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Walsh having doubts about the TMac - JJ trade with Houston.
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sisqo8
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9/23/2010  10:00 AM
i think donnie saying this was not exactly what it is set out to be... we all know donnie cant talk to carmelo directly.... but i think this was put out there for him to see... it seems that melo was getting frustrated with the knicks about not meeting denvers demands for him... this is donnies way of telling melo we want you it is just that denver is asking for what we dont have ...painting the knicks as the "bad guy" without this trade amare prob does not sighn with us knowing he is the only player coming in .... i dont see him agreeing to it no matter we offer that 5th year or not ... just a thought ... tell me what you think....
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martin
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9/23/2010  10:05 AM
sisqo8 wrote:i think donnie saying this was not exactly what it is set out to be... we all know donnie cant talk to carmelo directly.... but i think this was put out there for him to see... it seems that melo was getting frustrated with the knicks about not meeting denvers demands for him... this is donnies way of telling melo we want you it is just that denver is asking for what we dont have ...painting the knicks as the "bad guy" without this trade amare prob does not sighn with us knowing he is the only player coming in .... i dont see him agreeing to it no matter we offer that 5th year or not ... just a thought ... tell me what you think....

I think i have the Thong Song running through my head

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SupremeCommander
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9/23/2010  10:07 AM
martin wrote:
sisqo8 wrote:i think donnie saying this was not exactly what it is set out to be... we all know donnie cant talk to carmelo directly.... but i think this was put out there for him to see... it seems that melo was getting frustrated with the knicks about not meeting denvers demands for him... this is donnies way of telling melo we want you it is just that denver is asking for what we dont have ...painting the knicks as the "bad guy" without this trade amare prob does not sighn with us knowing he is the only player coming in .... i dont see him agreeing to it no matter we offer that 5th year or not ... just a thought ... tell me what you think....

I think i have the Thong Song running through my head

I have the muted video stuck in mine

DLeethal wrote: Lol Rick needs a safe space
sisqo8
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9/23/2010  10:09 AM
i think thats a problem you should keep to yourself the next time ....lol
Vmart
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9/23/2010  10:13 AM    LAST EDITED: 9/23/2010  10:14 AM
iSergio wrote:The summer of 2010 was LeCon or bust. That's why Donnie Walsh made the Tracy McGrady trade. To have enough room for LeCon and his sidekick. Some of you can try to spin it any way you want but the summer was a HUGE disappointment. Instead of having the best player in the league and a 55+ win team the next 5 years, we're still an unknown with no guarantee of making the Playoffs.

I agree with you. It was a good move on Walsh's part to make the deal to create cap space for two superstars. But the reason for that was for two superstars to put the Knicks into the elite category, not to be a team fighting with unknowns and for a birth into the playoffs. The purpose of the cap clearing was to be guaranteed playoffs and a shot at the championship. It truly was a failure of a summer at least Amare is here.
fishmike
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9/23/2010  10:33 AM
Vmart wrote:
iSergio wrote:The summer of 2010 was LeCon or bust. That's why Donnie Walsh made the Tracy McGrady trade. To have enough room for LeCon and his sidekick. Some of you can try to spin it any way you want but the summer was a HUGE disappointment. Instead of having the best player in the league and a 55+ win team the next 5 years, we're still an unknown with no guarantee of making the Playoffs.

I agree with you. It was a good move on Walsh's part to make the deal to create cap space for two superstars. But the reason for that was for two superstars to put the Knicks into the elite category, not to be a team fighting with unknowns and for a birth into the playoffs. The purpose of the cap clearing was to be guaranteed playoffs and a shot at the championship. It truly was a failure of a summer at least Amare is here.

you guys crack me up. Its like having a losing team, and instead of winning 30 games you tank and win 20. Then you call that a disaster because you didnt win the lottery.

