gunsnewing wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Solace wrote:

crzymdups wrote:If you did the same BS math on Amar'e's contract you could blame the entire $58.3 luxury tax bill on him. The Knicks would pay no tax at all if Amar'e were traded.

Well, the math is valid, because we already have 3 point guards without Lin. So, there's no replacement cost for no having Lin. It's not about who to blame, it's what's the difference in cost for adding Lin. Sucks, but there it is. At this point, no matter whether we match or not, I cannot see all of Tyson, Amar'e, Melo and Lin making it to that third season with the Knicks; it's too much salary to carry with the luxury tax penalties as is. It sucks. I hate the new CBA.

The Prigioni signing isn't official. Which is giving me some hope.

Also, I haven't seen a report on the Felton trade TRULY being official. Which is also giving me some hope.

Something is going on. A smokescreen, stealing headlines from brooklyn we will know one way or the other in 30 something hours

no-one is forcing anyone to exploit loopholes in the CBA, to assume Lin and his agent are completely innocent and dealing in good faith would be bad judgement.

CashMoney wrote:I would really like to know what the cap penalty could be without Lin's contract.

Great point

gunsnewing wrote:Lin is doing what is best for his interest. How many athletes have gone after the best deal they can get. Just look at Melo who forced the knicks to gut the team so that he can force his way to new york and get a max deal with 5yrs $100mil

and he pushed hard to get that deal before the uncertanty of the upcoming negotiations for a new CBA, and was vocal about it being the motivating factor in his decision to push for a trade prior to the deadline.

Solace wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:If you did the same BS math on Amar'e's contract you could blame the entire $58.3 luxury tax bill on him. The Knicks would pay no tax at all if Amar'e were traded.

Amare was signed before the new CBA...you can't 'un-sign' him. We can however now knowing what the full ramifications are under the new CBA choose to not sign Lin. If everyone wants to assume that it's personal because the media has portrayed it that way, no-one can stop any of you from starting 20 more threads to vent about it

The media is portraying it as a tax issue. And wrongly.

The Knicks have spent $45M this off-season on Felton, Novak, Camby, Kidd.

Lin is better than all those players and far more important to the team's success and they won't spend $25M on him?

This is absurd.

The only signing that is happening after the Lin poison pill is Felton/Thomas. The other additions were made to a team that was going to match Lin as per the previous leaked offer sheet

And guess what??!?! THE LUXURY TAX WOULD HAVE STILL BEEN AN ISSUE. Lin is only making $6M more in the third year of the deal.

That's the backbreaking difference for the NY Knicks. $6M.

They threw in $3M in trades to acquire Felton and Camby, btw.

If my math is right, based on the ratios in that article, that extra $6 million will cost the Knicks an extra about $26 million after luxury tax penalities.

"The Knicks are allowed to surpass the soft cap, but it'll cost them. Considering 2014 will be the Knicks' third straight year over the cap, they'll come in for the highest tax rate allowed in the new CBA. Take a look at the "repeat offender" taxes:

The first $5M of Lin's deal, as long as it's all over the cap, would cost the Knicks at a 2.5-to-1 ratio. So that's $5M for Lin, $12.5M in luxury tax, $17.5M all told.
The next $5M would be taxed at 2.75-to-1. So, $18.75M in total.
The final $4.8M, at a 3.5-to-1 tax, would cost $21.6M by itself.
All told, that's $57.85 million for one year of Jeremy Lin—$43 million of that in pure luxury tax payments. (This is exactly how the salary cap and luxury tax are supposed to work. Want to lock up three players to max deals? Don't expect any flexibility in signing the rest of a team.)" http://deadspin.com/5926337/jeremy-lins-contract-would-cost-the-knicks-58-million-in-year-three

honestly, i have no idea who's math is correct or flawed.

mrKnickShot wrote:

Solace wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:If you did the same BS math on Amar'e's contract you could blame the entire $58.3 luxury tax bill on him. The Knicks would pay no tax at all if Amar'e were traded.

Amare was signed before the new CBA...you can't 'un-sign' him. We can however now knowing what the full ramifications are under the new CBA choose to not sign Lin. If everyone wants to assume that it's personal because the media has portrayed it that way, no-one can stop any of you from starting 20 more threads to vent about it

The media is portraying it as a tax issue. And wrongly.

