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ESPN: Knicks make significant progress on Carmelo trade
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misterearl
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10/20/2010  8:17 AM
No Pain No Gain

Gallinari - The Answer Man senses a power play between Donnie Walnuts and Mike D'Antoni. Advantage: membership dues

The Mayor - The JR Smith over-tat look is so last season and could be holding up the trade. Can't Wilson schedule laser removal? Then again, Denver may covet the smart guy potential of Landry Fields.

DWTDD - a much better fit in Denver. The JR Smith over-tat look is so last season. Douglas and Felton have the backcourt on lock. How man steals did Douglas have again? Six? Sheesh.

Randolph - gaining Carmelo would stunt his development in New York as minutes are limited at the other forward spot that he is not built to play in the Eastern Conference. Minutes at the two? Bill Walker time!

Bill Walker - the ski season is about to open. Try the Oakley goggles.

Landry Fields - the 2010-11 glue guy. Keep him in orange and blue. I don't if Carmelo throws a tantrum. "When Landry Fields is on the floor, good things happen" - Clyde


Speculative Shift Du Jour

Felton - "at the same time..."
Fields - his growth curve accelerates with playing time
Anthony - LaLa gets more camera time than Spike
Stat - breathes a bit easier without the pressure to score all the points
Mozgov - "just get the rebound son"

Sixth Man

Shawne Williams

once a knick always a knick
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iSergio
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10/20/2010  8:17 AM
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

GoNyGoNyGo
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10/20/2010  8:31 AM
I have been against trading both AR and Gallo and have always said I would keep Gallinari. This past 2 weeks has made that stance tough as Gallo has been horrible. That being said, last night, Gallo showed me that he could be part of a team with Melo by coming off the bench and doing whatever the team needs at that point. You can see he made an effort to rebound last night as his shot was not falling again. AR showed last night the upside of his potential and it is pretty darn good. TD also showed his value. This kid can play and he is inspiring to his teammates with his D.

In the end, I think that AR and TD with Melo is a better team than Gallo and Melo. I really like Gallo and I still hope he stays with NY because I think he has that intangible that when he figures out the game better, he will be an All-Star. He wants to be in NY and IMO if he gets dealt, he would go back to Italy when his contract is up. Another team may not want him because of that too.

Right now, something is in his head. He is missing shots and FTs badly and that is just not him.


Melo with Amare makes NY a very good team. If they can keep AR and TD and Fields, I like the future as they are all young and hungry. They must teach MOzgov to just defend, rebound and block shots for now. His O will develop eventually as he has a nice stroke and runs the floor well. That is just a matter of putting in the work.

Felton/TD/Rautins
Walker/Buke/Mason
Melo/Fields
Amare/AR
Mozgov/Turiaf

Traded - Chandler, Gallo and Curry. Their front court depth will be hurt with this deal...I would like to see a pf/C type come back with Melo.


A good team that needs a top tier SG to be great.

Markji
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10/20/2010  8:37 AM
iSergio wrote:
Markji wrote:
Childs2Dudley wrote:I really, really don't want this to happen.

Gallinari, Randolph and Douglas for Carmelo Anthony sucks.


Go for Melo. I've changed my opinion after watching the past few games. We NEED a second scorer/"go to guy" in crunch time. Melo is that person. He is worth giving up AR + Gallo + Curry + Bill Walker(my inclusion) but not Toney D.

If we get Melo, then Gallo, and a little bit AR play the same position, so they can be given up without hurting the present team. Toney Douglas is now more valuable as we still need help at the 1 and 2; and we need his "D".

It would hurt to lose Toney Douglas more then Danilo Gallinari and Anthony Randolph. Douglas' defense is a HUGE weapon.


iSerg - I can't tell if you are agreeing with me about keeping Toney D or not reading my post correctly and you think I want to trade TD.

I am with you. Keep Toney D and trade Gallo and AR + Curry + Bill Walker? for Melo

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
fishmike
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10/20/2010  9:11 AM
iSergio wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

find me one post where anyone here said we should not sign Amare, instead we should resign Lee. Show me one post from anyone.

