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Put TD & Walker into the starting rotation for the rest of the season
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TMS
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3/15/2010  9:29 PM
another great game by Toney Douglas tonight... outplayed Jrue Holiday who people said we missed the boat on... looks like Donnie Walsh found himself a pretty nice young G we should be excited about afterall.
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CrushAlot
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3/15/2010  9:34 PM
TMS wrote:another great game by Toney Douglas tonight... outplayed Jrue Holiday who people said we missed the boat on... looks like Donnie Walsh found himself a pretty nice young G we should be excited about afterall.
Its too bad it took Donnie traveling with the team before Toney got his chance.
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Paladin55
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3/15/2010  9:36 PM
TMS wrote:another great game by Toney Douglas tonight... outplayed Jrue Holiday who people said we missed the boat on... looks like Donnie Walsh found himself a pretty nice young G we should be excited about afterall.

Looking more and more like a PG, and not the SG some thought he was. Showed ability to get to the basket with his right or left hand, too.

Still needs work as a PG, but I think he has the ability and the brains (you know the effort has never been an issue) to succeed.

It will be interesting to see if MDA can do the "Nashentein" operation on his head and make him into the PG he wants running the team.

No man is happy without a delusion of some kind. Delusions are as necessary to our happiness as realities- C.N. Bovee
TMS
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3/15/2010  9:42 PM
CrushAlot wrote:
TMS wrote:another great game by Toney Douglas tonight... outplayed Jrue Holiday who people said we missed the boat on... looks like Donnie Walsh found himself a pretty nice young G we should be excited about afterall.
Its too bad it took Donnie traveling with the team before Toney got his chance.

can't understand why the guys Donnie brought in weren't afforded more of a chance this season... if the GM & head coach are really on the same page, u'd think we would have seen TD & Jordan Hill get a lot more burn this season.

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3/15/2010  9:45 PM
He has definitely made a great deal of progress. His confidence always good is growing. Stroke us nice of late and I don't see him picking up his dribble. Much smoother at controling the pace.
Bill Simmons on Tyreke Evans "The prototypical 0-guard: Someone who handles the ball all the time, looks for his own shot, gets to the rim at will and operates best if his teammates spread the floor to watch him."
TMS
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3/15/2010  9:45 PM
Paladin55 wrote:
TMS wrote:another great game by Toney Douglas tonight... outplayed Jrue Holiday who people said we missed the boat on... looks like Donnie Walsh found himself a pretty nice young G we should be excited about afterall.

Looking more and more like a PG, and not the SG some thought he was. Showed ability to get to the basket with his right or left hand, too.

Still needs work as a PG, but I think he has the ability and the brains (you know the effort has never been an issue) to succeed.

It will be interesting to see if MDA can do the "Nashentein" operation on his head and make him into the PG he wants running the team.

i'm liking Douglas at the point more & more but i still think we need an orchestrator on the floor if we want to compete next season... he is learning more & more how to run the offense but i don't want to rely on him to be the driver of this offense the entire game next year... having a wing player like Lebron or Wade to run the offense through would allow TD to expend a lot more energy playing ball hawking defense which really is when he's at his best.

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Paladin55
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3/15/2010  9:56 PM
TMS wrote:
Paladin55 wrote:
TMS wrote:another great game by Toney Douglas tonight... outplayed Jrue Holiday who people said we missed the boat on... looks like Donnie Walsh found himself a pretty nice young G we should be excited about afterall.

Looking more and more like a PG, and not the SG some thought he was. Showed ability to get to the basket with his right or left hand, too.

Still needs work as a PG, but I think he has the ability and the brains (you know the effort has never been an issue) to succeed.

It will be interesting to see if MDA can do the "Nashentein" operation on his head and make him into the PG he wants running the team.

i'm liking Douglas at the point more & more but i still think we need an orchestrator on the floor if we want to compete next season... he is learning more & more how to run the offense but i don't want to rely on him to be the driver of this offense the entire game next year... having a wing player like Lebron or Wade to run the offense through would allow TD to expend a lot more energy playing ball hawking defense which really is when he's at his best.


