martin wrote:

Paladin55 wrote:

martin wrote:I tell you what. Moz may have only recorded a block per game in his minutes, but he sure does make players miss shots that would be layups last year.

Always seems like he is doing more in terms of blocks than he is give credit for.

How much autonomy does the home town official scorer have for deciding whether a block (and assists, for that matter) took place?

a block is a block, you gotta touch the ball on the way to the basket otherwise it's just a bad shot. But there is a lot of gray area in assists.

nixluva wrote:

martin wrote:

Paladin55 wrote:

martin wrote:I tell you what. Moz may have only recorded a block per game in his minutes, but he sure does make players miss shots that would be layups last year.

Always seems like he is doing more in terms of blocks than he is give credit for.

How much autonomy does the home town official scorer have for deciding whether a block (and assists, for that matter) took place?

a block is a block, you gotta touch the ball on the way to the basket otherwise it's just a bad shot. But there is a lot of gray area in assists.

Sometimes they just plain miss it, cuz the block isn't that clear. The game is moving so fast they can't catch all of them.

except if you are in Boston and are a PG, in which case assists are counted like hockey assists LOL

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

rvwink wrote:Turiaf
6.3 points, 4.3 reb., 2.5 assists, +13.5 eff., 2.2 bk2, TO .2, .600 shooting % in 24 min a game.

Mosgov
1.5 points, 2.5 reb. .5 assists, 2.25 eff, .8 bks, To 1.5, .286 shooting % in 12.5 min a game

Whose game do you like better for the Knicks over the whole season? Also, which of Mosgov's numbers do you think will improve the most during the season? How many rebounds is he likely to get for example?

Turiaf should be starting right now, it's pretty obvious if u ask me... Mozgov is still getting used to the NBA tempo, he should be coming off the bench until he gets more comfortable w/this offense.

You should applaud the move Mike is making. He's giving Timo a great opportunity to go against the best in the league and learn. He's gonna have to learn the starting bigs in the league and what better way than with the 1st unit? This is also not a case of Timo hurting the team when he's out there. He's actually doing OK, he's just not spectacular in any way. This saves Turiaf some fouls too. Ronny is doing well against the second unit guys on D.

why should i applaud something i disagree with? you can like the fact that we're starting a rookie who doesn't look like he's ready to start, but i can't... i think it would be better for him to be eased into the starting rotation over the course of the season... Mozgov getting minutes i have no problem with, but Turiaf should be starting right now... he has been the much more effective player on the court so far.

Turiaf should stay coming off the bench, IMO you always want your energy guys on the bench and that TD, turiaf, and chandler...

TMS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

rvwink wrote:Turiaf
6.3 points, 4.3 reb., 2.5 assists, +13.5 eff., 2.2 bk2, TO .2, .600 shooting % in 24 min a game.

Mosgov
1.5 points, 2.5 reb. .5 assists, 2.25 eff, .8 bks, To 1.5, .286 shooting % in 12.5 min a game

Whose game do you like better for the Knicks over the whole season? Also, which of Mosgov's numbers do you think will improve the most during the season? How many rebounds is he likely to get for example?

Turiaf should be starting right now, it's pretty obvious if u ask me... Mozgov is still getting used to the NBA tempo, he should be coming off the bench until he gets more comfortable w/this offense.

You should applaud the move Mike is making. He's giving Timo a great opportunity to go against the best in the league and learn. He's gonna have to learn the starting bigs in the league and what better way than with the 1st unit? This is also not a case of Timo hurting the team when he's out there. He's actually doing OK, he's just not spectacular in any way. This saves Turiaf some fouls too. Ronny is doing well against the second unit guys on D.

why should i applaud something i disagree with? you can like the fact that we're starting a rookie who doesn't look like he's ready to start, but i can't... i think it would be better for him to be eased into the starting rotation over the course of the season... Mozgov getting minutes i have no problem with, but Turiaf should be starting right now... he has been the much more effective player on the court so far.

