or should we do what the cavs, kings, pelicans, bobcats, sixers, twolves, and evry other young rebuilding team is doing, which keeps them in the lottery until they strike gold..save it brother it ain't happening in NY

NardDogNation wrote:

djsunyc wrote:new york sports fans are stupid.

yes, we are stupid. we are not as smart as we think we are.

the knicks fans chanted stephon marbury's name when he was benched by d'antoni.

new york sports fans are no different than the mob in the roman colosseum.

you think these fans will sit back and wait for some younger players to develop? this board used to destroy david lee and have already given up on shump.

here's how a ny gm has to operate (in all sports) - win in every single trade and then proceed to challenge for a title within 3 years of being hired. that's what the fans want.

any plan involving waiting will never work here. especially after being burned in 2010 by not getting anyone.

Once upon a time we developed Patrick Ewing, Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, John Starks, Anthony Mason and Charlie Ward. Most recently, we had successfully developed Gallo, Wilson Chandler, Landry Fields (with mixed results) and essentially Jeremy Lin. I disagree with the premise that we can't develop young talent here because it's been done before. Patience is a different story, however.

There was a time when Patrick Ewing was considered a bust early on. As for Mark Jackosn, he was benced in favor of an ancient Mo Cheeks because the fans lacked patience. Strickland? Never got a chance to develop him because we traded him for Mo' Cheeks. Starks, Mase and Ward were on veteran teams that were still decent, so they never felt the pressure of a full rebuild. I have to agree with the DJ. I'm a Mets fan and I see it there too. I'm not sure the fan base has the patience for a full rebuild. It's also hard to justify with ticket prices. The best way for us to do it is the Spurs model. Intense scouting and lil luck while maintaining a solid roster.

BigDaddyG wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

djsunyc wrote:new york sports fans are stupid.

yes, we are stupid. we are not as smart as we think we are.

the knicks fans chanted stephon marbury's name when he was benched by d'antoni.

new york sports fans are no different than the mob in the roman colosseum.

you think these fans will sit back and wait for some younger players to develop? this board used to destroy david lee and have already given up on shump.

here's how a ny gm has to operate (in all sports) - win in every single trade and then proceed to challenge for a title within 3 years of being hired. that's what the fans want.

any plan involving waiting will never work here. especially after being burned in 2010 by not getting anyone.

Once upon a time we developed Patrick Ewing, Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, John Starks, Anthony Mason and Charlie Ward. Most recently, we had successfully developed Gallo, Wilson Chandler, Landry Fields (with mixed results) and essentially Jeremy Lin. I disagree with the premise that we can't develop young talent here because it's been done before. Patience is a different story, however.

There was a time when Patrick Ewing was considered a bust early on. As for Mark Jackosn, he was benced in favor of an ancient Mo Cheeks because the fans lacked patience. Strickland? Never got a chance to develop him because we traded him for Mo' Cheeks. Starks, Mase and Ward were on veteran teams that were still decent, so they never felt the pressure of a full rebuild. I have to agree with the DJ. I'm a Mets fan and I see it there too. I'm not sure the fan base has the patience for a full rebuild. It's also hard to justify with ticket prices. The best way for us to do it is the Spurs model. Intense scouting and lil luck while maintaining a solid roster.

We give away every pick we can. And if melo and Dolan weren't do greedy and stupid. Wed have chandler gallo mosgov and our draft picks.

Some of u guys are delusional as well. We have a lottery team even though we are trying.

Knicksfan wrote:Music to my ears, Briggs.

Im tired of the NY mentality that you can't rebuild here and yada yada. Wonder why you can't also win a chip here?

Start anew! Melo wont get us to be champions unless he has a main man leading him and we dont have the means to get that main guy.

We need young assets and the difference we have to the Isiah and Layden's days ia the fact we do have good talent to trade in Melo, Tyson, J.R., Felton and so. They can help a winning team, simply we aren't one with them.

Rebuild! Take the hit because considering the money available in 2015 and the main guys we could attract, we could be in for a quick rebuilding that geta us back on track pretty soon.