Yeah... James or Wade would change the role of a Douglas. I think he has the ability to play the BJ Armstrong/Derrick Fisher role quite well, though.
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TMS
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3/15/2010  10:06 PM
agreed, his perimeter J is good enough for him to be a danger when left uncovered on the perimeter... i like his aggressiveness going to the hole too, he's not as out of control as Sergio seems to be on his drives into the lane... the kid's energy is infectious, u can see every one else pick up their games on D when he's out there hustling after loose balls & running hard through picks.
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Finestrg
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3/15/2010  11:11 PM
Man, three in a row now for TD. Kid's a player. Terrific 2nd half effort tonight on both sides of the ball...I tell ya what man, remember when TD had that nice pre-season game against the Nets where he sealed the win with that unbelievable 4th quarter drive and twisting, acrobatic finish at the rim? Remember that game? That pretty much sold me right there. If I were the coach, I would've found a way to get this kid in the lineup from day 1. Imagine if D'Antoni had done that -- how much further along this kid would look right now? And how much better the team could've been?? Hard to put a number on it but shoot, if Douglas and Hill were part of the rotation right from the start, good possibility were could've been +10 more wins right now, maybe more..Douglas practically won the last 2 games all by himself...Ahh, what if I guess right? Makes you think though... Unfortunately Mike didn't see it that way. Never too late and I'm glad he's playing now but with the risk of sounding like a broken record, he really should've been playing all along. We were never that good a team for Douglas and Hill to be left on the outside looking in for so long - the rest of our crumby players pretty much proved that. A shame really. Hey Utah fans, thank Mike D'Antoni for your lottery pick!!
TMS
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3/16/2010  12:26 AM
could not possibly have been worse off this year by playing him & Hill regular minutes from the very beginning... those 2 kids could have been valuable assets to have at the trade deadline, probably not have to end up giving away as much as we did to dump Fishlips' contract at the very least... TD looks to be a keeper & even if the plan was to keep his value low so other teams wouldn't demand him in trades, he should have gotten regular burn as soon as the trade deadline passed, but that didn't happen until just this past week.

i'm happy to see him making the most of his opportunity, kid is a hard worker & deserves an extended look for the rest of the season regardless if he struggles or not the rest of the way... really no excuse he hasn't been playing all year but it is what it is.

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martin
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3/16/2010  11:07 AM
TMS wrote:could not possibly have been worse off this year by playing him & Hill regular minutes from the very beginning... those 2 kids could have been valuable assets to have at the trade deadline, probably not have to end up giving away as much as we did to dump Fishlips' contract at the very least... TD looks to be a keeper & even if the plan was to keep his value low so other teams wouldn't demand him in trades, he should have gotten regular burn as soon as the trade deadline passed, but that didn't happen until just this past week.

i'm happy to see him making the most of his opportunity, kid is a hard worker & deserves an extended look for the rest of the season regardless if he struggles or not the rest of the way... really no excuse he hasn't been playing all year but it is what it is.

good read, takes a different angle then your "should have been playing all year" mantra.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/the-knicks-fix-1.812055


The ultimate compliment for Toney Douglas

It was a simple comment made by Mike D'Antoni after Monday's win over the 76ers, which gave their Knicks their first winning streak since early January. These kind of things usually are received with nods, a few scribbles and then disappear into memory as the next question is posed.

But as a sound bite, it is the highest praise a coach can give to a player, especially a rookie.

"When he was on the floor," D'Antoni said of Toney Douglas, "we were better."

Isn't that the idea?

After yet another strong game by Douglas, so late in a lost season that saw the Knicks desperately need an improvement at the point guard position, it's very human to wonder just why the hell was this kid buried on the bench all season?

But let's not have such short-term memory. Douglas was given looks at various spots between his brief stint as a starter in November (where he absolutely struggled to run the offense) to this point. Several times I made reference to the fact that when Douglas did get into games, he didn't bring a great deal of intensity and spent too much time being polite. It happens sometimes with rookies. They step into a game with this ridiculous idea in their heads about not doing too much.

You know the cliche, "Let the game come to you?" It's absolute bull.

Toney the Tiger had to figure that out on his own.

