Yeaaah riiiight!

gunsnewing wrote:Nice to see people finally coming around to tanking. I've only been begging for it for the past 10yrs and being told that it is not the proper way to build a team and there are no guarantees.

Yeaaah riiiight!

As long as you play the youngsters and they are coached up and play hard but don't have enough to win is ok in my book

Playing veteran bums major minutes like we've done in the past to secure 27-30wins is not the way to do it

CrushAlot wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Cleveland didn't tank and got #1

As long as you play the youngsters and they are coached up and play hard but don't have enough to win is ok in my book

Playing veteran bums major minutes like we've done in the past to secure 27-30wins is not the way to do it

Especially when you have a lottery pick and another first rounder sitting on the bench.

I'm not giving Cleveland any credit. I'm just pointing out that it doesn't matter where you finish just as long as you are in the lottery. The worst your record is the better your chances like when we got #2. Unfortunately we gave that pick up which became Aldridge. Just lose baby!!

gunsnewing wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

gunsnewing wrote:Cleveland didn't tank and got #1

As long as you play the youngsters and they are coached up and play hard but don't have enough to win is ok in my book

Playing veteran bums major minutes like we've done in the past to secure 27-30wins is not the way to do it

Especially when you have a lottery pick and another first rounder sitting on the bench.

I'm not giving Cleveland any credit. I'm just pointing out that it doesn't matter where you finish just as long as you are in the lottery. The worst your record is the better your chances like when we got #2. Unfortunately we gave that pick up which became Aldridge. Just lose baby!!

gunsnewing wrote:Cleveland didn't tank and got #1

As long as you play the youngsters and they are coached up and play hard but don't have enough to win is ok in my book

Playing veteran bums major minutes like we've done in the past to secure 27-30wins is not the way to do it

Are you sure about that? They did hire Mike Brown as coach.

1.a large receptacle or storage chamber, especially for liquid or gas.
the container holding the fuel supply in a motor vehicle.
synonyms: container, receptacle, vat, cistern, repository, reservoir, basin More
a receptacle with transparent sides in which to keep fish; an aquarium.
synonyms: aquarium, bowl More

2.a heavy armored fighting vehicle carrying guns and moving on a continuous articulated metal track.
synonyms: armored vehicle, armored car, combat vehicle; More

3.NORTH AMERICANinformal
a cell in a police station or jail.
verb
verb: tank; 3rd person present: tanks; past tense: tanked; past participle: tanked; gerund or present participle: tanking

1.fill the tank of a vehicle with fuel.
"the cars stopped to tank up"
informal
drink heavily; become drunk.
"they get tanked up before the game"

2.USinformal
fail completely, especially at great financial cost.
NORTH AMERICANinformal
(in sports) deliberately lose or fail to finish (a game).
"the lackluster performance prompted speculation that he tanked the second set"

3. KnickFormal
to DeStarphuch MeloCentric roster and Zenify by adding players to implement triangle with younger players. Tanking is having little regard to playoff inclusion and standings. In position of its own draft pick the lower the standings the higher the chances of obtaining a franchise type talent AND if used wisely having a very large Salary Cap figure to sign significant free agents.

Use: "Knicks can tank and rebuild next year", or "Tanking is for losers and loser mentality".

Applicable debate: "Is it better to lose a battle (tank a season) to enable the victory of the War?"*

*Taken from the Nalodian writings "The art of Starphuching" and "Moobian Prayers".

tkf wrote:

Nalod wrote:
Read this article in the times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/18/sports/basketball/knicks-are-changing-with-or-without-carmelo-anthony.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&_r=0

The clarity is really quite simple:

Tank and get a top lottery pick next year while having the ability to sign free agents.

IF Lebron and Love are patient, they can join us.

Really quite simple. Dump Amare and Bargs for a pick or two and start a yoot development and simply Tank.

Run the the triangle and nothing else. Lose every game if need be. Be ready for 2015. Should have a top 3 pick in the draft.

Let Melo go, get the euro from Chicago. We can take Boozer. Have to have bodies. Trade Tyson for a low 1st rounder or for a yoot to a team that wants to win now. OKC? Chicago? Golden state?

Small moves add up. Let the coaches do their thing and let the culture begin.

Year two could be huge fun, year three we compete. No lebron or Love? We can make trades with cap space and yoots.