Let me ask you this: what are we if we dont do that TMac trade? What is our team? We have Jordan Hill and Jarred Jeffries. Then what are we? Certainly not a better team than we are now so what is your beef? Maybe then Walsh gets a better grade because its still another year of cleaning Isiah's mess up?

VMart and Sergio.. your bitching but neither make any sense. Are you say Jordan Hill was going to be a star? That we were a playoff team this year if he have JJ + Hill?

Obviously Lebron is the crown jewel of the 2010 market, but there were a ton of other options as well. At the end of that day that trade = JJ, Hill, 2012 (top 5 protected) and 2011 switch for Turiaf, Azu and Randolph. I would have made that trade last year regardless so whats your point?

Its like the freakin Chewbacca defense with you guys (look it up on wikipedia). What exactly are you saying?

"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
GodSaveTheKnicks
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9/23/2010  11:06 AM
I thought this horse was already beaten to death months ago.
Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
CrushAlot
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9/23/2010  11:46 AM
I never liked the deal and I thought Walsh was too smart to make it. I still wonder if Dolan didn't push Walsh to make that trade.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
Moonangie
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9/23/2010  11:49 AM
Hindsight is 20-20, but at the time he made the Fishlips deal he had no choice. It was Lebron James we were targetting, a once-in-a-generation type of player. With even a hint of a chance at landing that caliber franchise player, we had to set ourselves up for a shot. So we missed.

But how can anyone be upset with what Donnie put together for us this season? And we still have a max-slot for next summer. Damn, some people will just never be satisfied.
Markji
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9/23/2010  12:29 PM
CrushAlot wrote:I never liked the deal and I thought Walsh was too smart to make it. I still wonder if Dolan didn't push Walsh to make that trade.

Crush - I totally agree that it must have been Dolan making that trade. There were a few of us (I believe TMS was another) who went ballistic when Houston shafted us in that trade. It was never about making the trade, it was about how much we gave up. Giving up the 2012 #1 pick is now biting us in the ass.
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
loweyecue
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9/23/2010  12:43 PM
I totally supported the trade and I still do. Given the information available at that time and the chance to lure Lebron with a second max player was the perfect thing to go for. Lebron's actions show he badly wanted other max players on the team. And Pat Riley went a step further and managed to get two max players. DW had his hands tied with Curry's contract otherwise we would have had the Miami trio as Knicks by now. Walsh did everything right, the chips didn't fall his way. Time to move on. OR go ahead and fret about it for the next 12 years. Some people can't deal with the consequences of taking risks but for my part I am completely supportive of that trade and will be always.
TKF on Melo ::....he is a punk, a jerk, a self absorbed out of shape, self aggrandizing, unprofessional, volume chucking coach killing playoff loser!!
CrushAlot
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9/23/2010  2:04 PM
Markji wrote:
CrushAlot wrote:I never liked the deal and I thought Walsh was too smart to make it. I still wonder if Dolan didn't push Walsh to make that trade.

Crush - I totally agree that it must have been Dolan making that trade. There were a few of us (I believe TMS was another) who went ballistic when Houston shafted us in that trade. It was never about making the trade, it was about how much we gave up. Giving up the 2012 #1 pick is now biting us in the ass.
I didn't stop dwelling on that trade until Walsh did the Lee sign and trade. I still think it will haunt the franchise for a long time.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
GodSaveTheKnicks
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9/23/2010  2:12 PM
If Walsh had not done the trade, we still wouldn't have signed Lebron and you'd have TONS of people pissing and moaning about how we were unwilling to give up draft picks to get THE KING!

right?

Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
alau53
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9/23/2010  7:41 PM
it looks like donnie was schooled by pat reily..reily could have traded beasley in mid season to open up cap space for another max fa..but he was smart and waited to make that deal after the season when he knew he was able to get lebron and bosch..why couldnt donnie just wait and do what reily did and open space by trading 1st rd picks, j hil and expiring jeffries contract when he has a deal with lebron/bosch in place..this way even if lebron went elsewhwere the knicks would stil have the valuable aforementioned assets for a trade down the road for carmello or paul etc
sidsanders
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9/23/2010  7:51 PM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:If Walsh had not done the trade, we still wouldn't have signed Lebron and you'd have TONS of people pissing and moaning about how we were unwilling to give up draft picks to get THE KING!

right?

i dont see it that way. if things played out the same (rigged deal to mia), how could you complain about not giving up players/picks for something that had no chance? that doesnt imply we should have done zip, made no other trades, etc...

