BRIGGS wrote:

rvwink wrote:You are real good at recognizing athletic talent, and evaluating stats, but could you perhaps explain why you almost never discuss a player's intangible contributions to the team? For example, don't you think that Turiaf is our best interior defender, and an extremely valuable contributor on the nights where teams are scoring down low against us virtually at will. Additional scoring from the center position, seems less critical to our future success, then strengthening our interior defense with Turiaf, plus he is a valuable locker room guy, and a maximum efforts guy when on the court.

Thats all good and dandy--but RT is not a starting 5 in this league--a talent based league. If the Knicks could trade for Zach Randolph using EC contract--would you do it for the year at c even though Zach is not defensive minded not a true C and a rah rah energy guy like RT? of course anyone his talent outweighs the intangibles were a scoring based team and RT is not a scorer nor is he adept at pulling down boards. we haev shot blockers Mosgov and randolph who could interchange with what we have.

I agree its a talent based league, but the Knicks finally have some of that. Its also a league where its key to surround talent with the kind of role players that will maximize that. Anytime Turiaf is in the game it means Amare has to guard the lesser of the frontcourt players. That translates into less energy expended by our primary scorer which I like very much.

There is nothing impressive about RT, but I'm sold on and commited to developing Mosgov. I think you should see RT at the start of games for about 15 minutes a night. Mosgov should get 20 foul trouble allowing. The other dozen or more should go to Amare/AR when we are going smaller.

Turiaf is a good pro, a good lockerroom guy and an effective defensive player. He's a good help defender (Amare's weakness) and a good shot blocker. He's an average rebounder at best and thats a concern, so we will have to see how that plays out.

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

rvwink wrote:You are real good at recognizing athletic talent, and evaluating stats, but could you perhaps explain why you almost never discuss a player's intangible contributions to the team? For example, don't you think that Turiaf is our best interior defender, and an extremely valuable contributor on the nights where teams are scoring down low against us virtually at will. Additional scoring from the center position, seems less critical to our future success, then strengthening our interior defense with Turiaf, plus he is a valuable locker room guy, and a maximum efforts guy when on the court.

Thats all good and dandy--but RT is not a starting 5 in this league--a talent based league. If the Knicks could trade for Zach Randolph using EC contract--would you do it for the year at c even though Zach is not defensive minded not a true C and a rah rah energy guy like RT? of course anyone his talent outweighs the intangibles were a scoring based team and RT is not a scorer nor is he adept at pulling down boards. we haev shot blockers Mosgov and randolph who could interchange with what we have.

actually no... I wouldnt do that trade. Not for a minute.

I agree its a talent based league, but the Knicks finally have some of that. Its also a league where its key to surround talent with the kind of role players that will maximize that. Anytime Turiaf is in the game it means Amare has to guard the lesser of the frontcourt players. That translates into less energy expended by our primary scorer which I like very much.

There is nothing impressive about RT, but I'm sold on and commited to developing Mosgov. I think you should see RT at the start of games for about 15 minutes a night. Mosgov should get 20 foul trouble allowing. The other dozen or more should go to Amare/AR when we are going smaller.

Turiaf is a good pro, a good lockerroom guy and an effective defensive player. He's a good help defender (Amare's weakness) and a good shot blocker. He's an average rebounder at best and thats a concern, so we will have to see how that plays out.

I like mosgov to but for this year Id rather haev Z randolph than Turriaf

If Mosgov gets 20mpg he will give you 10ppg, 8rpg, 1.5 blocks, 1 steal, 3fouls and be an impact on defense. Whether Turiaf starts or no doesnt matter. I want to know if Mosgov is going to be a staring C on a playoff team in this league and I want to know this year. He knows how to play. He just needs to know how to play here. Ive seen him hit jumpers, block shots, play good m2m defense, help, box out, crash the offensive glass and dribble and pass in the high post.

To me bringing him along slow is off the bench for about 20mpg, but if we are going to be an elite team anytime soon this guy is going to be a big xfactor in that.

The guys who like this team are focused on Amare/AR/Gallo, but if we have a 7'1 skilled true post center to put next to Amare with AR off the bench THATS your perfect situation. Keep Gallo at the 3 for 35+ minutes to spread the floor. Play Mos/Ar/Amare at the 4/5.

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

fishmike wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:

rvwink wrote:You are real good at recognizing athletic talent, and evaluating stats, but could you perhaps explain why you almost never discuss a player's intangible contributions to the team? For example, don't you think that Turiaf is our best interior defender, and an extremely valuable contributor on the nights where teams are scoring down low against us virtually at will. Additional scoring from the center position, seems less critical to our future success, then strengthening our interior defense with Turiaf, plus he is a valuable locker room guy, and a maximum efforts guy when on the court.

