nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:I have no problem with Mosgov. I had a much bigger problem with Jordan Hill last year even though he was shooting well. Mos has BBIQ over Hill.

Mos is really intimidating out there. Often when he comes in he completely changes the other teams constant penetrations. Yeah he makes stupid fouls and slips here and there but for a guy right out of Russia (who though older wasn't even getting much playing time there - that is how he slipped) he is all right in my book.

He is coming along, and better than Hasheem Thabeet, the #2 pick last year. Take that for perspective.

Just to give you an idea of how little a chance Hill was given by D'Antoni last year, Timofey needs to only play 38 more minutes to equal Hill's total career minutes as a Knick. Also, Hill is turning into a nice player. He may not ever be a guy that should have been drafted 8 but he is putting up good numbers and playing well in the minutes he gets. His play and potential were talked about during the ESPN game the other night.

a little more perspective... Mozgov is a full 2 years older than Jordan Hill was last year & still has yet to demonstrate any sort of consistent offensive skillset... in a season where expectations are to make the playoffs you would figure there would be less patience shown towards under developed rooks, & the opposite to be the case during a season where the playoffs were never a realistic expectation, especially when it comes to a rookie that was just selected with a #8 lottery pick... things are done so ass backwards around here it's ridiculous.

Hill was a victim of the timing and situation he was brought into. If he was here now he would get more of a chance. Things are different now. He also hurt himself early on. We've gone over the reasons many times. Thing is that despite the fact that Hill had more developed offensive skillset, it was more about his attitude towards prep that I think killed him at the start. You've NEVER heard or seen Moz not prep, practice or play hard. He may get overwhelmed but he goes hard. Also he's a bigger player that helps give us needed size to match up or have an advantage. Hill has talent and should be good one day, but I think once Timo get's the hang of things he'll also be a very good asset.

CrushAlot wrote:

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:

earthmansurfer wrote:I have no problem with Mosgov. I had a much bigger problem with Jordan Hill last year even though he was shooting well. Mos has BBIQ over Hill.

Mos is really intimidating out there. Often when he comes in he completely changes the other teams constant penetrations. Yeah he makes stupid fouls and slips here and there but for a guy right out of Russia (who though older wasn't even getting much playing time there - that is how he slipped) he is all right in my book.

He is coming along, and better than Hasheem Thabeet, the #2 pick last year. Take that for perspective.

Just to give you an idea of how little a chance Hill was given by D'Antoni last year, Timofey needs to only play 38 more minutes to equal Hill's total career minutes as a Knick. Also, Hill is turning into a nice player. He may not ever be a guy that should have been drafted 8 but he is putting up good numbers and playing well in the minutes he gets. His play and potential were talked about during the ESPN game the other night.

a little more perspective... Mozgov is a full 2 years older than Jordan Hill was last year & still has yet to demonstrate any sort of consistent offensive skillset... in a season where expectations are to make the playoffs you would figure there would be less patience shown towards under developed rooks, & the opposite to be the case during a season where the playoffs were never a realistic expectation, especially when it comes to a rookie that was just selected with a #8 lottery pick... things are done so ass backwards around here it's ridiculous.

Hill was a victim of the timing and situation he was brought into. If he was here now he would get more of a chance. Things are different now. He also hurt himself early on. We've gone over the reasons many times. Thing is that despite the fact that Hill had more developed offensive skillset, it was more about his attitude towards prep that I think killed him at the start. You've NEVER heard or seen Moz not prep, practice or play hard. He may get overwhelmed but he goes hard. Also he's a bigger player that helps give us needed size to match up or have an advantage. Hill has talent and should be good one day, but I think once Timo get's the hang of things he'll also be a very good asset.

I guess I don't know how timing and situation could be any better for a young player to get minutes on a team not competing for a playoff spot filled with a roster of mediocre vets that were not coming back the next year. If that player is the teams lottery pick and endorsed by the coach I am even more confused if he doesn't get minutes.

There must have been something going on behind the scenes (in practice) or something the coaching staff saw in tape that they didn't like from Hill, similar to whats going on with AR today. Obviously, none of us know for sure so anything any of us say is a pure speculation. This has nothing to do with Hill being a rookie, obviously, since we see Moz and Fields getting ample minutes....