The Knicks have spent $45M this off-season on Felton, Novak, Camby, Kidd.

Lin is better than all those players and far more important to the team's success and they won't spend $25M on him?

This is absurd.

The only signing that is happening after the Lin poison pill is Felton/Thomas. The other additions were made to a team that was going to match Lin as per the previous leaked offer sheet

And guess what??!?! THE LUXURY TAX WOULD HAVE STILL BEEN AN ISSUE. Lin is only making $6M more in the third year of the deal.

That's the backbreaking difference for the NY Knicks. $6M.

They threw in $3M in trades to acquire Felton and Camby, btw.

If my math is right, based on the ratios in that article, that extra $6 million will cost the Knicks an extra about $26 million after luxury tax penalities.

So thats 26 plus the 15 he gets paid. Thats still alot for him no?

mrKnickShot wrote:

Solace wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:If you did the same BS math on Amar'e's contract you could blame the entire $58.3 luxury tax bill on him. The Knicks would pay no tax at all if Amar'e were traded.

Amare was signed before the new CBA...you can't 'un-sign' him. We can however now knowing what the full ramifications are under the new CBA choose to not sign Lin. If everyone wants to assume that it's personal because the media has portrayed it that way, no-one can stop any of you from starting 20 more threads to vent about it

The media is portraying it as a tax issue. And wrongly.

The Knicks have spent $45M this off-season on Felton, Novak, Camby, Kidd.

Lin is better than all those players and far more important to the team's success and they won't spend $25M on him?

This is absurd.

The only signing that is happening after the Lin poison pill is Felton/Thomas. The other additions were made to a team that was going to match Lin as per the previous leaked offer sheet

And guess what??!?! THE LUXURY TAX WOULD HAVE STILL BEEN AN ISSUE. Lin is only making $6M more in the third year of the deal.

That's the backbreaking difference for the NY Knicks. $6M.

They threw in $3M in trades to acquire Felton and Camby, btw.

If my math is right, based on the ratios in that article, that extra $6 million will cost the Knicks an extra about $26 million after luxury tax penalities.

So thats 26 plus the 15 he gets paid. Thats still alot for him no?

No, that's $26 Million for the last $6 million plus the $32 million it would've cost for the original $9 million. Approximately $58 Million total. You could debate paying that much for Michael Jordan. The only saving grace is that it's only one year. But it looks unlikely we match - although there are still some positives if we match. We'll have to see how this one goes.

gunsnewing wrote:

mrKnickShot wrote:

Solace wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

Rookie wrote:

crzymdups wrote:If you did the same BS math on Amar'e's contract you could blame the entire $58.3 luxury tax bill on him. The Knicks would pay no tax at all if Amar'e were traded.

Amare was signed before the new CBA...you can't 'un-sign' him. We can however now knowing what the full ramifications are under the new CBA choose to not sign Lin. If everyone wants to assume that it's personal because the media has portrayed it that way, no-one can stop any of you from starting 20 more threads to vent about it

The media is portraying it as a tax issue. And wrongly.

The Knicks have spent $45M this off-season on Felton, Novak, Camby, Kidd.

Lin is better than all those players and far more important to the team's success and they won't spend $25M on him?

This is absurd.

The only signing that is happening after the Lin poison pill is Felton/Thomas. The other additions were made to a team that was going to match Lin as per the previous leaked offer sheet

And guess what??!?! THE LUXURY TAX WOULD HAVE STILL BEEN AN ISSUE. Lin is only making $6M more in the third year of the deal.

That's the backbreaking difference for the NY Knicks. $6M.

They threw in $3M in trades to acquire Felton and Camby, btw.

If my math is right, based on the ratios in that article, that extra $6 million will cost the Knicks an extra about $26 million after luxury tax penalities.

So thats 26 plus the 15 he gets paid. Thats still alot for him no?

Larry Brown was paid $28mil after the 1st yr of a 4yr deal to go away. You think Dolan cares about an extra 26m for a player who will make him hundreds of millions. Clearly this is not about money but Dolans huge ego being bruised

Your cases, the knicks did not have much choice. LB had to go, Tyson, Melo and Amare are already signed.