Its the concept, no guarantees, no starphuch and no hype. I can't sell it but it makes sense. You get Melo in a bad contract with bad injury and we are done for years. Can't tie up an asset like him at his age. Dice killed us, Amare kills us. Enough!

Relax Starphuchers, we'll have plenty to cheer. To win we'll have players who will be stars not because we annoint them, but because they produce WINNING.

If Mooby needs to go, so be it. We learned our lesson. If he stays, I think the triangle with the talent we have could be a good team if Melo wants to have his ZEN baptism and give him self to the force. The reality is Melo and Phil might not think that is a good idea and we are in fact trying to help him move and recieve something in return.

As the ZenMaster says, We move forward either way.

The future is bright but we can't see it.

I don't like losing on purpose.. develop a plan, stick to it and try to win and if you don't, the draft is your reward..

lebron and love can stay where they are for all I care.. love is a good player, but I have my reservations.. lebron is a douchebag and I have a hard time rooting for him to win..

hoping for lebron is no different to me, than him trying to stack the deck in miami to win..

I appreciate the struggle and the rebuilding... I appreciate the way dirk did it.. he earned it.. I appreciate that Ewing and Barkley got close but just couldn't win it.. I appreciate the struggle..

i want to beat lebron... End of story..

I was convinced once Lebron was saving this franchise Im not getting fooled again. That guy wouldnt hack it in NY. If we trade Melo ad Tyson we wont be tanking on purpose we will be that bad. The good news is maybe Shumpert or Hardaway become better players without Melo here. Hopefully we get to trade Melo and grab a young player and a pick, Get a pick back for Tyson. Sign some free agents cheap and hope we can trade them at the deadline for another pick. Start collecting assets again

tkf wrote:

Vmart wrote:

nyvector16 wrote:Losing on purpose is how Lebron ended up in Cleveland...
Losing on purpose is how Tim Duncan ended up with the Spurs...
Losing on purpose is how the 76ers have a high pick this year...

when you are not competing... you have to tank.

Knicks could have easily tanked in the early 2000s and it would have saved the team from a decade of mediocrity.... That is how it goes in the NBA...

Precisely tanking is a GMs strategic tool. The Knicks should have engaged in the practice while they were giddy getting 27-35 wins over a decade just what we're they trying to prove. The Knicks were caught again and again no mans land of drafting. Not good enough to get the prized picks and not good enough to get into the playoffs.

thats not completely true.. because if you look at the picks we have had, a lot of those players are main cogs on winning teams. the knicks suffered from not making the best choices, take note of jordan hill... I mean what is considered prize picks? at what number does it stop? top 10? top 5? Heck shumpert around here is valued, he wasn't a lottery pick. do you think we can win with shumpert? a few people around here do, well guess where he was drafted? I don't understand the no mans land with picks..

Isiah picked a lot of guys outside the lottery that was good... David lee, trevor ariza, were all no mans land picks I guess, and guess what, I would rather have them now, on this team, then what we have right now...

Those players are all surrounding pieces which are needed to build a good team however the Knicks never found the true difference maker. You could argue had Isiah not traded for Curry though they might of got 1

dk7th wrote:

Vmart wrote:

tkf wrote:

Vmart wrote:

nyvector16 wrote:Losing on purpose is how Lebron ended up in Cleveland...
Losing on purpose is how Tim Duncan ended up with the Spurs...
Losing on purpose is how the 76ers have a high pick this year...

when you are not competing... you have to tank.

Knicks could have easily tanked in the early 2000s and it would have saved the team from a decade of mediocrity.... That is how it goes in the NBA...

Precisely tanking is a GMs strategic tool. The Knicks should have engaged in the practice while they were giddy getting 27-35 wins over a decade just what we're they trying to prove. The Knicks were caught again and again no mans land of drafting. Not good enough to get the prized picks and not good enough to get into the playoffs.

thats not completely true.. because if you look at the picks we have had, a lot of those players are main cogs on winning teams. the knicks suffered from not making the best choices, take note of jordan hill... I mean what is considered prize picks? at what number does it stop? top 10? top 5? Heck shumpert around here is valued, he wasn't a lottery pick. do you think we can win with shumpert? a few people around here do, well guess where he was drafted? I don't understand the no mans land with picks..

Isiah picked a lot of guys outside the lottery that was good... David lee, trevor ariza, were all no mans land picks I guess, and guess what, I would rather have them now, on this team, then what we have right now...

