3G4G wrote:

holfresh wrote:

3G4G wrote:

holfresh wrote:NYKMent...Some how you think reasoning and the presentation of facts will change the minds of those who feel we were better off with Gallo and MDA...Its not happening...Move on...They thought Kidd was the MVP when we were winning and Melo is the reason why we are losing...Enjoy what the Knicks have to offer for the rest of the year...Lets hope Amare and Shrump steps up in some manner to make us competitive going into the playoffs..

Kidd's play has fallen way off as so his overall health and ability to play at a high level....every since we've looked like garbage regardless of how Anthony plays.

Kidd's play was important to the early success which included knocking down those open shots that Fields missed for three years...But there were more to the dynamic that has gone missing...Brewer's overall game was key which fell off the map and Sheed was key off the bench defensively and passing which helped our overall look..Felton's penetration was key but now dudes are missing those shot or not taking them like KIdd in the last game...We also just played much better defense but just stopped...We don't need Melo going back to hero ball of last year to get us to the playoffs...Hopefully Amare and Shrump could step in add something going into the post season...

Regardless Melo said deepest team he's been on which means if 1 soldier goes down or is incapable the other soldier should be there to step up.

The things you touched on speaks as to what was going on early in the season but most fans wanted to attribute all glory to Melo. It was truly an all-around TEAM performance.

I haven't blamed Melo too much as to why we're stinking now... I probably was on his case more when we were winning. I didn't like/never have liked his style of play nor the system we run to try and win games. Never thought it was sustainable and thus far it's proving more and more to be true.

I believe I've had Melo somewhere around 4-6th in MVP race all year.... I bet that's where he finishes

Let's not kid ourselves..Melo was the straw that stirred the drink...Melo was the major reason we were winning...But Kidd was making the extra pass which became infectious...I disagree with most who said the Knicks relied on the three point shot to win..I thought they were simply taking the open shot after good ball movement...Those shots aren't falling now and the ball isn't moving...People want to blame Melo, but honestly who cares, watch the games and see whats going on...I really don't care about MVP races either...It's all about how the team is playing at the end of the season...Crazy thing is, I have seen teams flounder like the Knicks are now and figure things out in the first round...I really don't want to get to the playoffs playing like this...

One thing tho..I don't get the 24/7/365 focus on Melo...MVP race or not, he is having a great year...People here expect him and him alone to take down Bron, Wade and Bosh...And if he doesn't, it's I told you so...I think it's comedy...

MSG3 wrote:"Not to go back and revisit the trade, but let's go back and revisit the trade in very specific detail".

You're giving us optimistic pro Melo fans a bad rep NYKM. The trade was 2 years ago. Time to focus on how to make this current team better.

Continuing to say, "oh you guys are fools for complaining because we're first in the division" is insulting to the ones that understand it doesn't matter how well we started right now. This team has looked like an 8th seed for 30 games. Come on man. Chill out. I don't remember a poster ever who galvanized the glass half full and glass half empty crowd like you do. Bring some meaningful discussion. A lot of the stuff you say is just as bad as the guys who look for any excuse to bring up Lin, Melo not being a superstar, etc.

This thread was based off this remark below.

JamesKPolk wrote: And he put together a young, talented team with cap room before the Anthony trade.

So, I decided to discuss his post with actual basketball talk. And guess what? Some of these negative Knick critics and/or fans who can't let the trade go couldn't deal with it. Now could they?

Believe it or not my dude, but this thread wasn't to discuss the actual trade. But instead, to discuss players on our Knicks team pre-trade. Why? Because that's all I ever see around here. Ex Knicks (talk). How "talented" that team was etc, etc. Well, lets talk about it.

These posters can talk about Gallo, Lin and David Lee like no tomorrow, but then it's a sin to talk about ex Knicks such as Anthony Randolph, Timofey Mozgov, Roger Mason Jr, Bill Walker, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf, Andy Rautins and Eddy Curry from the pre-trade team? Why, because it doesn't fit their agenda?

