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GAME THREAD: KNICKS @THUNDER 1PM ABC
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Bonn1997
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4/7/2013  10:05 AM
yellowboy90 wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:For real what is the beef with Felton these days. I just watched the Bucks game and he didn't play that bad. I am curious though the match ups for this game though. Who guards KD? I don't like Shump on KD. It would be nice if Martin could play.

Felton's opponent has a 19.5 PER, which basically makes him one of the worst defenders in the game.

I'm surprised you're using PER since it's not considered a good statistic by many in the advanced stats community. According NBA.com's stats database Felton's overall defensive rating is 104.5 pts/100 possessions and is rating for each of the last two months was 103.8


I'll take a look at what you're citing. I haven't read nearly as much about the defensive as the offensive sabermetrics. The major criticism of PER - that a player can increase his PER by taking a high volume low % shots - wouldn't really apply to the defensive end though. You're not going to consistently be guarding high volume scorers. If they tracked opponents' WS or WP, I would use that instead.

Have you looked at this Bonn?
http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1861192


Didn't see that paper. Just from a quick glance, it appears they're not attempting to use the formula to predict wins, though. I'd give more weight to a formula that's been shown to do that well. I will read the paper more closely though.
AUTOADVERT
VCoug
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4/7/2013  10:07 AM
Bonn1997 wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:For real what is the beef with Felton these days. I just watched the Bucks game and he didn't play that bad. I am curious though the match ups for this game though. Who guards KD? I don't like Shump on KD. It would be nice if Martin could play.

Felton's opponent has a 19.5 PER, which basically makes him one of the worst defenders in the game.

I'm surprised you're using PER since it's not considered a good statistic by many in the advanced stats community. According NBA.com's stats database Felton's overall defensive rating is 104.5 pts/100 possessions and is rating for each of the last two months was 103.8


I'll take a look at what you're citing. I haven't read nearly as much about the defensive as the offensive sabermetrics. The major criticism of PER - that a player can increase his PER by taking a high volume low % shots - wouldn't really apply to the defensive end though. You're not going to consistently be guarding high volume scorers. If they tracked opponents' WS or WP, I would use that instead.

I think that would matter even more on the defensive side. If you were a player and you knew you were being guarded by a crappy defensive player wouldn't most try to take as many shots as they could?

Now the joy of my world is in Zion How beautiful if nothing more Than to wait at Zion's door I've never been in love like this before Now let me pray to keep you from The perils that will surely come
misterearl
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4/7/2013  10:26 AM    LAST EDITED: 4/7/2013  10:26 AM
RonRon wrote:
go back to your SAY NO TO MARTIN and APPRECIATE SHEED's threads

ronron, get it right. The threads were "I Feel The Need For Sheed" and "No To Kenyon Martin"

We still feel the need for Sheed.

The Answer Man also recanted his "No to Kenyon Martin" with the "Could It Be The Answer Man Was Wrong About This?" thread with 973 views. Were you not among them?

once a knick always a knick
smackeddog
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4/7/2013  10:35 AM
yellowboy90 wrote:For real what is the beef with Felton these days. I just watched the Bucks game and he didn't play that bad. I am curious though the match ups for this game though. Who guards KD? I don't like Shump on KD. It would be nice if Martin could play.

gunsnewing doesn't like Felton or for some reason Tyson- watch him constantly bash Tyson throughout the game (you know you can't resist doing it, gunsnewing!). Bonn1997 doesn't like Feltons stats. I like Felton, and while his stats aren't great he's made a lot of important shots when we needed them during this win streak.

Bonn1997
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4/7/2013  10:41 AM
VCoug wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
VCoug wrote:
Bonn1997 wrote:
yellowboy90 wrote:For real what is the beef with Felton these days. I just watched the Bucks game and he didn't play that bad. I am curious though the match ups for this game though. Who guards KD? I don't like Shump on KD. It would be nice if Martin could play.

Felton's opponent has a 19.5 PER, which basically makes him one of the worst defenders in the game.

