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It is amazing how good the team looks with a PG that is not afraid to drive to the hole
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Infamous
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2/21/2010  7:59 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/21/2010  8:01 PM
TMS wrote:i dunno but Sergio did not wow me at all last nite... dunno what game y'all was watching... he was OK, but we still lost the game if u guys didn't notice & he wasn't on the floor in crunchtime, it was Eddie House... i dunno how anyone can already say this guy is so much better than Duhon based off 1 game we lost in OT... i have no doubt he's a better penetrator than Duhon & he's more active on the floor, but i still have yet to see him orchestrating the offense any better than Duhon & i don't see this tremendous "floor vision" that u have guys railing about on the game thread either... it's only 1 game so u can't judge much at all but y'all are jumping the gun just a tad on this one.

LOL...sergio is better than duhon in every aspect of the game...while duhon is busy walking the ball up the court desperate for a lee pick and roll only to pass it right back to lee, sergio pushes the ball up, penetrates and kicks it out to the open player...hes miles better than duhon...players missed open shots otherwise sergio wouldve have 12 assists.

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TMS
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2/21/2010  8:02 PM    LAST EDITED: 2/21/2010  8:02 PM
i dunno, i haven't seen many POR & SAC games so i guess i'll take ur word for it on this one, cuz i didn't see much of what you're talking about last night other than him running the ball up court.
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BigSm00th
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2/21/2010  8:03 PM
TheGame wrote:Don't get me wrong. Sergio is a backup pg until he learns how to shoot better, but this kid with one half day of practice managed to run our offense better than Duhon has all year. It is amazing how good this team looks with a competent pg. If MDA is not starting Sergio by the end of this week, then we should send him packing along with Duhon.

great point. makes the passing of jennings and ty lawson for jordan hill even more devastating. steve nash, a very good pg, won back to back MVPs with the keys to d'antoni's offense. why can't walsh get this?

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TMS
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2/21/2010  8:06 PM
BigSm00th wrote:
TheGame wrote:Don't get me wrong. Sergio is a backup pg until he learns how to shoot better, but this kid with one half day of practice managed to run our offense better than Duhon has all year. It is amazing how good this team looks with a competent pg. If MDA is not starting Sergio by the end of this week, then we should send him packing along with Duhon.

great point. makes the passing of jennings and ty lawson for jordan hill even more devastating. steve nash, a very good pg, won back to back MVPs with the keys to d'antoni's offense. why can't walsh get this?

Amare also played a key role in MDA's offense... from his comments on draft night MDA said Jordan Hill reminded him alot of Amare... that was probably the reasoning behind the selection... not trying to justify it over taking Jennings, but Jennings does not exactly fit the Steve Nash mold.

besides, u know MDA would have had Duhon playing minutes over Jennings this whole time anyways.

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2/21/2010  8:13 PM
TMS wrote:
BigSm00th wrote:
TheGame wrote:Don't get me wrong. Sergio is a backup pg until he learns how to shoot better, but this kid with one half day of practice managed to run our offense better than Duhon has all year. It is amazing how good this team looks with a competent pg. If MDA is not starting Sergio by the end of this week, then we should send him packing along with Duhon.

great point. makes the passing of jennings and ty lawson for jordan hill even more devastating. steve nash, a very good pg, won back to back MVPs with the keys to d'antoni's offense. why can't walsh get this?

Amare also played a key role in MDA's offense... from his comments on draft night MDA said Jordan Hill reminded him alot of Amare... that was probably the reasoning behind the selection... not trying to justify it over taking Jennings, but Jennings does not exactly fit the Steve Nash mold.

besides, u know MDA would have had Duhon playing minutes over Jennings this whole time anyways.

I like the J Hill selection. So I may have major egg on my face. He and JJ2 didn't get into the Pacers game last night. It will be interesting to see how Alderman uses him going forward.

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2/21/2010  8:27 PM
NYY1NYK2 wrote:OK, so maybe we only saw one game, but from this one game take this into consideration
1.He had maybe half a prectice (reports say he got in at 7am.
2. He runs the ball up the floor
3. he had some nice behind the back passes
4. Can get to the basket if he wants

And he would have had few more assists if Al did not blow a point blank shot and a couple of wide open 3's.

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2/21/2010  8:30 PM
TMS wrote:
NYY1NYK2 wrote:OK, so maybe we only saw one game, but from this one game take this into consideration
1.He had maybe half a prectice (reports say he got in at 7am.
2. He runs the ball up the floor
3. he had some nice behind the back passes
4. Can get to the basket if he wants

the fact that Eddie House looked so comfortable last night & T-Mac was so effective in the 1st half was what surprised me last night... given House has played in MDA's system before but he hasn't played w/any of the Knick players until last night & he fit in like a glove... T-Mac looked very good considering his length of inactivity but got winded in the 2nd half, which was to be expected... i didn't see anything special out of Sergio Valente... i wish i could say i did but i don't sip the Kool Aid simply for the sake of doing so... i'm just telling u what i saw out there last night... i hope Sergio CAN be the answer for us longterm, trust me... it would help to ease the anxiety i have over this whole T-Mac trade.

just to address some of ur points:

1. see above comment
2. i already noted this as a positive in my previous comment
3. he made 1 behind the back pass which wasn't really necessary... all flash & no substance is not what i'm looking for out of my PG, i want to see someone who can orchestrate effectively & take charge when the rest of the offense starts to flounder... i didn't see that from Sergio last night
4. he penetrated to the hole a couple times that i saw... he didn't make much of an impact w/his penetration last night... not saying he can't do this, i'm sure he can, but the comments i'm hearing based off last night's game aren't consistent w/what i was watching out there.

