Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:Komives and Bellamy for Debuschure??????

We paid too much!!!!!

Or did we?

you are just cranky cause I called out Donnie and not Melo. you aren't objective at all. you have never called out Donnie for signing Amare but gave Isaiah a lot of grief for Marbury. towel bury right? yah, that didn't get old. but when I blame Donnie for Amare, that's old news and all you have is wise cracks. nothing to add but garbage jokes. Amare still plays for nyc. I mean, didn't play but still gets paid cause of Donnie.

Amare was signed just to get other big tickets to come to NY. He was the only thing available. And he played great for us before his body give up.

arkrud wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:Komives and Bellamy for Debuschure??????

We paid too much!!!!!

Or did we?

you are just cranky cause I called out Donnie and not Melo. you aren't objective at all. you have never called out Donnie for signing Amare but gave Isaiah a lot of grief for Marbury. towel bury right? yah, that didn't get old. but when I blame Donnie for Amare, that's old news and all you have is wise cracks. nothing to add but garbage jokes. Amare still plays for nyc. I mean, didn't play but still gets paid cause of Donnie.

Amare was signed just to get other big tickets to come to NY. He was the only thing available. And he played great for us before his body give up.

You mean before Melo came over. Stress adds to injuries as well. And Melo elevated that stress with his ISO ball, which put Amari on an island since he's a system guy. Trying to make them play together was the biggest waste of time. If I was the GM at the time, it was clear they did not compliment each other....I would've traded Amari before he got injured. But he's here now and lets hope he proves me and others wrong.

arkrud wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

arkrud wrote:There is a good saying - "Do not show half-done job to a fool"
Donne was half-way into his plan when Dolan scratched everything with panic run for Melo.
Walsh started with laughing joke of a team and almost get it to relevance... before Dolan put a hammer on it.
Some people are getting some comfort in finding escape-goats knowing that the problem we have (Dolan) is not fixable.

his full done jobs in Indiana didn't win any championships either.

True... but he did a great job in Indiana and it was a solid team for long time, not a joke like Knicks.

Ehh, they were good, but they only made real waves when Bird orchestrated most of the moves(Hibbert, West, George, Hill etc).

Owner sets the directive. Thats my belief. Whole world knows we clearing cap so the price goes up.

Whats with the whole "Blame" thing anyway?

Donnie gone a while now, and I don't see any reason to bring it up for the 50th time.

I can ignore it, but what fun would that be.

Y'all remember my stance son things? Im flattered!

BTW, don't forget this when evaluating the Pacers:
I

n July 2011, Pritchard joined the Indiana Pacers to become their Director of Player Personnel.[13] Later on, he was promoted to general manager in June 2012 to replace David Morway.

Go back and remember the Isiah years and look up the records. It was pretty bad. Shyt on Walsh all you want but he is the guy that had to clean up the stench.

smackeddog wrote:

Nalod wrote:Donnie was bought in to clear the cap and make a run at Lebron.

Owner sets the directive. Thats my belief. Whole world knows we clearing cap so the price goes up.

Whats with the whole "Blame" thing anyway?

Donnie gone a while now, and I don't see any reason to bring it up for the 50th time.

I can ignore it, but what fun would that be.

Y'all remember my stance son things? Im flattered!

BTW, don't forget this when evaluating the Pacers:
I

n July 2011, Pritchard joined the Indiana Pacers to become their Director of Player Personnel.[13] Later on, he was promoted to general manager in June 2012 to replace David Morway.

Go back and remember the Isiah years and look up the records. It was pretty bad. Shyt on Walsh all you want but he is the guy that had to clean up the stench.

He cleared up a mess but almost recreated it in the form of Joe Johnson and Amar'e! Most of his moves didn't work out and few look good in hindsight (though to be fair everything is easier with hindsight)

Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:Donnie was bought in to clear the cap and make a run at Lebron.

Owner sets the directive. Thats my belief. Whole world knows we clearing cap so the price goes up.

Whats with the whole "Blame" thing anyway?

Donnie gone a while now, and I don't see any reason to bring it up for the 50th time.

I can ignore it, but what fun would that be.

Y'all remember my stance son things? Im flattered!

BTW, don't forget this when evaluating the Pacers:
I

n July 2011, Pritchard joined the Indiana Pacers to become their Director of Player Personnel.[13] Later on, he was promoted to general manager in June 2012 to replace David Morway.

Go back and remember the Isiah years and look up the records. It was pretty bad. Shyt on Walsh all you want but he is the guy that had to clean up the stench.

How come you start the post by saying the owner sets the "directive" (I think you meant direction) and then ask me to remember the Isiah years? We all know how bad Dolan is. If its the owner that sets the "directive" then you cannot blame anything on any of our GMs which is BS. Lets also hold GMs accountable. Fact is, Donnie traded talent and didn't bring any back. Donnie doesn't get a pass for 4 years just because the Isiah years were bad.

Donnie Walsh is polite and classy and brings in good character guys. Yup, he is a great guy. But he is not a great GM. His Amare signing set us back years just like Layden's Allan Houston contract. You can blame Houston's contact on Dolan but Amare was completely Donnie Walsh and his master plan. His second star was going to be Joe Johnson who is an even bigger ISO baller than Amare! Donnie didn't bring in talent, he traded it away. Look at what Zach Randolph and David Lee have done since leaving the Knicks. We could use a post player and a big man that can run up the court. Amare cannot do either. Thanks Donnie. Thanks for not insuring his contract and signing him to the max when no one else would.

home owner tells the painter to paint the house purple and it looks bad. Painter does a good job but the house looks awful. Whose to blame? The one that picked the color.

We really don't know who picked Amare do we?

Not saying walsh did not have his share of luck and misfortune regarding some personal, but don't they all?