I was chatting with him before a recent home game, when he was still on the bench wondering when his next opportunity would come (and not complaining a peep about it), and brought this up to him. We were just talking basketball (if you haven't noticed, I like to do that with players) and as we debated why he wasn't getting much PT, I mentioned how it seemed like he was being too polite when he would come into games. I said, "You have to make people know you're in there."

Douglas nodded, smiled and said, "That won't be a problem."

He played OK for a little while once he did start to get some burn and quietly confided that because it had been so long since he had some real game action, it would take a while to get his wind. That's not an excuse, it's just reality. Douglas has put in extensive work on his own, with his shot and with his body. If you look at him now compared to Media Day, his shoulders are much broader and he's more muscular overall.

And in the second half in Memphis, it all started to click. Douglas saw Mike Conley pushing the pace in the first half and took it upon himself to pick up Conley sooner and get the Grizzlies out of their rhythm. By the fourth quarter, as Memphis started slowing down, Douglas started speeding up. It was too little, too late for that night, but it was the boost of confidence that he needed.

D'Antoni promoted him to the starting role and he's been outstanding in these first two games. He really got into Jason Kidd defensively and had three steals against the 76ers, including an explosive theft of Willie Green in the third quarter that would have had Mo Cheeks grinning. He also chased down a loose ball into the backcourt with the tenacity of a playoff game.

He pushed the pace on offense and continues to find his shot easily as defenses switch off and give him too much space. The pick-and-roll will come in time (David Lee's eight points and only six shot attempts is a direct result to less pick-and-roll calls these days) but he's seeing the lanes better. But while the P&R isn't as prominent in his playlist, the dribble drag on the wing, especially when Douglas exchanges with Danilo Gallinari, is starting to work extremely well. Take note: four of Douglas' seven assists against the 76ers went to Gallo.

Finally, you say. A point guard who actually looks for Gallinari.

So let's get back to that question: Why didn't D'Antoni play Toney sooner? Why didn't D'Antoni stick with him in November? Who cares what we think. We decided to ask Douglas if he feels he could have been doing in November all of what we see from him now. Or is he a different player now than he was then?

"Way different," Douglas said. "I learned a lot from playing, sitting on the bench and watching and working out all the time. Learning the pick and roll and reading the defense when I'm on the bench. Watching film. I feel like I'm going to continue to keep getting better as I go along."

And the Knicks should then continue to be better when he is on the floor.

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3/16/2010  11:47 AM
martin wrote:
TMS wrote:could not possibly have been worse off this year by playing him & Hill regular minutes from the very beginning... those 2 kids could have been valuable assets to have at the trade deadline, probably not have to end up giving away as much as we did to dump Fishlips' contract at the very least... TD looks to be a keeper & even if the plan was to keep his value low so other teams wouldn't demand him in trades, he should have gotten regular burn as soon as the trade deadline passed, but that didn't happen until just this past week.

i'm happy to see him making the most of his opportunity, kid is a hard worker & deserves an extended look for the rest of the season regardless if he struggles or not the rest of the way... really no excuse he hasn't been playing all year but it is what it is.

good read, takes a different angle then your "should have been playing all year" mantra.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/basketball/knicks/the-knicks-fix-1.812055


The ultimate compliment for Toney Douglas

It was a simple comment made by Mike D'Antoni after Monday's win over the 76ers, which gave their Knicks their first winning streak since early January. These kind of things usually are received with nods, a few scribbles and then disappear into memory as the next question is posed.

But as a sound bite, it is the highest praise a coach can give to a player, especially a rookie.

"When he was on the floor," D'Antoni said of Toney Douglas, "we were better."

Isn't that the idea?

After yet another strong game by Douglas, so late in a lost season that saw the Knicks desperately need an improvement at the point guard position, it's very human to wonder just why the hell was this kid buried on the bench all season?

But let's not have such short-term memory. Douglas was given looks at various spots between his brief stint as a starter in November (where he absolutely struggled to run the offense) to this point. Several times I made reference to the fact that when Douglas did get into games, he didn't bring a great deal of intensity and spent too much time being polite. It happens sometimes with rookies. They step into a game with this ridiculous idea in their heads about not doing too much.