GO TEAM VENTURE!!!!!
CrushAlot
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9/23/2010  8:18 PM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:If Walsh had not done the trade, we still wouldn't have signed Lebron and you'd have TONS of people pissing and moaning about how we were unwilling to give up draft picks to get THE KING!

right?

I disagree. He gave up the teams 2009 lottery pick, swapped picks for this coming year and gave up the 2012 first round pick. He should be second guessing himself and the fact that a team can't trade its first round pick two years in a row is part of the reason Denver is not interested in what the Knicks are offering. The next pick the Knicks own that they can trade is 2014.
I'm tired,I'm tired, I'm so tired right now......Kristaps Porzingis 1/3/18
kam77
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9/23/2010  11:14 PM
Yeah its disappointing that we got bent over by HOUSTON and still did't get LeBron ...

But that was the price DW paid to get into the Lebron sweepstakes.

I didn't like it. But i understood it and ultimately we had to do it.

It didn't work out. Well Hello... that's life.

Nothing is guaranteed. But you gotta be in it to win it.

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
Markji
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9/23/2010  11:31 PM
kam77 wrote:Yeah its disappointing that we got bent over by HOUSTON and still did't get LeBron ...

But that was the price DW paid to get into the Lebron sweepstakes.

I didn't like it. But i understood it and ultimately we had to do it.

It didn't work out. Well Hello... that's life.

Nothing is guaranteed. But you gotta be in it to win it.


Yeah, but we paid $100 for a $1 ticket. That is the problem.
The difference between fiction and reality? Fiction has to make sense. Tom Clancy - author
franco12
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9/24/2010  12:35 AM
I'm forgetting what Plan C was, partly because Plan B has turned out surprisingly well.

However, the reason I argued against the trade was that even with how things have turned out for us, we're I think going to be stuck in a middle ground for a while.

Improved, and that's a great relief, but not able to take the next step towards being a championship caliber team.

Plan C was to trade away our long contracts, but not at any cost and not necessarily for ending contracts. Suck it up and stink the joint up and end up with some top picks that we would use to build a solid foundation, and hopefully land a clear cut top rate talent- something that Amare, Chandler, Gallo, AZ and Melo aren't.

Don't get me wrong, Plan B has worked out well- I just worry about the kind of 1 more piece moves Dolan could make in a panic, including bringing Isiah back to muck things up.
kam77
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9/24/2010  12:57 AM
Markji wrote:
kam77 wrote:Yeah its disappointing that we got bent over by HOUSTON and still did't get LeBron ...

But that was the price DW paid to get into the Lebron sweepstakes.

I didn't like it. But i understood it and ultimately we had to do it.

It didn't work out. Well Hello... that's life.

Nothing is guaranteed. But you gotta be in it to win it.


Yeah, but we paid $100 for a $1 ticket. That is the problem.

We knew that was was could happen going in. Our haul wasn't LeBron_Bosh $100 but Amare-Felton-AR aint just a dollar. (You gotta set the floor at at least $50 and then we could argue about something it between 50 and 100.)

When we lost the sweepstakes, we cashed in Lee for something, which we could not have done AND still gotten Felton had we not opened up the money. We didn't spend foolishly IMO. And we still have cap flex.

lol @ being BANNED by Martin since 11/07/10 (for asking if Mr. Earl had a point). Really, Martin? C'mon. This is the internet. I've seen much worse on this site. By Earl himself. Drop the hypocrisy.
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Walsh having doubts about the TMac - JJ trade with Houston.
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