Ok, but I think Mike is actually getting a good benefit from going this way at this point. Maybe he'll change things up, but from the way things have gone so far, I see no reason to change. It's a PLUS for Timo to be in there against the staring Bigs in the NBA and gain that experience. Turiaf still gets starter minutes and doesn't have to worry about picking up any early fouls. It's working!

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

rvwink wrote:Turiaf
6.3 points, 4.3 reb., 2.5 assists, +13.5 eff., 2.2 bk2, TO .2, .600 shooting % in 24 min a game.

Mosgov
1.5 points, 2.5 reb. .5 assists, 2.25 eff, .8 bks, To 1.5, .286 shooting % in 12.5 min a game

Whose game do you like better for the Knicks over the whole season? Also, which of Mosgov's numbers do you think will improve the most during the season? How many rebounds is he likely to get for example?

Turiaf should be starting right now, it's pretty obvious if u ask me... Mozgov is still getting used to the NBA tempo, he should be coming off the bench until he gets more comfortable w/this offense.

You should applaud the move Mike is making. He's giving Timo a great opportunity to go against the best in the league and learn. He's gonna have to learn the starting bigs in the league and what better way than with the 1st unit? This is also not a case of Timo hurting the team when he's out there. He's actually doing OK, he's just not spectacular in any way. This saves Turiaf some fouls too. Ronny is doing well against the second unit guys on D.

why should i applaud something i disagree with? you can like the fact that we're starting a rookie who doesn't look like he's ready to start, but i can't... i think it would be better for him to be eased into the starting rotation over the course of the season... Mozgov getting minutes i have no problem with, but Turiaf should be starting right now... he has been the much more effective player on the court so far.

Ok, but I think Mike is actually getting a good benefit from going this way at this point. Maybe he'll change things up, but from the way things have gone so far, I see no reason to change. It's a PLUS for Timo to be in there against the staring Bigs in the NBA and gain that experience. Turiaf still gets starter minutes and doesn't have to worry about picking up any early fouls. It's working!

if we weren't trying to contend for the playoffs this year, i'd have no problem w/starting Mozgov & letting him learn on the fly... case in point, Jordan Hill or Toney Douglas last year... right now the season is still up for grabs, every win is important for us... Landry Fields is showing himself well... Moz, not so much... maybe he will benefit from starting but i'd prefer we wait until he shows he understands what he should be doing on the floor before we throw him out on the floor as a starter for now... if in the 2nd half of the season we're out of playoff contention, then i'd have no problem w/giving him 30+ a night to let him develop & mature regardless if he was ready or not.

NYKBocker wrote:The one thing that I am excited about Turiaf is not the obvious (PnR finish and shot blocking) but he is a great teammate. When Gallo was cooking in the first half last night, Ronnie was all pumped and was very vocal and demonstrative with Gallo. We are lucky to have him.

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

nixluva wrote:

TMS wrote:

rvwink wrote:Turiaf
6.3 points, 4.3 reb., 2.5 assists, +13.5 eff., 2.2 bk2, TO .2, .600 shooting % in 24 min a game.

Mosgov
1.5 points, 2.5 reb. .5 assists, 2.25 eff, .8 bks, To 1.5, .286 shooting % in 12.5 min a game

Whose game do you like better for the Knicks over the whole season? Also, which of Mosgov's numbers do you think will improve the most during the season? How many rebounds is he likely to get for example?

Turiaf should be starting right now, it's pretty obvious if u ask me... Mozgov is still getting used to the NBA tempo, he should be coming off the bench until he gets more comfortable w/this offense.

