CashMoney wrote:Melo is avergaing a career high 4.2 assists per game. I think he wants to get others involved but the team has a habit of stopping and watching him with the ball in his hands. Melo has taken some bad shots but he often gets the ball back with 6 seconds or left on the shot clock. He is not a point forward and is is doing his best to do the job the team has asked of him. When Baron comes back runs the offense this will be a non issue. MDA's systems needs a solid PG and we don't have one until Baron gets on the court. One thing I will say is that fair or not, Melo is going to get the blame as the franchise player...Welcome to NYC Melo.

Assist numbers can be misleading. Unfortunately it is difficult to express assist quality in numbers, but I reckon that his 4.2 assists would not be equal to, for example, Steve Nash's 4.2 assists.

This season is a strong opportunity for him to grow as a player.

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:He has all the time in the world to correct it, and his attitude during this critical time will determine if the guy goes down as a legend or as a Marbury.

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:

CashMoney wrote:Melo is avergaing a career high 4.2 assists per game. I think he wants to get others involved but the team has a habit of stopping and watching him with the ball in his hands. Melo has taken some bad shots but he often gets the ball back with 6 seconds or left on the shot clock. He is not a point forward and is is doing his best to do the job the team has asked of him. When Baron comes back runs the offense this will be a non issue. MDA's systems needs a solid PG and we don't have one until Baron gets on the court. One thing I will say is that fair or not, Melo is going to get the blame as the franchise player...Welcome to NYC Melo.

Assist numbers can be misleading. Unfortunately it is difficult to express assist quality in numbers, but I reckon that his 4.2 assists would not be equal to, for example, Steve Nash's 4.2 assists.

This season is a strong opportunity for him to grow as a player.

To me an assist is an assist = leads to points. 4 assists from the 3 spot is bigger than from the 1.

misterearl wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:He has all the time in the world to correct it, and his attitude during this critical time will determine if the guy goes down as a legend or as a Marbury.

This is a big season in many ways.

All the time in the world?

When the entire lower bowl of Madison Square Garden is begging Carmelo to "pass the freakin' ball" it is s sure sign that his selfish habits are on front street. Carmelo has about three weeks to get it together and start playing with his head up.

Here We Go.

It's true we feel like it's the crunch time, but the bigger picture is that Melo is here for the next five seasons after this and he is 27 years old. If he can show ill-nasty growth over the next two years, so that he is a significantly improved baller by age 29, then this is a job well done.

misterearl wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:

misterearl wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:He has all the time in the world to correct it, and his attitude during this critical time will determine if the guy goes down as a legend or as a Marbury.

This is a big season in many ways.

All the time in the world?

When the entire lower bowl of Madison Square Garden is begging Carmelo to "pass the freakin' ball" it is s sure sign that his selfish habits are on front street. Carmelo has about three weeks to get it together and start playing with his head up.

Here We Go.

It's true we feel like it's the crunch time, but the bigger picture is that Melo is here for the next five seasons after this and he is 27 years old. If he can show ill-nasty growth over the next two years, so that he is a significantly improved baller by age 29, then this is a job well done.

"Ill nasty growth"?

The role of a star player is to raise overall productivity. Not simply by his stats, but with his shining example of fundamental qualities that make every team great - "communication, trust, collective responsibility, caring and pride."

"Any one of these qualities, individually, is important. All of them together are unbeatable." - Coach K

It should NOT take two years for a star player to figure out what his team needs him to do. There are five assistant coaches, league standings and plenty of game clips on YouTube.

If Carmelo is unable to be an example - or make the players around him better, he has as much value to the Knicks as Bill Walker.

Should, should not. This is why I was not a fan of the trade.

But the guy is here, and, really, two years of ILL-NASTY GROWTH in his BASKET GAME would be satisfactory, so that the seasons following this growth will give us many good feelings.

misterearl wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:

misterearl wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:

misterearl wrote:

MarburyAnd1Crossover wrote:He has all the time in the world to correct it, and his attitude during this critical time will determine if the guy goes down as a legend or as a Marbury.

This is a big season in many ways.

All the time in the world?

When the entire lower bowl of Madison Square Garden is begging Carmelo to "pass the freakin' ball" it is s sure sign that his selfish habits are on front street. Carmelo has about three weeks to get it together and start playing with his head up.

Here We Go.

It's true we feel like it's the crunch time, but the bigger picture is that Melo is here for the next five seasons after this and he is 27 years old. If he can show ill-nasty growth over the next two years, so that he is a significantly improved baller by age 29, then this is a job well done.

"Ill nasty growth"?