I'm surprised you're using PER since it's not considered a good statistic by many in the advanced stats community. According NBA.com's stats database Felton's overall defensive rating is 104.5 pts/100 possessions and is rating for each of the last two months was 103.8


I'll take a look at what you're citing. I haven't read nearly as much about the defensive as the offensive sabermetrics. The major criticism of PER - that a player can increase his PER by taking a high volume low % shots - wouldn't really apply to the defensive end though. You're not going to consistently be guarding high volume scorers. If they tracked opponents' WS or WP, I would use that instead.

I think that would matter even more on the defensive side. If you were a player and you knew you were being guarded by a crappy defensive player wouldn't most try to take as many shots as they could?


I'm not aware of evidence that there's much variability in shot attempts as a function of who your defender is.
smackeddog
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4/7/2013  10:41 AM
Likely no Camby or K-Mart. Not sure we have anyone to contain Durant without K-Mart (or Sheed). Plus he'll be fired up over Melo scoring so much lately. Should have a killer game. Hope Brewer doesn't return from the dead to be Scrub of the game.

Seems strange we only lost by 1 point in our last meeting vs the Thunder and that was without Melo. Reading the boards back then you'd of thought we got blown out at full strength.

I'd feel a bit more confident about this game if K-Mart were playing, as it is it's going to be tough- but a win would be a great statement to make. Just don't let Westbrook embarrass and annoy us like he did last season in OKC.

CrushAlot
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4/7/2013  10:47 AM
yellowboy90 wrote:Hoopsworld has him with a 2yr deal with the second one non guaranteed. Even the espn trade machine has him with 2yrs
Great move again by Grunwald.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
CrushAlot
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4/7/2013  10:54 AM
smackeddog wrote:Likely no Camby or K-Mart. Not sure we have anyone to contain Durant without K-Mart (or Sheed). Plus he'll be fired up over Melo scoring so much lately. Should have a killer game. Hope Brewer doesn't return from the dead to be Scrub of the game.

Seems strange we only lost by 1 point in our last meeting vs the Thunder and that was without Melo. Reading the boards back then you'd of thought we got blown out at full strength.

I'd feel a bit more confident about this game if K-Mart were playing, as it is it's going to be tough- but a win would be a great statement to make. Just don't let Westbrook embarrass and annoy us like he did last season in OKC.

I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
smackeddog
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4/7/2013  11:00 AM
When was the last time you were this angry?:

Usually only my sister can make me so angry I cry!

smackeddog
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4/7/2013  11:07 AM
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

GustavBahler
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4/7/2013  11:17 AM
smackeddog wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

Looking at some of those high flying blocks of his lately, it looks like Kmart has been pushing himself too hard. Glad he's being rested as well. The team has a different look when either Tyson and Kmart are in the paint. We've seen that we can win with both looks. Woodson having the luxury of changing things, throwing different looks at the D up will be a big plus in the playoffs.

TeamBall
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4/7/2013  11:20 AM
GustavBahler wrote:
smackeddog wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

Looking at some of those high flying blocks of his lately, it looks like Kmart has been pushing himself too hard. Glad he's being rested as well. The team has a different look when either Tyson and Kmart are in the paint. We've seen that we can win with both looks. Woodson having the luxury of changing things, throwing different looks at the D up will be a big plus in the playoffs.


Hasnt K mart already had some knee soreness before also? Imagine if we got Kmart immediately after Sheed went down. I wonder if he'd even be playing now.
Knicksfan: Hypocrite league that fines players after the game for flopping but in the game and with obvious flopping they call the fouls.
GustavBahler
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4/7/2013  12:09 PM
TeamBall wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
smackeddog wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

Looking at some of those high flying blocks of his lately, it looks like Kmart has been pushing himself too hard. Glad he's being rested as well. The team has a different look when either Tyson and Kmart are in the paint. We've seen that we can win with both looks. Woodson having the luxury of changing things, throwing different looks at the D up will be a big plus in the playoffs.


Hasnt K mart already had some knee soreness before also? Imagine if we got Kmart immediately after Sheed went down. I wonder if he'd even be playing now.

Good question.

ramtour420
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4/7/2013  12:23 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
TeamBall wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
smackeddog wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

Looking at some of those high flying blocks of his lately, it looks like Kmart has been pushing himself too hard. Glad he's being rested as well. The team has a different look when either Tyson and Kmart are in the paint. We've seen that we can win with both looks. Woodson having the luxury of changing things, throwing different looks at the D up will be a big plus in the playoffs.