Knicks fan. We could trade melo chandler for numerous assets we get top 5 pick and max cap space. It's a one year process for the good of ten

BRIGGS wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

VCoug wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:This team stinks--if you cant see that your blind. We have lottery win talent in our backcourt and this is NOT changing. I could care less who is coach when we play a team that has a John Wall--we cant win from the start of the game. Look at Damian Lillard the other night. What coach can stop this bleeding from a talent side? We have two 4wards Martin and Amare who at anytime can implode--they were on a platoon system--what winning NBA teams have that? Bargani is terribly inconsistent JR smith too--so this team cant win we have NO chance to beat a good team in 5 games let alone 7--we dont have the talent.

Arent you guys girls fans scared that the asset we gave up so much for-- that he can easily just walk end of season for no compensation--will just do so? Do we want the guy for 5 years and 150 anyway? Lets get real I mean REAL

I say the following
trade Carmelo Anthony to the highest bidder for a deal that focuses on getting much younger and younger with a plan.
Convince Amare Stoudemire end of season to opt out and become part of the franchise management
Trade teh vets including Tyson with the same goal as Cramelo--get youngher and focus towards 2015--that goes for anyone on the team

The guys I can focus on are Murry Hardaway Aldrich Tyler and any young guys we get in a trade. Make Bargani the main guy and concentrate on letting him increase his trade value
Move out the coaching staff and start new

Im basically planning for 2015 now--thats how you do ti in the NBA--we cultivate young players for 1.5 years with the goal of having a top 5 pick adn maximum cap sapce for 2015 to rebuild the team in a way that can be stabilized for 6-8 years

Hoping this team turns around is blind faith--its not reality based--Id rather sck now and have a plan in place then sck for another decade.

I'm all for it. This team is clearly going nowhere and we need to start preparing for the future. The Lakers, Clippers, Thunder, Bucks, Wizards, Pelicans, Pistons, and Cavs are all teams with tradeable assets that would be interested in parts of our roster. We need to auction of our players and get back as many draft picks and young players with potential that we can. Without taking back large salaries in 2015. Tank next season for the highest pick possible and rebuild that Summer. And then, with the other picks we received, we'll be able to consistently add capable players of our hopefully talented team so we can continue to improve.

you think rebuilding is the way to go..give me an example of how that worked for one team outside of san an..

please give me a bunch of young players on a roster that went to the the nba finals..

Indiana
Portland
Oklahoma City
Chicago
Miami wade
San antonio

Do u watch the nba?

none of those teams have won a championship building through the draft except san an, and I excluded them in my post..thats really 1 team out of 31..

portland.. off to a good start after 14 games but have been horrible and had multiple high picks.
OKC.. nice finals run..no champion ship ever
chicago.. d rose injury prone..deng..injury prone..the rest of there roster via trades or FA's no rings
miami... wade got his ring with the help of shaq and mourning..they certainly did not build through
the draft..don't mention lbj and bosh
Indian... hibbert via trade, david west FA,george hill,via trade

No ones building a championship through the draft Briggs thats your imagination..

And if you luck up and get a good high pick like a melo, stat, shaq, kg, LBJ, bosh, jennings, ect...there more likely to demand a trade or leave as a FA..don't kidd yourself buddy..

You have 3 years to build yourself a championship team or that roster is gone

knicks1248 wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

knicks1248 wrote:

VCoug wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:This team stinks--if you cant see that your blind. We have lottery win talent in our backcourt and this is NOT changing. I could care less who is coach when we play a team that has a John Wall--we cant win from the start of the game. Look at Damian Lillard the other night. What coach can stop this bleeding from a talent side? We have two 4wards Martin and Amare who at anytime can implode--they were on a platoon system--what winning NBA teams have that? Bargani is terribly inconsistent JR smith too--so this team cant win we have NO chance to beat a good team in 5 games let alone 7--we dont have the talent.

Arent you guys girls fans scared that the asset we gave up so much for-- that he can easily just walk end of season for no compensation--will just do so? Do we want the guy for 5 years and 150 anyway? Lets get real I mean REAL

I say the following
trade Carmelo Anthony to the highest bidder for a deal that focuses on getting much younger and younger with a plan.
Convince Amare Stoudemire end of season to opt out and become part of the franchise management
Trade teh vets including Tyson with the same goal as Cramelo--get youngher and focus towards 2015--that goes for anyone on the team

The guys I can focus on are Murry Hardaway Aldrich Tyler and any young guys we get in a trade. Make Bargani the main guy and concentrate on letting him increase his trade value
Move out the coaching staff and start new

Im basically planning for 2015 now--thats how you do ti in the NBA--we cultivate young players for 1.5 years with the goal of having a top 5 pick adn maximum cap sapce for 2015 to rebuild the team in a way that can be stabilized for 6-8 years

Hoping this team turns around is blind faith--its not reality based--Id rather sck now and have a plan in place then sck for another decade.

