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Elephant in the room: Landry has fallen apart post Melo trade
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crzymdups
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12/22/2011  2:24 PM
Bonn1997 wrote:
crzymdups wrote:Someone pointed out that it's similar to Channing Frye's second season in NY. The game is still the same, but it seems like the confidence is gone and the guy is pressing.

I think he'll be fine again, but I do also think Shump might be a better fit with the starting unit, especially once Baron is fully up and running. Though Baron could also help Landry regain his game - it'd be nice to have an actual PG again.


Frye is not a good example if you want to argue that Landry will be fine!

He was one of the most important players on the Suns team that made it to the Western Conference Finals in Amare's last season there.

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misterearl
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12/22/2011  2:43 PM
Knixkik wrote:
misterearl wrote:
holfresh wrote:I saw a couple of good things from Landry last night...He bulked up a touch over the summer...There were three times where he drove hard to the hole...He wasn't as aggressive last year...Two drives didn't fall last night but his effort was there...I think he needs time...He just needs some confidence knocking down the open jumper...If he continues to go hard to the hole that may be another dimension to his game that can help us...It's still preseason in my eyes...Give him some time...

Great observation. There is nothing wrong with Landry Fields that a double double game cannot fix.

Fix the lead guard and you fix the Knicks.

People think Melo was the difference in Fields game, but it was the change in PG. Put him next to a healthy Davis, or Nash, or back with Felton and you a see a more natural Fields. That being said, he probably isn't a long-term starter, he is probably best as a 6th or 7th man backing up the SG/SF. Shumpert will eventually fill that role and Fields will find his role as a top reserve on our contending team, and there is nothing wrong with that.

Outstanding point Knixkik - Watching an indecisive Toney Douglas walk, or jog, the ball upcourt, with all this talent, is painful.

There was a sequence last night where Douglas dribbled to the right side of the free throw area, and then retreated - still on the dribble - back outside the three point arc.

Just shoot me.

once a knick always a knick
RonRon
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12/22/2011  3:14 PM
I agree, TD needs the help of another guard to take the pressure of him.
I think they work better defensively together with Chandler.
He just isn't a great decision maker, until Baron Davis is healthy, I would like to see them start together.
Baron Davis, if healthy, doesn't need any help, can make decisions, run the PnR, has the ability to penetrate, pass, and feed the cutters.
Having Bibby is crucial for the season, till Baron returns, but is needed for depth even when Baron is back.
Fields is more of a tweener in the SF than SG side, he can't dribble/penetrate, helping the PG like Iman can.
The best thing he does is RB for a SG, that isn't what we need for our starting lineup now.
He does have a good feel of cutting and can hit the wide open jump shot with 3pointers if left uncontested.
In my opinion, Baron would be more ideal for Fields.
I agree is hes closer to a 7th or 8th man, on this squad, however, we don't have an ideal starting SG either.
This is why I would like to to deal him, getting value for him, and use MLE to help other areas, instead of using it to resign Fields.
OasisBU
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12/22/2011  3:42 PM
I am not high on Fields but isn't it a little early to throw the towel in on him? He needs to play well this year to get a contract so my guess is he finds his game at some point.
"If at first you don't succeed, then maybe you just SUCK." Kenny Powers
rvwink
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12/22/2011  4:04 PM
I understand your agenda. I too would like Shump Shump to develop as quickly as possible because with extra experience, his exceptional upside could make him extremely valuable to the Knicks in the post season. I specifically wonder if he couldn't develop into our point guard?

But when a coach makes personnel moves, it is important that all of the players think the move made is a reasonable one. Landry Fields shot 33% from the field last night. Actually the whole Knick's team shot 33% from the field during last nights Nets game. Shump shot worse (16%) from the field during the same game. I also think it is tough for a player to lose his starting job, after a 2 game preseason. With the exception of Melo who shot 8 of 17, everyone including Amare, (5 of 14) shot badly. The players are not ready for the season yet, so why judge them if you don't have to?