Knicks with Melo has made the playoffs so by some standard the team was elevated. I think Melo was always part of the bigger plan if lebron did not come. Was that Donnies choice? Evidence we know points otherwise.

Was it melo he had a problem with or the price we paid? Was it walsh thought at that price a championship could not be won?

We don't know.

Im not defending Donnie so much as pointing to the organization as a whole. The record speaks louder than our opinions and blame is luxury we can appoint in hindsight.

Any knick GM not named Eddie Donovan is assigned some sort of blame. Even Donnie.

Can't for the life of me imagine Donnie being the primary driver to sign Amare. Its not his style.

Just my opinion.

Houstan had an opt out and I always believe knicks had a gentleman's agreement in place to resign him so he is a top 5 payed player. What GM has that kind of power?

arkrud wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:Komives and Bellamy for Debuschure??????

We paid too much!!!!!

Or did we?

you are just cranky cause I called out Donnie and not Melo. you aren't objective at all. you have never called out Donnie for signing Amare but gave Isaiah a lot of grief for Marbury. towel bury right? yah, that didn't get old. but when I blame Donnie for Amare, that's old news and all you have is wise cracks. nothing to add but garbage jokes. Amare still plays for nyc. I mean, didn't play but still gets paid cause of Donnie.

Amare was signed just to get other big tickets to come to NY. He was the only thing available. And he played great for us before his body give up.

being great for 1season alone...(not trying to go at you), I hated the Amare move and the fact that he got injured during his very 1st playoff game for New York and hasn't come close to playing a full season since is further proof that Walsh did us a injustice in signing Amare. Yeah, his greatness during his 1st season attracted Melo but, who's to say Melo wouldn't have wanted New York regardless. The truth is we don't know.

DurzoBlint wrote:

arkrud wrote:

Silverfuel wrote:

Nalod wrote:Komives and Bellamy for Debuschure??????

We paid too much!!!!!

Or did we?

you are just cranky cause I called out Donnie and not Melo. you aren't objective at all. you have never called out Donnie for signing Amare but gave Isaiah a lot of grief for Marbury. towel bury right? yah, that didn't get old. but when I blame Donnie for Amare, that's old news and all you have is wise cracks. nothing to add but garbage jokes. Amare still plays for nyc. I mean, didn't play but still gets paid cause of Donnie.

Amare was signed just to get other big tickets to come to NY. He was the only thing available. And he played great for us before his body give up.

being great for 1season alone...(not trying to go at you), I hated the Amare move and the fact that he got injured during his very 1st playoff game for New York and hasn't come close to playing a full season since is further proof that Walsh did us a injustice in signing Amare. Yeah, his greatness during his 1st season attracted Melo but, who's to say Melo wouldn't have wanted New York regardless. The truth is we don't know.

Not sure Melo was exclusively about the knicks as much as NY, don't forget Nets had an offer on the table and in the absence of the Knicks bidding on him, he would have been a Net. In my mind, Dolan wanted Melo in part out of fear Nets get a big star to bring to Brooklyn. Im not saying Melo was a mistake or stroke of genius, just saying how it went down.

DurzoBlint wrote:

smackeddog wrote:I agree- I think since IT and Laden were so awful and traumatic, everyone including myself, were just so relieved IT was gone, that everything Walsh did seemed like magic in comparison!

Looking back, he made a lot of mistakes and I'm glad he's gone. Top of the list were his drafting of Jordan Hill (everyone new it was a bad pick at the time), and the trade with Houston to clear cap space we didn't really end up needing. David Lee trade turned out to be awful as well.

Plus, never forget the disaster he almost inflicted on us: his plan was to sign Amar'e AND Joe Johnson- that would have taken us right back to square one of being lumped with TWO unmovable contracts for years! We only got spared that because the Hawks offered him an even more ridiculous contract!

yeah, we would have showed love to anyone who gave us a shred of hope, even if it was false hope. Guys are still shook over IT. I will forever remember Walsh as the guy that handcuffed us with the one season wonder called Amare. Had a GREAT 1st season and a great 1st playoff game against Boston. Everything else regarding Amare has been a disappointment. Also felt that Lee was comparable on offense and no worse on defense. Dumb move.

I will also always remember the fact that Steph, dumb as he is was still the best option at point guard and he let D'Antoni refuse to play this dude because he feelings were still hurt over their time in Phoenix together.

Marbury was a disaster and MDA hated the guy. Marbury had problems with all his coach's. MDA had the leverage with Marbury and since he was at his contracts end with a long history of destruction it was the right move.

David Lee was not a star and thus why he was moved. A double-double machine but he was not Amare!

Think about one thing, is it part of Walsh's history to forgo a blue collar type worker like DLee and instead starphuch? Its not a "walsh" signature move.

Do the knicks really have championship aspirations over profits? The GM does not make that call.

I think sports fans would be very surprised if the looked at their teams as revenue generators with financial obligations/goals.

ITs like a broadway show, product might be crap but if they fill the seats then its a successful production.

gunsnewing wrote:Who gives Amare $100mil uninsured dollars? Only the Knicks. Both are to blame. Mostly Walsh because we already know Dolan is an idiot but he's not GM

Really? We clearly have an owner who publicly disregarded his GM in the Melo deal. What GM makes 100mm decisions?

Not sure your stance but some around here lauded Grunny as exec of the year for the Billups amnesty and signing Tyson. Now its a "mistake" in hindsight!!

How many teams can eat a 14mm contract and sign another? Tyson's first year basically cost 28mm!!!! We could have bought Billups out I think for 4mm a few months earlier. The 4mm would have been on our cap and we would not have had the room for Tyson.

Its great that Dolan has the money for stuff like that but it also a reaccuring theme with Knicks to make short term decisions.