I think you don't understand tanking, tanking means making sure you are going to get the 4th pick at worst, and that is if three teams jump you its giving yourself the optimum chance at getting the number 1 overall. One time the Knicks got a 2 pick it turned into Aldridge. after that the Knicks were always picking 6 or worse. I agree with you that they never picked well with their pick but that is another story. A good tank job takes the decision making out of the hands of the organization.

how do you go about making sure you get the 4th pick at worst? have players throw games and not compete as hard as they can? coaches putting out terrible lineups and not teaching?

You cant its what the FO does. However its not like there is any flexibility for Jackson to do anything different anyway.

Nalod wrote:

Jmpasq wrote:

tkf wrote:

Nalod wrote:
Read this article in the times:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/18/sports/basketball/knicks-are-changing-with-or-without-carmelo-anthony.html?partner=rssnyt&emc=rss&_r=0

The clarity is really quite simple:

Tank and get a top lottery pick next year while having the ability to sign free agents.

IF Lebron and Love are patient, they can join us.

Really quite simple. Dump Amare and Bargs for a pick or two and start a yoot development and simply Tank.

Run the the triangle and nothing else. Lose every game if need be. Be ready for 2015. Should have a top 3 pick in the draft.

Let Melo go, get the euro from Chicago. We can take Boozer. Have to have bodies. Trade Tyson for a low 1st rounder or for a yoot to a team that wants to win now. OKC? Chicago? Golden state?

Small moves add up. Let the coaches do their thing and let the culture begin.

Year two could be huge fun, year three we compete. No lebron or Love? We can make trades with cap space and yoots.

Its the concept, no guarantees, no starphuch and no hype. I can't sell it but it makes sense. You get Melo in a bad contract with bad injury and we are done for years. Can't tie up an asset like him at his age. Dice killed us, Amare kills us. Enough!

Relax Starphuchers, we'll have plenty to cheer. To win we'll have players who will be stars not because we annoint them, but because they produce WINNING.

If Mooby needs to go, so be it. We learned our lesson. If he stays, I think the triangle with the talent we have could be a good team if Melo wants to have his ZEN baptism and give him self to the force. The reality is Melo and Phil might not think that is a good idea and we are in fact trying to help him move and recieve something in return.

As the ZenMaster says, We move forward either way.

The future is bright but we can't see it.

I don't like losing on purpose.. develop a plan, stick to it and try to win and if you don't, the draft is your reward..

lebron and love can stay where they are for all I care.. love is a good player, but I have my reservations.. lebron is a douchebag and I have a hard time rooting for him to win..

hoping for lebron is no different to me, than him trying to stack the deck in miami to win..

I appreciate the struggle and the rebuilding... I appreciate the way dirk did it.. he earned it.. I appreciate that Ewing and Barkley got close but just couldn't win it.. I appreciate the struggle..

i want to beat lebron... End of story..

I was convinced once Lebron was saving this franchise Im not getting fooled again. That guy wouldnt hack it in NY. If we trade Melo ad Tyson we wont be tanking on purpose we will be that bad. The good news is maybe Shumpert or Hardaway become better players without Melo here. Hopefully we get to trade Melo and grab a young player and a pick, Get a pick back for Tyson. Sign some free agents cheap and hope we can trade them at the deadline for another pick. Start collecting assets again

"won't get fooled again" speaks more about your fragility than Lebrons! I'll give Melo credit that he tried to come here under the scrutiny of the media and tried to "hack it". What is it about Lebron that he would no "hack"? He is the best player on the planet. What we likely could no hack is MSG being able to construct a team around him and thus the "Blame" would fall on him. I don't think its melo that failed in NY, but the asset drain we did to obtain him which handicapped our ability to staff a proper roster. Sounds like since lebron rejected knicks you have some sour grapes.

4 trips to the finals under incredible scrutiny and self inflated expectations is not choking. Lebron is not Jordan. BTW, Jordan was a free agent many times and was smart enough to stay away from MSG.

The asset drain that Melo himself caused , how is that not his fault. Incredible scrutiny that Lebron desperately tried to manage by playing with Wade who at the time could of been considered a top 3 player. Unfortunately for Lebron , Wades game started to deteriorate putting the focus squarely on him anyway. I don't want to see the Knicks rebuilding plan to be clear as much cap room for Lebron. Doing that caused Walsh to make stupid 1 sided trades that injured the teams flexibility.