You know the cliche, "Let the game come to you?" It's absolute bull.

Toney the Tiger had to figure that out on his own.

I was chatting with him before a recent home game, when he was still on the bench wondering when his next opportunity would come (and not complaining a peep about it), and brought this up to him. We were just talking basketball (if you haven't noticed, I like to do that with players) and as we debated why he wasn't getting much PT, I mentioned how it seemed like he was being too polite when he would come into games. I said, "You have to make people know you're in there."

Douglas nodded, smiled and said, "That won't be a problem."

He played OK for a little while once he did start to get some burn and quietly confided that because it had been so long since he had some real game action, it would take a while to get his wind. That's not an excuse, it's just reality. Douglas has put in extensive work on his own, with his shot and with his body. If you look at him now compared to Media Day, his shoulders are much broader and he's more muscular overall.

And in the second half in Memphis, it all started to click. Douglas saw Mike Conley pushing the pace in the first half and took it upon himself to pick up Conley sooner and get the Grizzlies out of their rhythm. By the fourth quarter, as Memphis started slowing down, Douglas started speeding up. It was too little, too late for that night, but it was the boost of confidence that he needed.

D'Antoni promoted him to the starting role and he's been outstanding in these first two games. He really got into Jason Kidd defensively and had three steals against the 76ers, including an explosive theft of Willie Green in the third quarter that would have had Mo Cheeks grinning. He also chased down a loose ball into the backcourt with the tenacity of a playoff game.

He pushed the pace on offense and continues to find his shot easily as defenses switch off and give him too much space. The pick-and-roll will come in time (David Lee's eight points and only six shot attempts is a direct result to less pick-and-roll calls these days) but he's seeing the lanes better. But while the P&R isn't as prominent in his playlist, the dribble drag on the wing, especially when Douglas exchanges with Danilo Gallinari, is starting to work extremely well. Take note: four of Douglas' seven assists against the 76ers went to Gallo.

Finally, you say. A point guard who actually looks for Gallinari.

So let's get back to that question: Why didn't D'Antoni play Toney sooner? Why didn't D'Antoni stick with him in November? Who cares what we think. We decided to ask Douglas if he feels he could have been doing in November all of what we see from him now. Or is he a different player now than he was then?

"Way different," Douglas said. "I learned a lot from playing, sitting on the bench and watching and working out all the time. Learning the pick and roll and reading the defense when I'm on the bench. Watching film. I feel like I'm going to continue to keep getting better as I go along."And the Knicks should then continue to be better when he is on the floor.


This really wont matter, Martin. People on here already have thier minds made up about MDA. It doesn't matter what Toney Douglas has to say, its all about what the people on here want and think. Some on here think Douglas was ready from day one and MDA purposely held him back, regardless of what Douglas thinks and says himself.

Marv
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3/16/2010  12:09 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/16/2010  12:11 PM
Martin, I went to the garden on November 9th for the utah game. Toney Douglas got 23 minutes of PT, shot 9-14, including 3-7 3’s. he had 21 points, 2 boards, an assist and 2 steals.

I went back 2 nights later for the game against Atlanta. He got 36 minutes, scored 23 points on 10-19 including 2-6 3’s, had 4 boards and an assist.

In both games he was by far the most impactful player in a knick uniform. he was a beast on defense, threw his body on the floor for every loose ball, pushed the pace and was very aggressive on offense. His teammates were all visibly galvanized by his time on the floor. And the garden was up and buzzing at his play.

It was the middle of a 4 game span where d’antoni gave him an average of 26 minutes per game. He responded with 19 ppg on 55% shooting and 45% of 3’s (9-20).

This was immediately followed by diminished PT that included 25 – that’s right 25 – DNP’s.

I agree that he’s playing the point much better now than he was earlier in the season.

I totally disagree that he shouldn’t have been a major part of the rotation the entire season. I see zero justification for d’antoni not playing a guy who was possibly your best player and certainly your best guard. Not to mention your first or second best 3-point shooter when you want to feature that part of your offense. I think his learning curve would have been that much higher had he been playing and I think that d’antoini wouldn’t have wasted an asset all year and featured absolutely horrible guard play.

