Vmart wrote:I have a question for you what do you want Melo in NY or stay the course and watch Amare suffer and fate of dealing with rebuilding in his prime years?

But that's not really the premise, is it? You have totally ignored everything that GodSaveTheKnicks has written. It's about getting Melo without giving up assets, thereby using those assets to get that elusive 3rd player (hello CP3 or Deron).

GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:TMS:

YOU would trade Pau or Brook Lopez in a heartbeat

Well why aren't Mitch Kupchak and whoever the hell runs the Nets running to the phone with an offer? Are the guys who run these teams "insane" ?

Chicago wouldn't part with Noah. Is their GM "insane" ?

As for the whole oh Brook Lopez thing..I am so tired of people using the whole oh where did his team finish argument in judging his worth.

It's makes as much sense as me saying "Oh Melo never even got to the WCF so he sucks"

Speaking of illogical statements..Dude you just said

TMS " Melo is easily in my top 10 list of players in the NBA..." followed by "yeah i'm sure i can come up with a list of 10 guys i'd rather have than Melo"

Seriously?? He's a top 10 player but you could come up with a list of 10 guys you'd rather have? Your words. Not mine.

If all you meant to say was "Melo is the best player we've ever had a chance of obtaining since I've been a fan" then fine, I'd say yeah I agree.

Again I think Melo is probably one of the best basketball players on the planet but your posts are becoming increasing illogical and it doesn't even seem like we're having the same conversation.

I say Melo is a fantastic player, I just don't know if he's a 1st tier superstar.

You respond with YOU CAN'T PASS UP ON CARMELO BECAUSE YOU'RE AFRAID OF GIVING UP ANTHONY RANDOLPH. GIMME A FRIKKIN BREAK.

Where in this post do I say anything about being unwilling to give up Anthony Randolph?

TMS/VMart

I asked 2 simple questions not to be facetious or as rhetorical questions. You guys obviously have the same problem as I do. Caring way too much about basketball in general and the Knicks specifically and I was interested in your opinions. But both of you were too busy going into WE HAVE TO TRADE FOR CARMELO STUPID mode to address them:

1. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/All-NBA_Team#1988.E2.80.9389_to_present

This is a list of every all NBA selection for the last 22 years. How many years can you find where Melo's best season in his 7 season in the league is better than one of these guys?

2. Who's on your list of Superstars in the league this season? How many people are on it?

If I didn't make it clear the first time around

You can believe that Melo is worth trading for and paying the max to

You can also believe that he's not a superstar.
You can believe that there are better fits for certain teams in the league. The Lakers need a guy with Pau's skill set WAY more than they need a scorer. Chicago needs someone with Noah's skill set because they already went out and got a scorer in Boozer.

maybe i should have explained myself better... i can come up with a list of 10 players i'd rather have than Melo, but that doesn't mean Melo's not in my top 10 list of NBA talent... i'd rather have certain guys based on this team's need & based on how i think they could fit in on this team... just to explain, i'd probably rather have Derrick Rose over Melo but i think Melo is a better player than Rose... our chances of getting Derrick Rose are zero so i don't bother discussing it... that doesn't mean i think Melo is not a top 10 player in the NBA... i already said i did.

as for why i bring up Anthony Randolph, the entire argument i've been having with people against going after Melo in a trade is because they're afraid of giving up any significant future assets to do it... now if you're not in that camp then i have no idea what you're arguing with me over... if you feel Melo is worth any package of assets that the Knicks can put together then i fail to see your objection to anything myself or VMart are saying here... in fact, i've stated many times i'm NOT willing to give up every asset we own to obtain Melo in a trade... i've said i think he's easily worth giving up AR or Gallo & some other pieces to get him tho... do i think Chicago is crazy not to want to give up Noah in a trade for Melo? yeah, i actually do, but whatever, i'm not being paid to make these decisions, i'm just a fan of basketball who's stating his opinion on a basketball forum, same as you & everyone else on this forum... none of what i'm saying makes me a FANBOY of Carmelo Anthony & i think anyone who wants to place labels on people for having an opinion is not worth debating with anyway... i actually don't much care for him that much at all ever since the fight at MSG, but i do recognize talent when i see it & i call it like i see it.

Anji wrote:GodSaveTheKnicks your views seems to be a little jaded so I will already say that i am wrong to get it out out the way.

First,not wanting to to trade player X for Melo doesn't mean Melo isn't better. It's plainly obvious that Melo being in the last year of his deal is a factor. Another factor is that out side of 2 or 3 players most GMs aren't trading their young star for another. Outside of Kobe and Lebron, who is Chitown trading Rose for???? So that is clearly a flawed way of reasoning a players worth. Years, pay scale, the fact that the team drafted said player............ ect.

The All NBA "What player did Melo have a better season than" argument is also very very flawed. Most because he is not even in competition for 3-4 of the spots. On top of that there is the fact that the people that vote for this can make any rules the want for the guards and Forwards. So why should being that any year were you have a "Dirk has to be 1st team" even though they already named Duncan or Garrett at the 4, have any baring on Melo's value or his superstar status??? Was Dirk the best Small forward in 07??? Is it Deron Williams fault that Wade and Kobe have to make First team???? Doesn't mean he is the third or Fourth best point guard??? Laughable.

Melo is clearly is top 10 player, whether you call that tier two or what ever phrase is out there, doesn't really change the impact of being in the group behind 3 all-time players in Kobe LBJ and Wade. I personally feel Melo is Number 4 or 5, and for a team that has no wing stars a player the knicks should be willing to trade the house for.............. but seeing as he is in his last year we don't have to trade anything.

1LbJ
2Kobe
3Wade
4Howard(most would go with the center even though he is more flawed offensively than Melo is defensively)
5Melo
6Bosh
7Dirk
8Durant
( Personally think there is alot of nut riding going on with Durant, 1 post in a young career, above has been there already)
9Deron(Healthy Paul)
10Nash(or Amare or Duncan even though he is aging)

What exactly am I jaded about?

I was saying that I don't think Kupchak would trade Pau for Melo even if Melo agreed to extend with the Lakers. You do make valid points about my logic. First team all NBA appearances and even Would this GM trade Player X for Melo aren't the greatest way to judge his worth.

So, what is an acceptable way to judge the value of a player against other players?

For example:

I think Melo is better than Durant because ___________________ . How do you finish that sentence?

And yes. He is in the last year of his contract so we don't have to trade anything for him, unless of course Melo says he's willing to extend elsewhere. In which case we still may have no shot over other teams if they're willing to part with talent Denver deems better than what the Knicks have.

Vmart wrote:

TheSage wrote:If we can package AR and/or Chandler and Curry without giving up Gallo I will take it. AR is a PROJECT-he still has to learn to play on a TEAM. Yes he has unlimited POTENTIAL but a Team with Melo and Amare is NOW-maybe not championship until we show we have a reliable point but solid playoff team.

Spoken like the Sage you are.

Would you guys explain what positions Melo and Gallo will play?