions.

Jodie meeks got 6-7 Mill I believe. He's a mediocre backup. I'd much rather pay double that for Chandler Parsons who does everything at least offensively. Meeks is just a spot up shooter. These prices seem to all get driven up and when they do I'll just take the overpaid really good player over the way overpaid role player.

GustavBahler
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7/10/2014  7:34 PM
If we already had a core in place and Melo was younger and healthier, I wouldn't see it as an issue. Doesn't mean I believe that Phil can't find a way around building a contender and giving Melo the max at the same time. Either way I wish Melo would make up his mind.

I'm very curious as to what would be Phil's next deal. Thats more fun to talk about instead of "will Melo or won't he?" Its like talking about a coin flip.

newyorknewyork
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7/10/2014  8:22 PM
Max won't clog cap: Jackson also stated that Anthony accepting a maximum contract of five years, $129 million wouldn’t hamper the Knicks’ future plans.

“No. They’re amenable to what we’re trying to get accomplished,” Jackson said of Anthony and his advisers. “We will discuss it. It’s not a big thing. You guys have made a much bigger thing about this, about what would happen. It’s not really a big thing. It’s about percentages, less than 1 percent available in a series of dollars that go over a period of five years. So, it’s not a big deal. It just gives us more flexibility. That’s all.”

https://vote.nba.com/en Vote for your Knicks.
Max guys.......

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