OR

Just keep making stuff up.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
fishmike
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10/20/2010  9:22 AM
Again.. whats the trade? What are we giving up?

Is it Chandler to whoever for a firstrounder, then Gallo, AR, Curry + that first rounder and our next available first rounder to trade for Melo?

That leaves us with
starters:
Mosgov
Amare
Melo
Walker
Felton

Bench:
Douglas, Fields, Turiaf

Thats a solid squad

Hey... who wouldnt sign up for that as a plan B? Especially now that we know Mosgov has a pretty high ceiling as a good center in this league.

Thats not the point. The point is why are you giving up so much when the guy wants to sign here anyway and you can keep all those players sans Chandler? It makes no sense, your bidding against yourself and jacking up the price... why? Because you risk losing him?

So you lose him, then you have AR, Gallo, Amare, Felton, Douglas, Walker, Fields, Rautins and Mosgov and MAX cap space to sign players or make trades.

So once again...

you can make stuff up like what Sergio is doing, or you can actually listen to the arguement that the Knicks are in a position to add Melo (or Parker, or Gasol, or others..) while giving up nothing but money.

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
Rookie
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10/20/2010  9:23 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/20/2010  9:30 AM
..so what exactly is the progress?...now it's being reported that we are willing to include yet another player that Denver isn't interested in? well makes sense that Chandler would not be mentioned if Gallo/Randolph are being discussed. Someone will have to back-up Amare at PF.

So now it's Gallo, Randolph, Curry, Douglass and prolly our 2014 1st rd. pick....still, I think the Douglass for a pick is speculation by Sheridan but it's someone for a pick.

Randolph for a 1st rounder, Gallo for someone Denver wants, Curry and our 2014?

Wonder who the other teams involve are if this has any legs

iSergio
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10/20/2010  9:25 AM
fishmike wrote:
iSergio wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

find me one post where anyone here said we should not sign Amare, instead we should resign Lee. Show me one post from anyone.

OR

Just keep making stuff up.

Tell Andrew and Martin to have a search function here and I will.

BRIGGS
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10/20/2010  9:26 AM
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...

Giving up half the team will have a cause and effect. The cumulative effect of these players over the season if we are talking Douglas Gallo Randolph Chandler Walker will be felt in lack of depth. We showed glimpses of what we can be last night--in 20 games even better. I do think we need a rebounding upgrade--we can start with fields for Mason but if we dump our team form CA--it might sound sexy--but whatever effect we get from carmelo will be nullified by a massive reduction in current rotation players who will likely have to be replaced by D league players. We will have 0 cap room no picks and our team will be based on one guy who cant play back to backs and another who has avg 68 per the last two. Its always about price and what effect cost will have. If its for all of these players the cost will have a massive effect. EVERY time we have given into a teams request--we haev lost that trade imho. We would be trading with a hand of weakness--that is for sure.

RIP Crushalot😞
nyk4ever
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10/20/2010  9:31 AM
iSergio wrote:
fishmike wrote:
iSergio wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

find me one post where anyone here said we should not sign Amare, instead we should resign Lee. Show me one post from anyone.

OR

Just keep making stuff up.

Tell Andrew and Martin to have a search function here and I will.

typical. you're gonna hide behind that?

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
iSergio
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10/20/2010  9:36 AM
nyk4ever wrote:
iSergio wrote:
fishmike wrote:
iSergio wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

find me one post where anyone here said we should not sign Amare, instead we should resign Lee. Show me one post from anyone.

OR

Just keep making stuff up.

Tell Andrew and Martin to have a search function here and I will.

typical. you're gonna hide behind that?

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=35538

As of right now--as is the Knicks are no better than last year---Lee and Stoudemire is a wash. Its like we traded Lee for Stoudemire. Its every move after this that will show us if we actually get better or not--if anyone really think Stoudemire is appreciably better than Lee--wrong.

"How does my ass taste?" - Shaq

TheGame
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10/20/2010  9:41 AM
Markji wrote:
Childs2Dudley wrote:I really, really don't want this to happen.