The role of a star player is to raise overall productivity. Not simply by his stats, but with his shining example of fundamental qualities that make every team great - "communication, trust, collective responsibility, caring and pride."

"Any one of these qualities, individually, is important. All of them together are unbeatable." - Coach K

It should NOT take two years for a star player to figure out what his team needs him to do. There are five assistant coaches, league standings and plenty of game clips on YouTube.

If Carmelo is unable to be an example - or make the players around him better, he has as much value to the Knicks as Bill Walker.

Should, should not. This is why I was not a fan of the trade.

But the guy is here, and, really, two years of ILL-NASTY GROWTH in his BASKET GAME would be satisfactory, so that the seasons following this growth will give us many good feelings.

2 years

MarbAnd1 - What is your definition of "Ill nasty growth" in measurable (individual or team) goals?

Ill-NASTY GROWTH is when we go on an 18-2 run and everyone but Melo dropped a bucket. It's when Melo is triple teamed and, instead of shooting, he drops the dime. This is one side of the coin. How this growth will manifest itself, we really can't predict.

But you will feel a good vibe, and you will have the good feelings in your heart.

You will notice many good things, consistently, over many months.

There is a huge difference between talent and playing basketball well.

Melo is an terrific basketball talent, but he's a terrible basketball player.

Some aspects of basketball are obvious, but offense is not.

The key to offense is NOT how many points you score or the degree of difficultly of the shots you are capable of making late in the shot clock.

The key to offense is knowing what your strengths are, staying with those, and not turning the ball over. It's about scoring efficiency, moving the ball when you don't have a great look, and not doing dumb things that lead to TOs.

Melo is terrible at all those things.

He's incapable of changing and becoming a good basketball player because he lacks the basic BBall intelligence to understand how to play the game properly and has an ego that's too big to allow him to listen to those that try to make him better (just ask George Karl).

Right now Gallo is already a better and more productive player than Melo even up. He may not be as talented and may not be able to do some of the things Melo can, but he's knows what he's good at (going to the basket to getting to FT line, open 3s, and scoring in transition) and sticks with it. That's why his TS% is a whopping 60+% and he doesn't turn the ball over much. Compare that to Melo's below average 52% and TO machine playing style.

ItalianStallion wrote:I would trade Melo for a unprotected second round pick and a trade exception. I'm serious. He's that bad. We could easily fill his 18m with solid role players and draft picks that on a net basis would make the team better.

There is a huge difference between talent and playing basketball well.

Melo is an terrific basketball talent, but he's a terrible basketball player.

Some aspects of basketball are obvious, but offense is not.

The key to offense is NOT how many points you score or the degree of difficultly of the shots you are capable of making late in the shot clock.

The key to offense is knowing what your strengths are, staying with those, and not turning the ball over. It's about scoring efficiency, moving the ball when you don't have a great look, and not doing dumb things that lead to TOs.

Melo is terrible at all those things.

He's incapable of changing and becoming a good basketball player because he lacks the basic BBall intelligence to understand how to play the game properly and has an ego that's too big to allow him to listen to those that try to make him better (just ask George Karl).

Right now Gallo is already a better and more productive player than Melo even up. He may not be as talented and may not be able to do some of the things Melo can, but he's knows what he's good at (going to the basket to getting to FT line, open 3s, and scoring in transition) and sticks with it. That's why his TS% is a whopping 60+% and he doesn't turn the ball over much. Compare that to Melo's below average 52% and TO machine playing style.

islesfan wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

ItalianStallion wrote:I would trade Melo for a unprotected second round pick and a trade exception. I'm serious. He's that bad. We could easily fill his 18m with solid role players and draft picks that on a net basis would make the team better.

There is a huge difference between talent and playing basketball well.

Melo is an terrific basketball talent, but he's a terrible basketball player.

Some aspects of basketball are obvious, but offense is not.

The key to offense is NOT how many points you score or the degree of difficultly of the shots you are capable of making late in the shot clock.

The key to offense is knowing what your strengths are, staying with those, and not turning the ball over. It's about scoring efficiency, moving the ball when you don't have a great look, and not doing dumb things that lead to TOs.

Melo is terrible at all those things.

He's incapable of changing and becoming a good basketball player because he lacks the basic BBall intelligence to understand how to play the game properly and has an ego that's too big to allow him to listen to those that try to make him better (just ask George Karl).

Right now Gallo is already a better and more productive player than Melo even up. He may not be as talented and may not be able to do some of the things Melo can, but he's knows what he's good at (going to the basket to getting to FT line, open 3s, and scoring in transition) and sticks with it. That's why his TS% is a whopping 60+% and he doesn't turn the ball over much. Compare that to Melo's below average 52% and TO machine playing style.