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3/16/2010  12:23 PM
Marv wrote:Martin, I went to the garden on November 9th for the utah game. Toney Douglas got 23 minutes of PT, shot 9-14, including 3-7 3’s. he had 21 points, 2 boards, an assist and 2 steals.

I went back 2 nights later for the game against Atlanta. He got 36 minutes, scored 23 points on 10-19 including 2-6 3’s, had 4 boards and an assist.

In both games he was by far the most impactful player in a knick uniform. he was a beast on defense, threw his body on the floor for every loose ball, pushed the pace and was very aggressive on offense. His teammates were all visibly galvanized by his time on the floor. And the garden was up and buzzing at his play.

It was the middle of a 4 game span where d’antoni gave him an average of 26 minutes per game. He responded with 19 ppg on 55% shooting and 45% of 3’s (9-20).

This was immediately followed by diminished PT that included 25 – that’s right 25 – DNP’s.

I agree that he’s playing the point much better now than he was earlier in the season.

I totally disagree that he shouldn’t have been a major part of the rotation the entire season. I see zero justification for d’antoni not playing a guy who was possibly your best player and certainly your best guard. Not to mention your first or second best 3-point shooter when you want to feature that part of your offense. I think his learning curve would have been that much higher had he been playing and I think that d’antoini wouldn’t have wasted an asset all year and featured absolutely horrible guard play.

great post, marv. absolutely agree.

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martin
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3/16/2010  12:38 PM
crzymdups wrote:
Marv wrote:Martin, I went to the garden on November 9th for the utah game. Toney Douglas got 23 minutes of PT, shot 9-14, including 3-7 3’s. he had 21 points, 2 boards, an assist and 2 steals.

I went back 2 nights later for the game against Atlanta. He got 36 minutes, scored 23 points on 10-19 including 2-6 3’s, had 4 boards and an assist.

In both games he was by far the most impactful player in a knick uniform. he was a beast on defense, threw his body on the floor for every loose ball, pushed the pace and was very aggressive on offense. His teammates were all visibly galvanized by his time on the floor. And the garden was up and buzzing at his play.

It was the middle of a 4 game span where d’antoni gave him an average of 26 minutes per game. He responded with 19 ppg on 55% shooting and 45% of 3’s (9-20).

This was immediately followed by diminished PT that included 25 – that’s right 25 – DNP’s.

I agree that he’s playing the point much better now than he was earlier in the season.

I totally disagree that he shouldn’t have been a major part of the rotation the entire season. I see zero justification for d’antoni not playing a guy who was possibly your best player and certainly your best guard. Not to mention your first or second best 3-point shooter when you want to feature that part of your offense. I think his learning curve would have been that much higher had he been playing and I think that d’antoini wouldn’t have wasted an asset all year and featured absolutely horrible guard play.

great post, marv. absolutely agree.

yeah but marv is an old ****, so we never know if his memory served him correct.

I could also pick out stretches of games that Crawford and Harrington or Big Game looked like all-stars. Doesn't mean that they were doing their stats within the flow of what the offense was supposed to be or what the team was looking for.

I am not trying to put up an excuse for MDA, just forwarding what a guy who professionally offers his opinion to everyone said.

TD couldn't run a pick and roll with Lee at the beginning of the year. I think the way he runs it now is much improved. Like that.

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Marv
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3/16/2010  12:50 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/16/2010  12:51 PM
martin wrote:
yeah but marv is an old ****, so we never know if his memory served him correct.

I could also pick out stretches of games that Crawford and Harrington or Big Game looked like all-stars. Doesn't mean that they were doing their stats within the flow of what the offense was supposed to be or what the team was looking for.

I am not trying to put up an excuse for MDA, just forwarding what a guy who professionally offers his opinion to everyone said.

TD couldn't run a pick and roll with Lee at the beginning of the year. I think the way he runs it now is much improved. Like that.

martin - these were his 7th through 10th games as a pro - and he already had it. surely he could have been counted on to continue his growth while playing. and to continue to be the defensive leader of the team and a vast improvement over a backcourt of duhon, hughes and nate.

and yeah my memory was working - this wasn’t the portland game where we had so many pre-game shots i kept shouting for someone to **** up duckworth!