Gallinari, Randolph and Douglas for Carmelo Anthony sucks.


Go for Melo. I've changed my opinion after watching the past few games. We NEED a second scorer/"go to guy" in crunch time. Melo is that person. He is worth giving up AR + Gallo + Curry + Bill Walker(my inclusion) but not Toney D.

If we get Melo, then Gallo, and a little bit AR play the same position, so they can be given up without hurting the present team. Toney Douglas is now more valuable as we still need help at the 1 and 2; and we need his "D".

This is my view as well. Anthony is a stud. This dude can carry a team in the 4th quarter and pairing him with Amare and the big Russian pretty much gives us a frontcourt that can match up with Boston and the Lakers. Even if we had to give up Gallo, AR, Curry, and Douglas (who I would prefer to keep), a team of Felton, Chandler, Anthony, Amare, and TM, with Bill Walker, Fields, and Turiaf on the bench is a playoff team no doubt. I would do everything possible to keep Douglas, but there is no way either Gallo or AR is going to be a better player than Anthony is right now, and Anthony can still improve his game. I say go for it.

Trust the Process
Markji
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10/20/2010  9:42 AM
BRIGGS wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...

Giving up half the team will have a cause and effect. The cumulative effect of these players over the season if we are talking Douglas Gallo Randolph Chandler Walker will be felt in lack of depth. We showed glimpses of what we can be last night--in 20 games even better. I do think we need a rebounding upgrade--we can start with fields for Mason but if we dump our team form CA--it might sound sexy--but whatever effect we get from carmelo will be nullified by a massive reduction in current rotation players who will likely have to be replaced by D league players. We will have 0 cap room no picks and our team will be based on one guy who cant play back to backs and another who has avg 68 per the last two. Its always about price and what effect cost will have. If its for all of these players the cost will have a massive effect. EVERY time we have given into a teams request--we haev lost that trade imho. We would be trading with a hand of weakness--that is for sure.


I agree with you Briggs .... that we shouldn't give up too much. Donnie has been holding out for a good deal and not just jumping in. If Isiah were still in charge, half the team and 2-3 first rounders would probably be gone. But he is not. Donnie is in charge and as long as Dolan and Isiah stay out of this, I think we will do well.

But it is obvious to me that we need another major scorer/star....right now,if we want to make an impact this year. Melo would fit and we need him....
and
I'll repeat, as long as we don't give up too much, I do the trade.

The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
nyk4ever
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10/20/2010  9:42 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/20/2010  9:45 AM
iSergio wrote:
nyk4ever wrote:
iSergio wrote:
fishmike wrote:
iSergio wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

find me one post where anyone here said we should not sign Amare, instead we should resign Lee. Show me one post from anyone.

OR

Just keep making stuff up.

Tell Andrew and Martin to have a search function here and I will.

typical. you're gonna hide behind that?

http://www.ultimateknicks.com/forum/topic.asp?t=35538

As of right now--as is the Knicks are no better than last year---Lee and Stoudemire is a wash. Its like we traded Lee for Stoudemire. Its every move after this that will show us if we actually get better or not--if anyone really think Stoudemire is appreciably better than Lee--wrong.

"How does my ass taste?" - Shaq

you want a cookie? congrats on backing up your claim for once - that's all i wanted to see from you.

actually where did briggs say he wanted to sign lee over amar'e? all he mentioned was amar'e alone wasn't going to make this team THAT much better.

"keep searchin" - nyk4ever

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
NYKBocker
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10/20/2010  9:45 AM
iSergio wrote:
fishmike wrote:
iSergio wrote:
Uptown wrote:You make a deal for Melo in a heart beat. This team as currently constructed would be lucky to get an 8th seed at best. The boards infatuation with potential over proven allstar talent is headscracthing...


Same people who wanted to re-sign David Lee over signing Amar'e Stoudemire. LOL

find me one post where anyone here said we should not sign Amare, instead we should resign Lee. Show me one post from anyone.

OR

Just keep making stuff up.