SlimChin wrote:

Solace wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/knicks_balk_year_tax_bill_salary_8gqxzMNE1athYH35vyztZM?utm_medium=rss&utm_content=Knicks

Knicks soap opera continues with Lin contract talks, Kidd's DWI arrest
Knicks Blog
Berman on Twitter
By MARC BERMAN
Last Updated: 6:42 AM, July 16, 2012
Posted: 1:33 AM, July 16, 2012

Share on emailShare on facebookMore Sharing ServicesMore Print
LAS VEGAS — Is Jeremy Lin worth $58.3 million in 2014-15?
If the Knicks were to match the Rockets’ poison-pill offer sheet, under the new CBA’s vicious luxury-tax penalties, owner James Dolan could pay that amount for Lin just for the 2014-15 season.
That astronomical bill is why the Knicks sought a cheaper point-guard solution to pair with Jason Kidd. They were finalizing a sign-and-trade with Portland yesterday that would make Raymond Felton a Knick again in a three-year deal that is estimated at close to
$10 million with a player option for a fourth year.

JASON SZENES/NY POST
HARVARD ECONOMICS: Jeremy Lin launched himself from the Ivy League into the NBA spotlight with dazzling play at the Garden last season, but the price for the luxury-tax-paying Knicks to retain him — pushing $60 million in 2014-15 alone — could be too steep.

A source told The Post Saturday night that after the Felton deal, the Knicks will not match Lin’s back-loaded three-year, $25 million offer sheet from Houston.
Lin’s potential departure after lighting up the Garden in February and March plus the news of Kidd’s DWI arrest yesterday in the Hamptons kept the Knicks in a familiar role as the NBA’s biggest soap opera.
It was doubtful the arrest would have any impact on the decision whether to retain Lin.
At the Las Vegas summer league yesterday, Knicks coach Mike Woodson dodged the media and refused to discuss the latest developments.
“I can’t talk today,’’ Woodson said. “I can’t talk about it.”
OPINION: KIDD'S ARREST DISGRACEFUL
KIDD ARRESTED FOR DWI
Knicks general manager Glen Grunwald never showed up to the arena and was said to be back in the hotel crunching numbers. The Knicks have until 11:59 tomorrow night to match Lin’s offer sheet. They could not make a move on Lin until the Felton deal became official.
Just four days ago, Woodson gushed that the Knicks would “absolutely’’ match the Rockets’ offer sheet and said Lin would be the starter at point guard to open training camp.
But that was before Lin secretly flew to Las Vegas to change the offer sheet and turn a four-year, $28 million deal with $19 million guaranteed into a fully guaranteed three-year, $25 million contract — with the final year a balloon payment of $14.9 million that Carmelo Anthony called “ridiculous’’ yesterday.
How ridiculous? The Knicks are expected to be over the luxury-tax threshold for three straight years by 2014-15, and repeat taxpayers will be subject to the harshest of luxury-tax penalties.
If all of Lin’s $14.9 million salary comes in over the threshold, the first $5 million will be taxed at a 2.5-to-1 ratio. The next $5 million will be taxed at a 2.75-to-1 ratio. The final $4.9 million is taxed a 3.5-to-1 ratio.
The math shows the tax alone on Lin’s final year would be $43.4 million, meaning the entire bill that season could be $58.3 million.
Dolan actually might have matched the offer had it been done above board. But as reported by The Post, the Knicks were furious Lin renegotiated the contract after they had told him they would match it, knowing how deadly it would be financially to the organization’s coffers because of the tax.
Dolan is all about loyalty and the revamped offer sheet rubbed him the wrong way.
As long as Kidd isn’t thrown in jail, the Knicks are set at point guard this season with a three-headed monster of Felton — who desperately wanted to return to the Garden after working great with Amar’e Stoudemire in 2010-11 — Kidd and Spanish leaguer Pablo Prigioni.
marc.berman@nypost.com

If this math is accurate, yeah, Lin is gone.

Yeah and? Money has never been an issue with Dolan until now? Dolan writes checks—always has.

We've never had a payroll as high as this would bring us with the new luxury tax. You are talking about a Knicks team that might cost I dunno, $140 million for that third year, after luxury tax. Will Dolan really pay that? Your guess is as good as mine.

munco wrote:It is silly how people point to Lin as if he's the problem. Melo, Stat, Chandler all make more than Lin that third year, so they technically are more responsible than Lin for the cap penalties.

Shhh.... It's easier to blame Lin.