AR will get his chance to do more. He needs to keep working and i'm positive his time will come. Timo isn't as far off from contributing as many make it seem. If we had better passing PG's he'd already be scoring more in the paint for us. He's been open a TON so far this season. In the meantime i'll take Timo's defense, cuz it's not bad when he isn't committing dumb fouls.

Moz has a lot of polishing to do. he is 10-12 minutes and he is not put in pressure situations at this time. He does not hurt us and is on a short leash.

I don't see we are true contender status yet so developing him is the right thing.

If he goes to DLeague with the chuckers and stat hogs trying to get a call up to the show he won't see the ball.

Turnovers are part of the equation for rebuilding teams.

I don't see we are done rebuilding.

That said, I see Mosgov turning into a really really good player and as I already said, he makes a HUGE difference on the defensive end. What I've noticed by watching him play and at the same time watching the box score, is that even when he is making mistakes his + - often goes +. I think it's just growing pains.

Again, look at Hasheem Thabeet, bigs take time and so far ours is having a bigger, much bigger impact than the #2 pick last year. You don't give up on bigs quickly, especially when they are doing good things.

JohnWallace44 wrote:You're worried about a 7ft defensive player's hands 1/4 of the way into his rookie season?

If he cuts down on fouls then he'll be extremely valuable. He can shoot and I think the hands thing is just rookie nerves.

I'm more concerned about his rebounding technique than anything.

izybx wrote:

JohnWallace44 wrote:You're worried about a 7ft defensive player's hands 1/4 of the way into his rookie season?

If he cuts down on fouls then he'll be extremely valuable. He can shoot and I think the hands thing is just rookie nerves.

I'm more concerned about his rebounding technique than anything.

listen to what youre saying...

"if he cuts down on the fouls"

this guy is a "defensive player" who fouls so much that he cant play defense. I know hes a rookie but have we seen any improvement in these 16 games? No.

"the hands thing s rookie nerves"

the hands thing is a HUGE problem. This guy literally cannot catch a ball without bobbling it. Watch the games, hes getting the ball passed right into his hands wide open under the rim and hell bobble it and turn it over. Hell go for a rebound and have to taken from him. Hes SCARED OF THE BALL.

"Im more concerned about his rebounding technique"

He cant catch the ball! He can get into position to get the rebound but than he acts like hes trying to catch a live grenade.

I think we see the same things in him. Truth is, Im a huge homer and am usually the first to defend a guy, but Timo playing over AR just boggles my mind. I imagine that AR has some attitude problem behind the scenes that is putting him in Dantonis doghouse, but theres got to be a better option than Mosgov right now. He is giving us nothing, and its hurting us.

Imagine if the Pacers gave up on Roy Hibbert and his 3+ fouls in 15 minutes his rookie year?

If the Knicks are going to be a bigtime team they need one or two of their young guys to becomes bigtime players. Maybe not stars, but high end rotation or bordline all star types. Mosgov's potential is a game changing defensive presense at center. Those guys take a few years to get there.

The Knicks are a playoff team as currently constructed. Whatever they lose from running out Mosgov every game doesnt matter. It just doesnt.

timo keeps busy which is the reason why his turnovers are noticeable. piston game you saw timo getting to the paint and losing the ball due to not being able to catch low passes. a work-around is to pass high to timo, to give him his best opportunity to score.

Mosgov is not an NBA ready player.

We have a huge investment in Amare Stoudemire--who is an MVP type player.

We have some very nice pieces around him.

We cannot let him play so many minutes. We cant have so many roster spots stuck with nothing coming out of them.

I want to keep ALL of the starting 5 players long term yes including Chandler who is very under rated.

I am willing to deal ANYONE that was not starting yesterday including Turriaf and Douglas in the right deal. That means the whole roster with exception of yesterdays starting 5. My goal is to find pieces NOW that will push me to the next level in what has become a wide open east and NBA for that matter. Now it is up to D Walsh to improve the team and to do so before we start running Amare into the ground.