In light of the fact that rookies tend to hit "the wall" towards the end of their initial year, it seems to me that the fact that Landry wasn't great in the initial playoff series, should not be a reason for benching him this year. I think there is plenty of time during the season for MDA to make personnel moves. Don't think that this is the time to take Landry's starting role away. I think Landry should get some respect for how well he played last year. I actually think he will be even better this year, once he becomes acclimated. Why jump the gun?

KncksbigKATS
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12/22/2011  4:23 PM
OasisBU wrote:I am not high on Fields but isn't it a little early to throw the towel in on him? He needs to play well this year to get a contract so my guess is he finds his game at some point.

I agree with this and feel that Landry has the smarts to adjust his game
in order to remain the starter. Once again, patience is needed.
If after 15 games he's still struggling, I'd make a change to Shump.

"Talent wins games, but teamwork and intelligence wins championships." -Michael Jordan
misterearl
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12/22/2011  4:57 PM    LAST EDITED: 12/22/2011  4:57 PM
The Elephant in the room is that Amar'e and Carmelo are still getting acquainted on the offensive end. Add Tyson Chandler and you have three men who have been playing together for about three weeks - total.

No offseason workouts in Houston or Las Vegas and no Summer League. There are six holdovers from last years roster. 6 of 14.

Add a lead guard - Toney Douglas - who is not a lead guard - and it reads like an instant recipe for confusion.

Landry Fields is a sophomore and Shumpert is a freshman. They are in search of their individual voice, but careful not to shout around the stars.

To defer or not to defer?

Who is the lead dog?

What happens when the poor shot distribution and selection continues to produce more nights with 35 per cent shooting from the field?

Are we relying on jump shots or making the extra pass to generate layups?

Is there a triangle in the house?

once a knick always a knick
Olbrannon
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12/22/2011  5:26 PM
Is there a triangle in the house?

lol Perhaps others will arrive at the same conclusion and convey it to
It may not be 82 games but it is still a long journey condensed as the season
will be.

I wonder will Melo's venture into point forward territory make him have a bit less arrogant and demanding off the ball. I think he will learn quickly that guarding others with his head is a bad idea.

Jorts may already be a better defensive player than Stat.

Bill Simmons on Tyreke Evans "The prototypical 0-guard: Someone who handles the ball all the time, looks for his own shot, gets to the rim at will and operates best if his teammates spread the floor to watch him."
misterearl
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12/22/2011  6:33 PM
Olbrannon wrote:
Is there a triangle in the house?

Jorts may already be a better defensive player than Stat.

Wes Unseld 2.0 is already a better rebounder than Stat.

Already a Garden favorite, Harrellson can hold position in a grown man's NBA. His game translates better at this level than in college.

Just let him make his first shot on Christmas Day - the place will go nuts.

once a knick always a knick
loweyecue
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12/22/2011  6:53 PM
Olbrannon wrote:Seems to me Fields used to get a lot of his production off lob passes on the back door cuts and putbacks. With Melo being such a rebounder at SF they may not want him to clog up the paint and so he is being kept on the outside more deliberately.

For all the stats that are thrown up though seems like Stat has fallen off as much or more since Melo arrived.

I have said in multiple threads that Fields and Melo shouldn't be on the floor together. Landry's game is in the paint playing off the ball. With Melo/Stat in there he has nowhere to go. The guy should be backing up Melo but now Balkman is laying claim to that duty. Right now Fields doesn't fit very well with the personnel we have. I think he understands this and it's probably making him even less confident.

But him and Blaky together as forwards in the second unit is conceivable, with Bibby and Gumpy in the backcourt.

TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
knicks1248
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12/22/2011  7:37 PM
Iman is good energy off the bench...good intensity. Fields is good until you can plug a pure shooter in as your sg..gotta balance the rotation, can't have all your scorers starting or all your better defenders starting..if you do that then what will your bench have, a bunch of sub par players that don't bring much of anything.
ES
Elephant in the room: Landry has fallen apart post Melo trade

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