Solace wrote:

SlimChin wrote:

Solace wrote:http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/knicks/knicks_balk_year_tax_bill_salary_8gqxzMNE1athYH35vyztZM?utm_medium=rss&utm_content=Knicks

Knicks soap opera continues with Lin contract talks, Kidd's DWI arrest
Knicks Blog
Berman on Twitter
By MARC BERMAN
Last Updated: 6:42 AM, July 16, 2012
Posted: 1:33 AM, July 16, 2012

Share on emailShare on facebookMore Sharing ServicesMore Print
LAS VEGAS — Is Jeremy Lin worth $58.3 million in 2014-15?
If the Knicks were to match the Rockets’ poison-pill offer sheet, under the new CBA’s vicious luxury-tax penalties, owner James Dolan could pay that amount for Lin just for the 2014-15 season.
That astronomical bill is why the Knicks sought a cheaper point-guard solution to pair with Jason Kidd. They were finalizing a sign-and-trade with Portland yesterday that would make Raymond Felton a Knick again in a three-year deal that is estimated at close to
$10 million with a player option for a fourth year.

JASON SZENES/NY POST
HARVARD ECONOMICS: Jeremy Lin launched himself from the Ivy League into the NBA spotlight with dazzling play at the Garden last season, but the price for the luxury-tax-paying Knicks to retain him — pushing $60 million in 2014-15 alone — could be too steep.

A source told The Post Saturday night that after the Felton deal, the Knicks will not match Lin’s back-loaded three-year, $25 million offer sheet from Houston.
Lin’s potential departure after lighting up the Garden in February and March plus the news of Kidd’s DWI arrest yesterday in the Hamptons kept the Knicks in a familiar role as the NBA’s biggest soap opera.
It was doubtful the arrest would have any impact on the decision whether to retain Lin.
At the Las Vegas summer league yesterday, Knicks coach Mike Woodson dodged the media and refused to discuss the latest developments.
“I can’t talk today,’’ Woodson said. “I can’t talk about it.”
OPINION: KIDD'S ARREST DISGRACEFUL
KIDD ARRESTED FOR DWI
Knicks general manager Glen Grunwald never showed up to the arena and was said to be back in the hotel crunching numbers. The Knicks have until 11:59 tomorrow night to match Lin’s offer sheet. They could not make a move on Lin until the Felton deal became official.
Just four days ago, Woodson gushed that the Knicks would “absolutely’’ match the Rockets’ offer sheet and said Lin would be the starter at point guard to open training camp.
But that was before Lin secretly flew to Las Vegas to change the offer sheet and turn a four-year, $28 million deal with $19 million guaranteed into a fully guaranteed three-year, $25 million contract — with the final year a balloon payment of $14.9 million that Carmelo Anthony called “ridiculous’’ yesterday.
How ridiculous? The Knicks are expected to be over the luxury-tax threshold for three straight years by 2014-15, and repeat taxpayers will be subject to the harshest of luxury-tax penalties.
If all of Lin’s $14.9 million salary comes in over the threshold, the first $5 million will be taxed at a 2.5-to-1 ratio. The next $5 million will be taxed at a 2.75-to-1 ratio. The final $4.9 million is taxed a 3.5-to-1 ratio.
The math shows the tax alone on Lin’s final year would be $43.4 million, meaning the entire bill that season could be $58.3 million.
Dolan actually might have matched the offer had it been done above board. But as reported by The Post, the Knicks were furious Lin renegotiated the contract after they had told him they would match it, knowing how deadly it would be financially to the organization’s coffers because of the tax.
Dolan is all about loyalty and the revamped offer sheet rubbed him the wrong way.
As long as Kidd isn’t thrown in jail, the Knicks are set at point guard this season with a three-headed monster of Felton — who desperately wanted to return to the Garden after working great with Amar’e Stoudemire in 2010-11 — Kidd and Spanish leaguer Pablo Prigioni.
marc.berman@nypost.com

If this math is accurate, yeah, Lin is gone.

Yeah and? Money has never been an issue with Dolan until now? Dolan writes checks—always has.

We've never had a payroll as high as this would bring us with the new luxury tax. You are talking about a Knicks team that might cost I dunno, $140 million for that third year, after luxury tax. Will Dolan really pay that? Your guess is as good as mine.

figures like that can have a negetive projection on MSG's stock as well....so if the stock plummets due to negative profits, the costs keep compounding