Tell Andrew and Martin to have a search function here and I will.

You can google it. Here is the syntax on your search.

site:ultimateknicks.com <subject matter>

fish is right. No one here was saying that we resign DLee over Amare.

crzymdups
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10/20/2010  9:45 AM
I think the Knicks have to find a balance of staying patient on the Melo front but making sure they don't get caught sleeping while some other team makes a deal. I don't want to give up ALL the assets for Melo, but I would give up some. I'm glad Donnie is doing this - I think he'll be patient and get a good deal if it's possible. I still feel pretty sick about the prospect of giving up all the assets for Melo though.
¿ △ ?
Moonangie
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10/20/2010  9:49 AM
BRIGGS wrote:
Childs2Dudley wrote:I really, really don't want this to happen.

Gallinari, Randolph and Douglas for Carmelo Anthony sucks.

That would be ignoramus. I think we should hold em and let things play out. Once the deadline comes--the Nuggets will have to take less. If NJ has dropped Favors from their offer(which is the right move)why are we upping the ante?

Wow, if this ain't a starphuck move I don't know what is. Sheridan thinks we are going to trade ALL of our tradeable assets to land Anthony? Donnie needs to pop a SOMA and get back to his nap. This would be a very stupid trade for us as it would leave our bench decimated.

Starting 5 would be...

Mozgov
Amare
Melo
Chandler
Felton

Bench would be...

Turiaf
???
Fields
Mason/Walker/Buke
Rautins

Well, it would still be a competitive squad, but not a contender, and we would retain NO flexibility to improve the team. I hate this trade and do not want Melo before the deadline.

Isaiah, come out, come out wherever you are, I can smell your meddling all over this!

AnubisADL
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10/20/2010  9:50 AM    LAST EDITED: 10/20/2010  9:51 AM
ESPN.com's Chris Sheridan reports the Knicks still have Carmelo Anthony in their sights and are willing to send out Danilo Gallinari, Anthony Randolph, Eddy Curry and a future first round pick to land the small forward.

Sheridan is also reporting the Bulls remain in the mix for Anthony, although a deal may be tough since Joakim Noah is not available.

Anthony told FanHouse that he expects to be with the Nuggets when their season tips off next week.

"I'm pretty sure I will," Anthony said. "That"s a week from now. I'm here now."

Anthony has refused to sign an extension with Denver, but he says he'd consider re-signing with them.

"Yeah. That's keeping my options open," Anthony said. "Yeah (it's an option). When that time comes, we'll discuss that."

Source: http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/features/rumors

Oh yea that's what Im talking about.

NY Knicks - Retirement home for players and GMs
Moonangie
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10/20/2010  9:51 AM
AnubisADL wrote:
Childs2Dudley wrote:
AnubisADL wrote:


Carmelo to NY BABY!!!!!!!!

The legendary Isiah fan and supporter of such players as Allen Iverson and Gilbert Arenas is cheering for this move. Good stuff.

We are still getting Carmelo. Booyah!

Holy shyte, that's funny!

kingofelpaso
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10/20/2010  9:51 AM
I'll stop lurking and speak out against any Melo trade that would include shipping out any more of 2 of Gallo, AR, Chandler, Douglas and/or Mozgov.

There needs to be a differentiation between the Knicks becoming a merely a playoff team and a team that is capable of contending for a championship. I agree with the vast majority of posters who state that a line up that includes Amare, Melo, Felton and a variety of our remaining players can certainly get the Knicks into the playoffs.

However, can anyone say that that kind of a trade makes the Knicks contenders on par with Miami, Orlando or Boston?

Think for a second about the ability to bring a player like Gallo off the bench for an added scoring punch once Melo and Amare sit down to rest. Teams that are that deep are the kind of teams that win championships.

If everyone understands that Melo cannot be forced to sign an extension with a team he doesnt want to play for and he wants to play for the Knicks, isnt he holding all the cards? I'm with Briggs on this one, lets wait things out and not ruin our chances at becoming a championship caliber team to be the 5th seed

ESPN: Knicks make significant progress on Carmelo trade

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