I'm all for it. This team is clearly going nowhere and we need to start preparing for the future. The Lakers, Clippers, Thunder, Bucks, Wizards, Pelicans, Pistons, and Cavs are all teams with tradeable assets that would be interested in parts of our roster. We need to auction of our players and get back as many draft picks and young players with potential that we can. Without taking back large salaries in 2015. Tank next season for the highest pick possible and rebuild that Summer. And then, with the other picks we received, we'll be able to consistently add capable players of our hopefully talented team so we can continue to improve.

you think rebuilding is the way to go..give me an example of how that worked for one team outside of san an..

please give me a bunch of young players on a roster that went to the the nba finals..

Indiana
Portland
Oklahoma City
Chicago
Miami wade
San antonio

Do u watch the nba?

none of those teams have won a championship building through the draft except san an, and I excluded them in my post..thats really 1 team out of 31..

portland.. off to a good start after 14 games but have been horrible and had multiple high picks.
OKC.. nice finals run..no champion ship ever
chicago.. d rose injury prone..deng..injury prone..the rest of there roster via trades or FA's no rings
miami... wade got his ring with the help of shaq and mourning..they certainly did not build through
the draft..don't mention lbj and bosh
Indian... hibbert via trade, david west FA,george hill,via trade

No ones building a championship through the draft Briggs thats your imagination..

And if you luck up and get a good high pick like a melo, stat, shaq, kg, LBJ, bosh, jennings, ect...there more likely to demand a trade or leave as a FA..don't kidd yourself buddy..

You have 3 years to build yourself a championship team or that roster is gone

Every good team has a drafted superstar all of the teams that are good in the NBA are built through the draft--there is no rebuttal against pure fact.

BigDaddyG wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

djsunyc wrote:new york sports fans are stupid.

yes, we are stupid. we are not as smart as we think we are.

the knicks fans chanted stephon marbury's name when he was benched by d'antoni.

new york sports fans are no different than the mob in the roman colosseum.

you think these fans will sit back and wait for some younger players to develop? this board used to destroy david lee and have already given up on shump.

here's how a ny gm has to operate (in all sports) - win in every single trade and then proceed to challenge for a title within 3 years of being hired. that's what the fans want.

any plan involving waiting will never work here. especially after being burned in 2010 by not getting anyone.

Once upon a time we developed Patrick Ewing, Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, John Starks, Anthony Mason and Charlie Ward. Most recently, we had successfully developed Gallo, Wilson Chandler, Landry Fields (with mixed results) and essentially Jeremy Lin. I disagree with the premise that we can't develop young talent here because it's been done before. Patience is a different story, however.

There was a time when Patrick Ewing was considered a bust early on. As for Mark Jackosn, he was benced in favor of an ancient Mo Cheeks because the fans lacked patience. Strickland? Never got a chance to develop him because we traded him for Mo' Cheeks. Starks, Mase and Ward were on veteran teams that were still decent, so they never felt the pressure of a full rebuild. I have to agree with the DJ. I'm a Mets fan and I see it there too. I'm not sure the fan base has the patience for a full rebuild. It's also hard to justify with ticket prices. The best way for us to do it is the Spurs model. Intense scouting and lil luck while maintaining a solid roster.

We give away every pick we can. And if melo and Dolan weren't do greedy and stupid. Wed have chandler gallo mosgov and our draft picks.

Some of u guys are delusional as well. We have a lottery team even though we are trying.

You just said it yourself. As long as Dolan is the owner, this squad is screwed. We need someone like Dave Checketts, someone who has a vision and the autonomy to see it fulfilled. Not saying Checketts did no wrong, but he was competent and he had the ability to change directions when it was apparent things weren't working. That will never happen ss long as Dolan keep tinkering with the team and relying on sports management agencies for advice on running the team. Doesn't matter what figure head is in charge of day to day operations.