I agree but realistically we're stuck with Melo. The only chance and it's a slim one of this working out decently is if a coach like Pat Riley came in and took a tough love approach with Melo.

We're stuck with Dolan.

We're stuck with Amare's uninsureable contract.

We're fortunate to have a top 10 talent in Carmelo.

Bonn1997 wrote:

islesfan wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

ItalianStallion wrote:I would trade Melo for a unprotected second round pick and a trade exception. I'm serious. He's that bad. We could easily fill his 18m with solid role players and draft picks that on a net basis would make the team better.

There is a huge difference between talent and playing basketball well.

Melo is an terrific basketball talent, but he's a terrible basketball player.

Some aspects of basketball are obvious, but offense is not.

The key to offense is NOT how many points you score or the degree of difficultly of the shots you are capable of making late in the shot clock.

The key to offense is knowing what your strengths are, staying with those, and not turning the ball over. It's about scoring efficiency, moving the ball when you don't have a great look, and not doing dumb things that lead to TOs.

Melo is terrible at all those things.

He's incapable of changing and becoming a good basketball player because he lacks the basic BBall intelligence to understand how to play the game properly and has an ego that's too big to allow him to listen to those that try to make him better (just ask George Karl).

Right now Gallo is already a better and more productive player than Melo even up. He may not be as talented and may not be able to do some of the things Melo can, but he's knows what he's good at (going to the basket to getting to FT line, open 3s, and scoring in transition) and sticks with it. That's why his TS% is a whopping 60+% and he doesn't turn the ball over much. Compare that to Melo's below average 52% and TO machine playing style.

I agree but realistically we're stuck with Melo. The only chance and it's a slim one of this working out decently is if a coach like Pat Riley came in and took a tough love approach with Melo.

We're stuck with Dolan.

We're stuck with Amare's uninsureable contract.

We're fortunate to have a top 10 talent in Carmelo.

Proof is in the pudding. I'll believe it when I see it. So far I've seen nothing to confirm what you're saying.

Yeas, because you've never seen him play in Denver? Cut the nonsense, you know Anthony is one of the top players in this league. He was off to a very good start this year (30 plus in 3-4 straight I believe). Bad play coinsides with his wrist injury. The off shooting will not last....

Uptown wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

islesfan wrote:

Bonn1997 wrote:

ItalianStallion wrote:I would trade Melo for a unprotected second round pick and a trade exception. I'm serious. He's that bad. We could easily fill his 18m with solid role players and draft picks that on a net basis would make the team better.

There is a huge difference between talent and playing basketball well.

Melo is an terrific basketball talent, but he's a terrible basketball player.

Some aspects of basketball are obvious, but offense is not.

The key to offense is NOT how many points you score or the degree of difficultly of the shots you are capable of making late in the shot clock.

The key to offense is knowing what your strengths are, staying with those, and not turning the ball over. It's about scoring efficiency, moving the ball when you don't have a great look, and not doing dumb things that lead to TOs.

Melo is terrible at all those things.

He's incapable of changing and becoming a good basketball player because he lacks the basic BBall intelligence to understand how to play the game properly and has an ego that's too big to allow him to listen to those that try to make him better (just ask George Karl).

Right now Gallo is already a better and more productive player than Melo even up. He may not be as talented and may not be able to do some of the things Melo can, but he's knows what he's good at (going to the basket to getting to FT line, open 3s, and scoring in transition) and sticks with it. That's why his TS% is a whopping 60+% and he doesn't turn the ball over much. Compare that to Melo's below average 52% and TO machine playing style.

I agree but realistically we're stuck with Melo. The only chance and it's a slim one of this working out decently is if a coach like Pat Riley came in and took a tough love approach with Melo.

We're stuck with Dolan.

We're stuck with Amare's uninsureable contract.

We're fortunate to have a top 10 talent in Carmelo.

Proof is in the pudding. I'll believe it when I see it. So far I've seen nothing to confirm what you're saying.

Yeas, because you've never seen him play in Denver? Cut the nonsense, you know Anthony is one of the top players in this league. He was off to a very good start this year (30 plus in 3-4 straight I believe). Bad play coinsides with his wrist injury. The off shooting will not last....

The teams with Melo in Denver played reasonably well in spite of, not because of, Carmelo's inefficiency on offense. Billups and Nene are each extremely efficient on offense (look at TS%, not FG%), which compensated for Carmelo.

Go ask Denver fans if they want him back.