gunsnewing wrote:Well even if things never change. I want to pain, stress and embarrassment to be inflicted on Dolan just as it has been on us all these years. I want to be miserable despite the fact that he has all the money in the world. I won't go after far as death but I wish nothing but the worst for him

I'll refrain from any talk telling you how to be a fan. But rooting for losses based on a negative obsession and for bad things to happen to Dolan does not seem very healthy to me.

dk7th wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

dk7th wrote:

jrodmc wrote:

JohnStarksFan wrote:This is getting philosophical. To be clear, I don't have a choice to be a Knicks fan. And by default I can't escape the constant bombardment of brain vomit coming from the media regarding my team. Even if I only watched the games, I'd have to do so on mute to get more analysis than fluff and overblown accusations. I just wish there was less drama. It's basketball, not real housewives.

That is the key, grasshopper.
You can always continue to look at brain vomit for what it is. Helps to have that outlook on here, as well. In retaining your fandom, I mean.

Win or lose, enjoy the team. More than you enjoy trying to be right or explaining how to manage things you will never have any input to.
Stick with them; good, bad or infuriating.

you can be a fan of the knicks and express displeasure and dissatisfaction with the goings-on. they are not mutually exclusive.

and ever since dolan has been the owner there has been almost no good, only bad and infuriating. i am not going to tell others how to be fans, but at this point only knuckleheads can support let alone enjoy this crapfest.

Just make sure you are not confusing supporting with rooting for the team. I root for this team. I don't support Grunwald being fired or Steve Mills being hired. I don't support Chris SMith being on the team and I don't support Dolan apparently being more hands on in decision making (i.e. minutes limits and line ups). But once the ball is tipped I am locked in and rooting for the Knicks to win and I certainly don't support them losing for a change in the coaching staff or so that I can blast certain players.

"support" and "root for" are synonyms. what you are struggling to distinguish is the front office from the product that is its manifestation on the floor, or dolan and mills on the one hand and the players and i guess now woodson on the other.

the fish rots from the head down. there is no distinction. it is like saying there is no connection between the flower on the one hand and the plant with it's roots underground on the other. making such a distinction requires a psychological splitting or compartmentalization akin to brainwashing oneself in order to cope.

i sympathize with decent people who are caught in bad situations, just as i take no joy in seeing my team being pulled back into irrelevance.

Then how can you not see how "be a fan of the knicks" and "only knuckleheads can support let alone enjoy this crapfest" would have to be mutually exclusive?

Many on here's fandom is based, as I have pointed out, on themselves. Not the Knicks. Themselves. Their opinions. Their insights. Their management of player personnel. Their coaching insticts. They come first, not the Knicks. That's not brainwashing, that's worldview.

It's simple. And it's okay. Just ask yourself this question: Are you a fan of yourself before you're a fan of the Knicks?

If the fish rots all the way down, why do you care about this particular fish to begin with?

jrodmc wrote:
Then who can you not see how "be a fan of the knicks" and "only knuckleheads can support let alone enjoy this crapfest" would have to be mutually exclusive?

Many on here's fandom is based, as I have pointed out, on themselves. Not the Knicks. Themselves. Their opinions. Their insights. Their management of player personnel. Their coaching insticts. They come first, not the Knicks. That's not brainwashing, that's worldview.

It's simple. And it's okay. Just ask yourself this question: Are you a fan of yourself before you're a fan of the Knicks?

If the fish rots all the way down, why do you care about this particular fish to begin with?

Dude, again I think you are taking this way too far. To start calling people out as egotistical and then burp up your own philosophies on civilization and psychology is troubling.

Let me go back to the point of this thread. NY gets too much burn, has for years, and most of the time it is disproportionate to the burn thrown around to other teams. That makes it harder to love the team sometimes. It takes too much away from the court.

As far as us fans giving our insights and opinions, it comes from the state of our club, the one we've been cheering for and felt a part of since we were kids. It's us trying to will our prophesying into reality through writing it down for like-minded fans to read and weigh in on. Why else would these guys keep coming back here for so long with a dispirited, mismanaged club that kept missing the playoffs year after year? Maybe the next generation of knicks fans will be able to not overthink the madness because they will have a new owner, with a new approach, new staff, and a coach who's not a lap-dog and given the freedom to do what's right? A great dream. Problem is, when that happens our old arses will be sitting next to these young bucks, asking questions they won't even think about. It's learned behavior I guess, if you want to start dissecting the psychological foundation of it.

Essentially, you're telling us to "be easy" with regards to our fandom. I wish you would take your own advice.

JohnStarksFan wrote:

jrodmc wrote:
Then who can you not see how "be a fan of the knicks" and "only knuckleheads can support let alone enjoy this crapfest" would have to be mutually exclusive?

Many on here's fandom is based, as I have pointed out, on themselves. Not the Knicks. Themselves. Their opinions. Their insights. Their management of player personnel. Their coaching insticts. They come first, not the Knicks. That's not brainwashing, that's worldview.

It's simple. And it's okay. Just ask yourself this question: Are you a fan of yourself before you're a fan of the Knicks?

If the fish rots all the way down, why do you care about this particular fish to begin with?

Dude, again I think you are taking this way too far. To start calling people out as egotistical and then burp up your own philosophies on civilization and psychology is troubling.

Let me go back to the point of this thread. NY gets too much burn, has for years, and most of the time it is disproportionate to the burn thrown around to other teams. That makes it harder to love the team sometimes. It takes too much away from the court.

As far as us fans giving our insights and opinions, it comes from the state of our club, the one we've been cheering for and felt a part of since we were kids. It's us trying to will our prophesying into reality through writing it down for like-minded fans to read and weigh in on. Why else would these guys keep coming back here for so long with a dispirited, mismanaged club that kept missing the playoffs year after year? Maybe the next generation of knicks fans will be able to not overthink the madness because they will have a new owner, with a new approach, new staff, and a coach who's not a lap-dog and given the freedom to do what's right? A great dream. Problem is, when that happens our old arses will be sitting next to these young bucks, asking questions they won't even think about. It's learned behavior I guess, if you want to start dissecting the psychological foundation of it.

Essentially, you're telling us to "be easy" with regards to our fandom. I wish you would take your own advice.

great post..