Thats all good and dandy--but RT is not a starting 5 in this league--a talent based league. If the Knicks could trade for Zach Randolph using EC contract--would you do it for the year at c even though Zach is not defensive minded not a true C and a rah rah energy guy like RT? of course anyone his talent outweighs the intangibles were a scoring based team and RT is not a scorer nor is he adept at pulling down boards. we haev shot blockers Mosgov and randolph who could interchange with what we have.

actually no... I wouldnt do that trade. Not for a minute.

I agree its a talent based league, but the Knicks finally have some of that. Its also a league where its key to surround talent with the kind of role players that will maximize that. Anytime Turiaf is in the game it means Amare has to guard the lesser of the frontcourt players. That translates into less energy expended by our primary scorer which I like very much.

There is nothing impressive about RT, but I'm sold on and commited to developing Mosgov. I think you should see RT at the start of games for about 15 minutes a night. Mosgov should get 20 foul trouble allowing. The other dozen or more should go to Amare/AR when we are going smaller.

Turiaf is a good pro, a good lockerroom guy and an effective defensive player. He's a good help defender (Amare's weakness) and a good shot blocker. He's an average rebounder at best and thats a concern, so we will have to see how that plays out.

I like mosgov to but for this year Id rather haev Z randolph than Turriaf

Zach can rebound but he needs shot to be effective. Thats a poor pairing next to Amare. At one point we talked about Lee + Amare but Lee is a great passer, rebounder and jumpshooter. He doesnt need shots to be a good player. Also Zach is going to play 35 mpg. Where does that leave Mosgov? Mosgov should get as many minutes as his motor and foul total allow. My guess is thats about 20.

If Mosgov gets 20mpg he will give you 10ppg, 8rpg, 1.5 blocks, 1 steal, 3fouls and be an impact on defense. Whether Turiaf starts or no doesnt matter. I want to know if Mosgov is going to be a staring C on a playoff team in this league and I want to know this year. He knows how to play. He just needs to know how to play here. Ive seen him hit jumpers, block shots, play good m2m defense, help, box out, crash the offensive glass and dribble and pass in the high post.

To me bringing him along slow is off the bench for about 20mpg, but if we are going to be an elite team anytime soon this guy is going to be a big xfactor in that.

The guys who like this team are focused on Amare/AR/Gallo, but if we have a 7'1 skilled true post center to put next to Amare with AR off the bench THATS your perfect situation. Keep Gallo at the 3 for 35+ minutes to spread the floor. Play Mos/Ar/Amare at the 4/5.

Not only that, but ZBo is a black hole, knuckle head player, and we just got past that era.
Can we stay knuckle-head free for just one year, please?

Lets say Donnie didn't bring Barron back because Earl's asking price was too high. Don't you think that Barron's "asking price" is "due" to drop around the time that the season actually starts? (Since Earl has already played some games for the Knicks, his attending our preseason camp seems much less critical to me.

Donnie seems to to me to be a patient man. If he wants Earl for less money, it would seem like he may be available for a lesser price around opening day. Then will know if how much Earl asked for was the "deal killer".

I don't think that sentence is relevant to this situation. This is about our ability to clear cap space. Specifically we can't afford to let Earl Barron's contract negatively affect our future ability to sign Chris Paul or Melo.

We got simply destroyed on the boards. Lets see what Mike does. After just one game the TOs got much better. Obviously we started very good, but Roger Mason was our leading rebounder with 6.

We have size, its up to see if the coaching staff can get this group to clean the glass. If they cant then I am looking at getting Reggie Evans in here. One guy who will will rebound is Fields.

Like I said.. this is what the preseason is for, to figure these things out.

Making decisions too quickly frequently results in errors. While its also true that you admit your mistakes promptly, why not "sit on your hands a bit" and gather more data points before making your initial decision. In Paris, Rautins appeared to be a different player than he showed he was in summer league. Also A rumor has also emerged that he may have had a bad wheel in Summer League. Then there is Toni Douglas and Timofey Mosgov. Perhaps if you waited longer, you would be more likely to gets things right the first time. Is higher initial accuracy worth waiting for Briggs?

BRIGGS wrote:

BRIGGS wrote:We really could use Earl Barron. Im not sold on Ronnie Turriaf in anyway shape or form. He has never been a good rebounder --he cant shoot and I think what he does give--we can get much better from elsewhere. We need another guy who can rebound and play be able to hit the mid range and play BIG. Id rather start Mosgov and bring Barron off the bench of vice versa. I dont see Turriaf at all.

wait dont let me forget Rautins--between rautins PJ and willaims--we need another big and one cna stay--we don't need empty roster spots. we need a big

Still not seeing turriaf at all. He s been bad and compounds it by getting killed on the boards. Time to bring back earl the perla Barron. We dont need a star next to Amare we need someone who can hit a J and rebound. Timo is good off the bench still have time to get Barron acclimated here.

Instead of making all these posts about needing Barron you should do the leg work of finding him or his agent - then contact Walsh and ask to schedule a meeting in which you present all these great opportunities of resigning Barron. Seems like a better use of your time.