I'm not trying to talk about us getting Tyson Chandler in replace of Mozgov. Or Melo replacing Gallo. I'm trying to talk about the likes of Anthony Randolph, Timofey Mozgov, Roger Mason Jr, Bill Walker, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf, Andy Rautins and Eddy Curry. You know, just like these guys talk about Gallo, Lin and David Lee 24/7. Ex Knicks.

So once again, what have guys such as Anthony Randolph, Timofey Mozgov, Roger Mason Jr, Bill Walker, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf, Andy Rautins and Eddy Curry done since the trade? Or better yet, what are they currently doing here in 2012-2013?

NYKMentality wrote:

MSG3 wrote:"Not to go back and revisit the trade, but let's go back and revisit the trade in very specific detail".

You're giving us optimistic pro Melo fans a bad rep NYKM. The trade was 2 years ago. Time to focus on how to make this current team better.

Continuing to say, "oh you guys are fools for complaining because we're first in the division" is insulting to the ones that understand it doesn't matter how well we started right now. This team has looked like an 8th seed for 30 games. Come on man. Chill out. I don't remember a poster ever who galvanized the glass half full and glass half empty crowd like you do. Bring some meaningful discussion. A lot of the stuff you say is just as bad as the guys who look for any excuse to bring up Lin, Melo not being a superstar, etc.

This thread was based off this remark below.

JamesKPolk wrote: And he put together a young, talented team with cap room before the Anthony trade.

So, I decided to discuss his post with actual basketball talk. And guess what? Some of these negative Knick critics and/or fans who can't let the trade go couldn't deal with it. Now could they?

Believe it or not my dude, but this thread wasn't to discuss the actual trade. But instead, to discuss players on our Knicks team pre-trade. Why? Because that's all I ever see around here. Ex Knicks (talk). How "talented" that team was etc, etc. Well, lets talk about it.

These posters can talk about Gallo, Lin and David Lee like no tomorrow, but then it's a sin to talk about ex Knicks such as Anthony Randolph, Timofey Mozgov, Roger Mason Jr, Bill Walker, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf, Andy Rautins and Eddy Curry from the pre-trade team? Why, because it doesn't fit their agenda?

I'm not trying to talk about us getting Tyson Chandler in replace of Mozgov. Or Melo replacing Gallo. I'm trying to talk about the likes of Anthony Randolph, Timofey Mozgov, Roger Mason Jr, Bill Walker, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf, Andy Rautins and Eddy Curry. You know, just like these guys talk about Gallo, Lin and David Lee 24/7.

So once again, what have guys such as Anthony Randolph, Timofey Mozgov, Roger Mason Jr, Bill Walker, Shawne Williams, Toney Douglas, Ronny Turiaf, Andy Rautins and Eddy Curry done since the trade? Or better yet, what are they currently doing here in 2012-2013?

Who cares what they're doing?!

Let me ask you something. How do we solve our horrible perimeter D and how can we get back to the pick and roll with Chandler and Melo getting easy buckets? These are the things all fans should be concerned with.

I swear twitter and message boards make it harder to be a fan.

tkf wrote:wow... at this thread...

LOL! My favorite part is where he says he'll just "agree to disagree" and then vents for 10 sentences.

NYKMentality wrote:

JamesKPolk wrote:All I did was deservedly praise Donnie Walsh. I'm sorry you can't handle that praise and instead choose to lavish praise on Glen Grunwald instead. I'm 99% sure you were an Isiah supporter so any arguments you try to make are nullified by the fact that you thought Isiah was doing a good job at one point.

Actually, you're wrong as wrong could be Mr.Know it all.

I'm from the days of Mark Jackson/Greg Anthony/Hubert Davis/Doc Rivers/Derek Harper, John Starks, Charles Smith, Charles Oakley, Patrick Ewing, Anthony Mason and Herb Williams. Those were some of my all-time favorite Knicks and/or Knick teams.

Although I never considered these guys true contenders as my Knicks throughout the early/mid 1990's, I also enjoyed the era of Charlie Ward/Chris Childs, Allan Houston, Latrell Sprewell, Larry Johnson, an aging Patrick Ewing/Herb Williams, Marcus Camby, Kurt Thomas and who could forget Chris Dudley?