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3/16/2010  7:23 PM    LAST EDITED: 3/16/2010  7:24 PM
Marv wrote:Martin, I went to the garden on November 9th for the utah game. Toney Douglas got 23 minutes of PT, shot 9-14, including 3-7 3’s. he had 21 points, 2 boards, an assist and 2 steals.

I went back 2 nights later for the game against Atlanta. He got 36 minutes, scored 23 points on 10-19 including 2-6 3’s, had 4 boards and an assist.

In both games he was by far the most impactful player in a knick uniform. he was a beast on defense, threw his body on the floor for every loose ball, pushed the pace and was very aggressive on offense. His teammates were all visibly galvanized by his time on the floor. And the garden was up and buzzing at his play.

It was the middle of a 4 game span where d’antoni gave him an average of 26 minutes per game. He responded with 19 ppg on 55% shooting and 45% of 3’s (9-20).

This was immediately followed by diminished PT that included 25 – that’s right 25 – DNP’s.

I agree that he’s playing the point much better now than he was earlier in the season.

I totally disagree that he shouldn’t have been a major part of the rotation the entire season. I see zero justification for d’antoni not playing a guy who was possibly your best player and certainly your best guard. Not to mention your first or second best 3-point shooter when you want to feature that part of your offense. I think his learning curve would have been that much higher had he been playing and I think that d’antoini wouldn’t have wasted an asset all year and featured absolutely horrible guard play.

that's what i'm sayin... these cats are allergic to any criticisms thrown at our head coach... doesn't matter what he does, people have it set in their minds this guy has managed this rotation & roster correctly from jump... my eyes tell me different... when your team is sorely lacking in defense it makes sense to play your best defensive player regularly in the rotation... when you invest $4 million & a #8 lottery pick into drafting 2 kids we obviously believed in on draft night, it makes sense to play those kids especially when our expectations coming into this season should have been tempered by the lack of talent on this roster... people trying to justify throwing the season away by giving Chris Duhon & Jefferies 40+ a night even after we were completely out of the playoff hunt... didn't hear any objections to the "play the kids" plan at the beginning of the season, but i guess everyone has different points of view of how they wanted to see this team handled this season... i wanted the kids to get run, #1 priority coming into this season... in my eyes, that should have been the plan from the get go... took MDA long enough to realize it.

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martin
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3/16/2010  7:43 PM
TMS wrote:
Marv wrote:Martin, I went to the garden on November 9th for the utah game. Toney Douglas got 23 minutes of PT, shot 9-14, including 3-7 3’s. he had 21 points, 2 boards, an assist and 2 steals.

I went back 2 nights later for the game against Atlanta. He got 36 minutes, scored 23 points on 10-19 including 2-6 3’s, had 4 boards and an assist.

In both games he was by far the most impactful player in a knick uniform. he was a beast on defense, threw his body on the floor for every loose ball, pushed the pace and was very aggressive on offense. His teammates were all visibly galvanized by his time on the floor. And the garden was up and buzzing at his play.

It was the middle of a 4 game span where d’antoni gave him an average of 26 minutes per game. He responded with 19 ppg on 55% shooting and 45% of 3’s (9-20).

This was immediately followed by diminished PT that included 25 – that’s right 25 – DNP’s.

I agree that he’s playing the point much better now than he was earlier in the season.

I totally disagree that he shouldn’t have been a major part of the rotation the entire season. I see zero justification for d’antoni not playing a guy who was possibly your best player and certainly your best guard. Not to mention your first or second best 3-point shooter when you want to feature that part of your offense. I think his learning curve would have been that much higher had he been playing and I think that d’antoini wouldn’t have wasted an asset all year and featured absolutely horrible guard play.

that's what i'm sayin... these cats are allergic to any criticisms thrown at our head coach... doesn't matter what he does, people have it set in their minds this guy has managed this rotation & roster correctly from jump... my eyes tell me different... when your team is sorely lacking in defense it makes sense to play your best defensive player regularly in the rotation... when you invest $4 million & a #8 lottery pick into drafting 2 kids we obviously believed in on draft night, it makes sense to play those kids especially when our expectations coming into this season should have been tempered by the lack of talent on this roster... people trying to justify throwing the season away by giving Chris Duhon & Jefferies 40+ a night even after we were completely out of the playoff hunt... didn't hear any objections to the "play the kids" plan at the beginning of the season, but i guess everyone has different points of view of how they wanted to see this team handled this season... i wanted the kids to get run, #1 priority coming into this season... in my eyes, that should have been the plan from the get go... took MDA long enough to realize it.