You should applaud the move Mike is making. He's giving Timo a great opportunity to go against the best in the league and learn. He's gonna have to learn the starting bigs in the league and what better way than with the 1st unit? This is also not a case of Timo hurting the team when he's out there. He's actually doing OK, he's just not spectacular in any way. This saves Turiaf some fouls too. Ronny is doing well against the second unit guys on D.

why should i applaud something i disagree with? you can like the fact that we're starting a rookie who doesn't look like he's ready to start, but i can't... i think it would be better for him to be eased into the starting rotation over the course of the season... Mozgov getting minutes i have no problem with, but Turiaf should be starting right now... he has been the much more effective player on the court so far.

Ok, but I think Mike is actually getting a good benefit from going this way at this point. Maybe he'll change things up, but from the way things have gone so far, I see no reason to change. It's a PLUS for Timo to be in there against the staring Bigs in the NBA and gain that experience. Turiaf still gets starter minutes and doesn't have to worry about picking up any early fouls. It's working!

if we weren't trying to contend for the playoffs this year, i'd have no problem w/starting Mozgov & letting him learn on the fly... case in point, Jordan Hill or Toney Douglas last year... right now the season is still up for grabs, every win is important for us... Landry Fields is showing himself well... Moz, not so much... maybe he will benefit from starting but i'd prefer we wait until he shows he understands what he should be doing on the floor before we throw him out on the floor as a starter for now... if in the 2nd half of the season we're out of playoff contention, then i'd have no problem w/giving him 30+ a night to let him develop & mature regardless if he was ready or not.

IF Hill had shown the same level of hustle and understanding of the game he could've started. Timo from what I've seen fully understands what he's doing out there, he just needs to keep playing games and his teammates need to trust him a bit more. Timo has been open and not received the ball, he's made smart passes, played solid D. Exactly what has he done wrong? He's made sins of omission, not commission. He could do more out there, but he hasn't been messing up.

not for nothing but Hill showed more in his first 5 games of NBA action than Mozgov has... Hill had scored 25 pts. 9 rebounds & 2 blocked shots in total over his first 5 games & that's in alot less minutes than Mozgov has had so far... Mozgov has scored 12 pts. 10 rebounds & 3 blocked shots in total so far after his first 5 games... i'm not saying these are indicative of much, but your assumption that Mozgov has shown more of an understanding of the game than Hill is IMO unfounded... to me he still looks like a rookie who's lost & isn't ready for a starter's role.

also, for a 7'1" guy i would have expected him to be grabbing a lot more rebounds than he is now... that has nothing to do w/his teammates needing to trust him more... i just think he's getting out positioned & out muscled right now by more savvy vets under the boards.

again, i'm not ragging on the kid's talent because i do think he's got a nice upside... i'm just saying right now it's obvious to me that he needs more seasoning & that Turiaf gives us a better chance to win games as a starter... IMO it would probably benefit Mozgov more to be able to go up against the backup C's on other teams rather than struggling against their starters, at least until his confidence & game comes around to the point where he can take over the role down the road.

nixluva wrote:

CrushAlot wrote:I think Timofey starting is similar to when Monty Williams started his rookie year. It gives the team some balance and makes that second unit very powerful. Turiaf and Randolph are both probably going to end up with a lot more minutes but Timofey gets a chance to develop and has guaranteed minutes right now. If he comes off the bench he might not make it off. Also, Hill should have played last year and been at least given the opportunity Timofey was. I don't think there is any argument that can be made to justify not playing the 8 pick on a 29 win team with almost every player on the team having an expiring contract.

Actually Timo serves a purpose. He's not just out there doing nothing. He's being given the chance to develop, but at the same time he is helping our interior D and saving Turiaf from any early fouls against some of the Leagues tougher bigs. I agree that it's helping our bench, but it's also been effective for our starting line up. Our size is very solid to begin games. It's not about overall effectiveness at this point, cuz this kid has the kind of talent to be a starting C. He needs to play and he needs time to get adjusted. At least he's been making progress.

Hill was not doing what Mike wanted starting from SL all the way thru camp and preseason. That's not good. Timo on the other hand was impressing everyone from the start and that's why they gave him this rare opportunity.