Why if Dolan now believes in metrics--start with the number 1 metric...... EVERY SINGLE NBA team that is good or has a chance ton win the nBA title al have the same thing in common--they ALL have atleast 1 drafted superstar. EVERY SINGLE good team has a star drafted by their own team.

BRIGGS wrote:

BigDaddyG wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

djsunyc wrote:new york sports fans are stupid.

yes, we are stupid. we are not as smart as we think we are.

the knicks fans chanted stephon marbury's name when he was benched by d'antoni.

new york sports fans are no different than the mob in the roman colosseum.

you think these fans will sit back and wait for some younger players to develop? this board used to destroy david lee and have already given up on shump.

here's how a ny gm has to operate (in all sports) - win in every single trade and then proceed to challenge for a title within 3 years of being hired. that's what the fans want.

any plan involving waiting will never work here. especially after being burned in 2010 by not getting anyone.

Once upon a time we developed Patrick Ewing, Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, John Starks, Anthony Mason and Charlie Ward. Most recently, we had successfully developed Gallo, Wilson Chandler, Landry Fields (with mixed results) and essentially Jeremy Lin. I disagree with the premise that we can't develop young talent here because it's been done before. Patience is a different story, however.

There was a time when Patrick Ewing was considered a bust early on. As for Mark Jackosn, he was benced in favor of an ancient Mo Cheeks because the fans lacked patience. Strickland? Never got a chance to develop him because we traded him for Mo' Cheeks. Starks, Mase and Ward were on veteran teams that were still decent, so they never felt the pressure of a full rebuild. I have to agree with the DJ. I'm a Mets fan and I see it there too. I'm not sure the fan base has the patience for a full rebuild. It's also hard to justify with ticket prices. The best way for us to do it is the Spurs model. Intense scouting and lil luck while maintaining a solid roster.

We give away every pick we can. And if melo and Dolan weren't do greedy and stupid. Wed have chandler gallo mosgov and our draft picks.

Some of u guys are delusional as well. We have a lottery team even though we are trying.

Melo i'm sure thought he was being paired with an top 5 MVP candidate the yr prior(Billups) and top 5 MVP candidate that current season (Amare).

Amare stays healthy or if Amare is amnestied and we signed a player with the money freed up from his contract that could actually stay healthy and produce then its a different situation.

The Knicks organization no matter what route we take doesn't have the ability to make a string of proper decisions to build a contender.

BigDaddyG wrote:

NardDogNation wrote:

djsunyc wrote:new york sports fans are stupid.

yes, we are stupid. we are not as smart as we think we are.

the knicks fans chanted stephon marbury's name when he was benched by d'antoni.

new york sports fans are no different than the mob in the roman colosseum.

you think these fans will sit back and wait for some younger players to develop? this board used to destroy david lee and have already given up on shump.

here's how a ny gm has to operate (in all sports) - win in every single trade and then proceed to challenge for a title within 3 years of being hired. that's what the fans want.

any plan involving waiting will never work here. especially after being burned in 2010 by not getting anyone.

Once upon a time we developed Patrick Ewing, Mark Jackson, Rod Strickland, John Starks, Anthony Mason and Charlie Ward. Most recently, we had successfully developed Gallo, Wilson Chandler, Landry Fields (with mixed results) and essentially Jeremy Lin. I disagree with the premise that we can't develop young talent here because it's been done before. Patience is a different story, however.

There was a time when Patrick Ewing was considered a bust early on. As for Mark Jackosn, he was benced in favor of an ancient Mo Cheeks because the fans lacked patience. Strickland? Never got a chance to develop him because we traded him for Mo' Cheeks. Starks, Mase and Ward were on veteran teams that were still decent, so they never felt the pressure of a full rebuild. I have to agree with the DJ. I'm a Mets fan and I see it there too. I'm not sure the fan base has the patience for a full rebuild. It's also hard to justify with ticket prices. The best way for us to do it is the Spurs model. Intense scouting and lil luck while maintaining a solid roster.

Fair points. I think that I've made the mistake of believing the a fresh way of doing things is the same as rebuilding. The Knicks need to do a better job of using all tools available to them (cap space, trades and picks), particularly picks with an established core in place.