And that was that. And then the Isiah Thomas era began shortly after. I'm a die hard Knicks fan who dreaded those I.Thomas years, which is why I've enjoyed our 2012-2013 season. A chance to win our Atlantic Division for the first time dating back to 1993-1994. 19 years and counting. Only 1.0 back of the two seed Pacers.

Don't you dare accuse me of being a fan of Thomas. Would you like for me to call you out as an Eddy Curry supporter? I bet not.

Yeah, it's easy to deny it now but I'm positive your homerific self supported all of Isiah's moves until it was too late and then "realized" he was bad. Just like you will eventually realize Glen Grunwald sucks and Mike Woodson sucks.

I've argued so many times and been insulted more times than I can count and 95% of the time I have been proven right. You're arguing with the wrong person. When I watch basketball I don't want wins and losses. I look at the ins and outs of the game on a game by game basis. I am a student of the game. I know how a team should play and how it should be coached. The Knicks the last 2 months look like Mike D'Antoni's Knicks teams. They are 18-19 in their last 37 games. But that's just a win/loss stat. They have been playing terrible basketball in all of those games, even the wins. This team has regressed and for you to still be here trying to pretend everything is hunky dory is an insult to me and a joke in general.

I don't care how long you've been a fan. I know more basketball than you. That may be a douchey comment but it's true.

NYKMentality wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:We could and should have been building up the assets to trade for James Harden.

Yea, because I'm sure everyone knew Harden was on the verge of hitting the trade block. lol.

Harden is no superstar either. You'll see while him and Lin fail to lead Houston into the postseason here in 2012-2013.

C: Tyson Chandler.
PF: David Lee.
SF: Carmelo Anthony.
2G: James Harden.
PG: Jeremy Lin.

What could have been. lol (so being sarcastic here).

The Knicks problem is not Melo trade, or Stat trade, or letting Lin walk, or signing 4 old man and dumping all young talent possible, or throwing away as much picks as possible, or getting one of the most limited coaches in NBA. The Knicks problem is that there is no desire and no need to win anything, or became a respectable team, or play the beautiful game of basketball.
Knicks are managed to be a sport reality show, produce drama, controversy, and please one man - Mr. Dolan. And it works perfectly for what is it designed for.

Bonn1997 wrote:

NYKMentality wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:We could and should have been building up the assets to trade for James Harden.

Yea, because I'm sure everyone knew Harden was on the verge of hitting the trade block. lol.

Harden is no superstar either. You'll see while him and Lin fail to lead Houston into the postseason here in 2012-2013.

C: Tyson Chandler.
PF: David Lee.
SF: Carmelo Anthony.
2G: James Harden.
PG: Jeremy Lin.

What could have been. lol (so being sarcastic here).

Well we should have been building trade assets for a real franchise player. I'd been targeting Harden for years but he's only one example.

You had Harden targetted before he was draft? You're pretty good.

Over the past two seasons with Minny/Denver Anthony Randolph has only managed to average 12.0 minutes, 5.5 points, 2.9 rebounds, 0.8 blocks, 0.4 assists, 0.3 steals, 1.07 turnovers and 1.4 personal fouls per game. He's played 56 games when compared to 67 games missed with 0.00 minutes played.

For a 6'11/220+ NBA player. He's put up awful production. More like laughing stock basketball. But yet, this is (one of) the same career nothings in which (certain) critics of the trade were full blown distraught about "losing".

But now that you critics are currently wrong as wrong could possible be in regards to the great AR, you no longer wish to talk about AR, now do you? What's there to talk about? He's only averaged 12.0 minutes, 5.5 points, 2.9 rebounds, 0.8 blocks, 0.4 assists, 0.3 steals, 1.07 turnovers and 1.4 personal fouls per game over the past two years. 56 games played when compared to 67 games missed of 0.00 minutes.

So now that we've discussed A-R the fan favorite, can we also speak upon the likes of...

Timofey Mozgov.
Roger Mason Jr.
Bill Walker.
Shawne Williams.
Toney Douglas.
Ronny Turiaf.
Andy Rautins.
Eddy Curry.

Which one to nitpick and/or laugh at next? Lets be honest here, that pre-trade team was "talented" right?