Hasnt K mart already had some knee soreness before also? Imagine if we got Kmart immediately after Sheed went down. I wonder if he'd even be playing now.

Good question.


He us not playing now. Therefore, the answer would be no
Everything you have ever wanted is on the other side of fear- George Adair
GustavBahler
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4/7/2013  12:34 PM    LAST EDITED: 4/7/2013  12:34 PM
ramtour420 wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TeamBall wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
smackeddog wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

Looking at some of those high flying blocks of his lately, it looks like Kmart has been pushing himself too hard. Glad he's being rested as well. The team has a different look when either Tyson and Kmart are in the paint. We've seen that we can win with both looks. Woodson having the luxury of changing things, throwing different looks at the D up will be a big plus in the playoffs.


Hasnt K mart already had some knee soreness before also? Imagine if we got Kmart immediately after Sheed went down. I wonder if he'd even be playing now.

Good question.


He us not playing now. Therefore, the answer would be no

I think TeamBall was asking if Kmart would already be done for the season if he had started playing back then?

IronWillGiroud
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4/7/2013  12:42 PM
We win tonight, It's a win for everyone in the world, imo, the night kind melo finally triumphs
The Will, check out the Official Home of Will's GameDay Art: http://tinyurl.com/thewillgameday
TeamBall
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4/7/2013  12:43 PM
GustavBahler wrote:
ramtour420 wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
TeamBall wrote:
GustavBahler wrote:
smackeddog wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:
I am a little worried about KMart. I think resting him is the right thing to do. He has been amazing but that doesn't discount the fact that he had microfracture surgery on both knees. I have been wondering if the Knicks should clinch the Atlantic and consider resting guys knowing that they at least have the third seed. Not sure if that is the right move or if home court in the second round is more important.

Agree, K-Mart has always been injury prone. It was great to see him dominate with us after signing, but I think people got a bit overly excited when there was all that talk of him being the starter. At this point in his career I'd keep him as a 20min per game player- doubt he holds up for too long with starter minutes (something worth thinking about if we're going to try and sign him next season- I really don't think he'd hold up playing a whole season).

Looking at some of those high flying blocks of his lately, it looks like Kmart has been pushing himself too hard. Glad he's being rested as well. The team has a different look when either Tyson and Kmart are in the paint. We've seen that we can win with both looks. Woodson having the luxury of changing things, throwing different looks at the D up will be a big plus in the playoffs.


Hasnt K mart already had some knee soreness before also? Imagine if we got Kmart immediately after Sheed went down. I wonder if he'd even be playing now.

Good question.


He us not playing now. Therefore, the answer would be no

I think TeamBall was asking if Kmart would already be done for the season if he had started playing back then?


Yeah
Knicksfan: Hypocrite league that fines players after the game for flopping but in the game and with obvious flopping they call the fouls.
CrushAlot
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4/7/2013  12:45 PM
Kenyon said he's hardly worried & Dr. Lisa Callahan expected this. "It's just sore from not doing a whole lot and

being thrown in the fire right away,'' Martin said today in the visitor's locker room. "It's normal. Doctors said she was expecting that. It's better now than a few days ago. It's just from not playing and the way I play and a lot of minutes. I told her what I was feeling and she expected it.''


From Berman's Twitter/Suila
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
CrushAlot
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4/7/2013  12:46 PM
misterearl wrote:
RonRon wrote:
go back to your SAY NO TO MARTIN and APPRECIATE SHEED's threads

ronron, get it right. The threads were "I Feel The Need For Sheed" and "No To Kenyon Martin"

We still feel the need for Sheed.

The Answer Man also recanted his "No to Kenyon Martin" with the "Could It Be The Answer Man Was Wrong About This?" thread with 973 views. Were you not among them?

Exciting news.
Marc Berman‏@NYPost_Berman29m
Rasheed did workout oncourt this morning. Woodson would like to get him shooting on court this week. Woodson hoping for Rasheed in playoffs.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
gunsnewing
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4/7/2013  12:49 PM
Berman "reported" that Rasheed was shooting around 3months ago
GAME THREAD: KNICKS @THUNDER 1PM ABC

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