TMS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:

TMS wrote:

"I don't care what the cap comes in at, they can get the guy," one rival executive said. "I've done the math a million times."

The Knicks have $44 million in salary committed for 2011-12, and that includes $8 million to $10 million in non-expiring contracts that would be going to Denver in an Anthony trade. It also includes Anthony Randolph ($2.9 million), who either will be going to Denver or Minnesota in the next week. If the Knicks get Anthony in an extend-and-trade before June 30, cap space for him is a non-issue; Anthony's $18.5 million salary for next season would kick in. The issue would be having flexibility to put more pieces around Anthony and Amar'e Stoudemire -- which is yet another item the short-sighted Melo-now crowd ignores.

ok so since none of you want to bother to actually DO the math instead of just accepting something somebody writes up on the internet as fact because he cites a "source" & would rather complain about hearing crickets on this, i'll give it a go:

Knicks committed salaries for 2011-12:

Amare $18,217,705
Felton $7,500,000
Turiaf $4,360,000
Gallo $4,190,182
Timo $2,566,800
AR $2,911,231
TD $1,145,640
Rautins $788,872
Fields $788,872

unless my calculator is broken, that comes out to $42,469,302 for 9 roster spots... that doesn't even include Wilson Chandler's contract, who we will obviously have to renounce to have any shot at all of signing Melo to a max contract, & doesn't include the other 3 roster spot cap holds, including our 1st rd pick caphold, which in total i am assuming will come in at around $2M in total... so altogether this comes out to the $44.5M in committed cap figure the author cites in this article for next season... that much i think we can all agree upon, amateur & professional capologists alike.

now if u will can one of you Miss Cleo's tell me what the exact salary cap figure will be in a new CBA that has yet to be negotiated? obviously not... so let's go off based on this year's salary cap figure, which is $58M... simple math tells me $58M minus $44.5M leaves you with $13.5M... can any of you non-hysterical professional capologists out there tell me what a max contract will come in at the first year? something tells me that figure won't come anywhere close to $13.5M... & all things i've read leading up to this summer has the cap figure coming down if anything, so we might have even less cap space to work with this summer.

please someone enlighten this amateur capologist what i'm missing here... i just don't see how we can fit Melo's max salary on the books without dumping more salary for next season.

oh look, an amateur capologist.

why do you assume that you know more about the cap than guys who actually get the league financials and have an inkling about what the cap will be next year.

there are always doomsday predictions about the cap - they are almost never true.

also, if you think AR will be on the cap come July 1, you are wrong. if he doesn't go in a Melo trade he will be traded to Minnesota for a first round pick. bank on that.

i don't assume anything... i'm putting the math out there for everyone to see... if u know of something i'm interpreting wrong here let me know... if Ken Berger knows something we amateurs don't, how about outlining the error rather than reiterating what amateurs like myself have been saying all along & then calling us amateurs for saying it? this article is nothing more than an insult ridden condescending piece he's bringing absolutely nothing new to the table that everyone doesn't already know & that hasn't already been talked about ad nauseum.

i don't think the article is condescending at all. i think it's a sober, solid analysis of the situation. if you feel like it's condescending to be refered to as an amateur when you are getting your cap numbers from websites that have dubious sources of getting these salaries - as opposed to real GMs who see the actual numbers (the salary numbers aren't public, hoopshype and the like guess at most of the salaries or get them second or third hand), i don't know what to tell you. you are an amateur, i am an amateur - we don't know the real numbers. if a true nba GM is saying he's crunched the numbers and thinks the knicks have room - i believe him.

also, i just pointed out one flaw in your math - there is no way AR is on the cap for 2011. by my admittedly amateur calculations, if the cap stays the same as this year and the max stays the same as this year, that gives the knicks ample space to sign carmelo to a max deal once AR is traded for a pick.

TMS wrote:

i don't think the article is condescending at all. i think it's a sober, solid analysis of the situation. if you feel like it's condescending to be refered to as an amateur when you are getting your cap numbers from websites that have dubious sources of getting these salaries - as opposed to real GMs who see the actual numbers (the salary numbers aren't public, hoopshype and the like guess at most of the salaries or get them second or third hand), i don't know what to tell you. you are an amateur, i am an amateur - we don't know the real numbers. if a true nba GM is saying he's crunched the numbers and thinks the knicks have room - i believe him.

also, i just pointed out one flaw in your math - there is no way AR is on the cap for 2011. by my admittedly amateur calculations, if the cap stays the same as this year and the max stays the same as this year, that gives the knicks ample space to sign carmelo to a max deal once AR is traded for a pick.

my math is the same math being used by Berger in this article to reach his $44M in contracts committed for next season... read the article:

The Knicks have $44 million in salary committed for 2011-12, and that includes $8 million to $10 million in non-expiring contracts that would be going to Denver in an Anthony trade. It also includes Anthony Randolph ($2.9 million), who either will be going to Denver or Minnesota in the next week.

all of the amateur capologists have already noted that we need to dump at least $3-4M more in salary cap for next year along with renouncing Wilson C to have any hope at all of signing Melo to a contract & that's before we even know what the final cap figure will be set at in the new CBA... so again, what new bits of professional information from his "sources" is Ken Berger bringing to the table in this article? where are these "hysterical calculations from amateur capologists" he's poking fun at in this article?

i think you're taking the article a little too personally. i don't think your math can be as accurate as someone who works for the league and has access to the real numbers. you're posting these salaries and that's fine, but the truth is you are getting them from sites that get them second and third hand.

and you keep leaving AR on the cap for next season, which Berger specifically refutes will happen... and which i think anyone who follows this team knows is true - AR is gone by the deadline no matter what.

TMS wrote:dude, i included AR because Berger included him in his $44M figure to show that he's not saying anything we don't already know... take out AR's contract & our cap figure for next season goes down to $41M... no kidding if we trade AR for an expiring & renounce Wilson we will likely have the cap space to sign Melo... that's not news to anyone, we've only been talking about that very same thing for the past few months but somehow to Berger it's hysterical calculations on our part?... the fact remains we're looking at losing Wilson & AR regardless if we trade for Melo or sign him via free agency... these are not earth shattering conclusions brought up by Ken Berger in this article.

all indications are denver wants a lot more than wilson and ar in a trade for melo. like ray felton, gallinari and landry fields. and mozgov. and they don't want wilson.

franco12 wrote:TMS- as long as we are close enough to offer a max type deal, we can easily shed deals like AR in the summer for cap relief, and what you fail to consider is that we might end up working out some kind of S&T for Melo, where AR, Chandler and our first round pick go to Denver for Melo.

again franco, i'm not failing to consider that possibility... i am including AR's contract in my figures because Berger did so in his article... i'm just trying to show people what the math is according to the way he's presented the scenario & asking why he thinks it's just hysterical calculations... seems like he's only reiterating what's already well known by everyone who's followed this situation at any length in the past few months.

as for a S&T this summer, i have zero idea how a S&T could be worked out with a new CBA looming so i won't even bother commenting on that... maybe u can shed some light on how that would work?