I hope you don't lump me in with "these cats" who think that MDA has done everything perfectly. In fact, I don't think ANYONE would say that or has said that, so I don't know why you would think otherwise.

Doesn't mean I think Toney should have started the whole year either though. He just wasn't ready. Could he have benefited from starting the whole year? Perhaps.

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TMS
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USA
3/16/2010  7:49 PM
martin wrote:
TMS wrote:
Marv wrote:Martin, I went to the garden on November 9th for the utah game. Toney Douglas got 23 minutes of PT, shot 9-14, including 3-7 3’s. he had 21 points, 2 boards, an assist and 2 steals.

I went back 2 nights later for the game against Atlanta. He got 36 minutes, scored 23 points on 10-19 including 2-6 3’s, had 4 boards and an assist.

In both games he was by far the most impactful player in a knick uniform. he was a beast on defense, threw his body on the floor for every loose ball, pushed the pace and was very aggressive on offense. His teammates were all visibly galvanized by his time on the floor. And the garden was up and buzzing at his play.

It was the middle of a 4 game span where d’antoni gave him an average of 26 minutes per game. He responded with 19 ppg on 55% shooting and 45% of 3’s (9-20).

This was immediately followed by diminished PT that included 25 – that’s right 25 – DNP’s.

I agree that he’s playing the point much better now than he was earlier in the season.

I totally disagree that he shouldn’t have been a major part of the rotation the entire season. I see zero justification for d’antoni not playing a guy who was possibly your best player and certainly your best guard. Not to mention your first or second best 3-point shooter when you want to feature that part of your offense. I think his learning curve would have been that much higher had he been playing and I think that d’antoini wouldn’t have wasted an asset all year and featured absolutely horrible guard play.

that's what i'm sayin... these cats are allergic to any criticisms thrown at our head coach... doesn't matter what he does, people have it set in their minds this guy has managed this rotation & roster correctly from jump... my eyes tell me different... when your team is sorely lacking in defense it makes sense to play your best defensive player regularly in the rotation... when you invest $4 million & a #8 lottery pick into drafting 2 kids we obviously believed in on draft night, it makes sense to play those kids especially when our expectations coming into this season should have been tempered by the lack of talent on this roster... people trying to justify throwing the season away by giving Chris Duhon & Jefferies 40+ a night even after we were completely out of the playoff hunt... didn't hear any objections to the "play the kids" plan at the beginning of the season, but i guess everyone has different points of view of how they wanted to see this team handled this season... i wanted the kids to get run, #1 priority coming into this season... in my eyes, that should have been the plan from the get go... took MDA long enough to realize it.

I hope you don't lump me in with "these cats" who think that MDA has done everything perfectly. In fact, I don't think ANYONE would say that or has said that, so I don't know why you would think otherwise.

Doesn't mean I think Toney should have started the whole year either though. He just wasn't ready. Could he have benefited from starting the whole year? Perhaps.

when u post an article contradicting my "he should have been playing all year" mantra, it leads me to believe you disagree w/me... i said this before the season even began, i wanted to see our young kids getting regular minutes in the rotation... at absolute best w/the veterans playing i didn't see any more than 35 wins... when u pretty much know ur team won't be contending for playoffs this season u naturally want to see your rookies getting playing time... to me, developing the youth should take #1 priority on a rebuilding team.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
sidsanders
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3/16/2010  7:53 PM
it would have been nice for him to get in more meaningful minutes earlier in the season. that doesnt have to imply starts, just coming off the bench in non-garbage time.
GO TEAM VENTURE!!!!!
Put TD & Walker into the starting rotation for the rest of the season

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