The team looked better with him running the point and this was his first game.

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2/21/2010  8:33 PM
Pharzeone wrote:
TMS wrote:
BigSm00th wrote:
TheGame wrote:Don't get me wrong. Sergio is a backup pg until he learns how to shoot better, but this kid with one half day of practice managed to run our offense better than Duhon has all year. It is amazing how good this team looks with a competent pg. If MDA is not starting Sergio by the end of this week, then we should send him packing along with Duhon.

great point. makes the passing of jennings and ty lawson for jordan hill even more devastating. steve nash, a very good pg, won back to back MVPs with the keys to d'antoni's offense. why can't walsh get this?

Amare also played a key role in MDA's offense... from his comments on draft night MDA said Jordan Hill reminded him alot of Amare... that was probably the reasoning behind the selection... not trying to justify it over taking Jennings, but Jennings does not exactly fit the Steve Nash mold.

besides, u know MDA would have had Duhon playing minutes over Jennings this whole time anyways.

I like the J Hill selection. So I may have major egg on my face. He and JJ2 didn't get into the Pacers game last night. It will be interesting to see how Alderman uses him going forward.


He will be patient with him. They gave up Landry, have to pay Scola. So they would want Hill ready next year.
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2/21/2010  9:53 PM
WindsorPl wrote:
TMS wrote:
NYY1NYK2 wrote:OK, so maybe we only saw one game, but from this one game take this into consideration
1.He had maybe half a prectice (reports say he got in at 7am.
2. He runs the ball up the floor
3. he had some nice behind the back passes
4. Can get to the basket if he wants

the fact that Eddie House looked so comfortable last night & T-Mac was so effective in the 1st half was what surprised me last night... given House has played in MDA's system before but he hasn't played w/any of the Knick players until last night & he fit in like a glove... T-Mac looked very good considering his length of inactivity but got winded in the 2nd half, which was to be expected... i didn't see anything special out of Sergio Valente... i wish i could say i did but i don't sip the Kool Aid simply for the sake of doing so... i'm just telling u what i saw out there last night... i hope Sergio CAN be the answer for us longterm, trust me... it would help to ease the anxiety i have over this whole T-Mac trade.

just to address some of ur points:

1. see above comment
2. i already noted this as a positive in my previous comment
3. he made 1 behind the back pass which wasn't really necessary... all flash & no substance is not what i'm looking for out of my PG, i want to see someone who can orchestrate effectively & take charge when the rest of the offense starts to flounder... i didn't see that from Sergio last night
4. he penetrated to the hole a couple times that i saw... he didn't make much of an impact w/his penetration last night... not saying he can't do this, i'm sure he can, but the comments i'm hearing based off last night's game aren't consistent w/what i was watching out there.

The team looked better with him running the point and this was his first game.

i didn't notice him making much of an impact... i think the team looked better last night because of the play of T-Mac early on & Eddie House made a big impact down the stretch... guys were sharing the ball but didn't quite notice Sergio being the cause of this... maybe i saw something different but he didn't really seem to me like he was leading the offense... i thought T-Mac was making better passes last night than Sergio to be honest... that one pass he made in transition to Al Harrington running the break was a thing of beauty.

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Cosmic
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2/21/2010  11:01 PM
TMS wrote:
Cosmic wrote:
TMS wrote:i dunno but Sergio did not wow me at all last nite... dunno what game y'all was watching... he was OK, but we still lost the game if u guys didn't notice & he wasn't on the floor in crunchtime, it was Eddie House... i dunno how anyone can already say this guy is so much better than Duhon based off 1 game we lost in OT... i have no doubt he's a better penetrator than Duhon & he's more active on the floor, but i still have yet to see him orchestrating the offense any better than Duhon & i don't see this tremendous "floor vision" that u have guys railing about on the game thread either... it's only 1 game so u can't judge much at all but y'all are jumping the gun just a tad on this one.

He's a much better passer than Duhon. He has much better vision than Duhon. He shoots about as pathetic as Duhon though.

But, given out situation, he should be our starting PG with Douglas backing him up and Duhon should just be sent home.

again with these proclamations based off 1 game... where is this amazing court vision being displayed last night? i didn't see it... & i'm not saying this just to piss on the T-Mac trade, i just didn't see anything special out of Sergio last night other than him being very active on the court... he made a nice hustle play & stole a rebound away from 1 of OKC's bigs coming from the blindside like Ward used to do on a regular basis... that was nice to see... he ran the ball upcourt instead of walking it upcourt like Duhon does, which was also nice to see... i didn't see any amazing passing or court vision skills on display however... not saying he doesn't have those things, but judging from last night's game i don't see how anyone can equivocably say he's all that.


Sergio and even House did things with the ball that I've never seen Duhon do not once. They push and they have a wide range of vision.

I'm not saying we've found our PGs of the future or anything like that all I am saying is after even just one game these two guys showed just how mediocre Duhon is.

Nothing more...and nothing we didn't already know...but damn after watching it Duhon is far worse than I even thought he was. And I wasn't exactly a fan to begin with.

In fact, TMac, House, Sergio showed us JUST how mediocre Chandler, Gallo, Duhon, Harrington really are.

But, well, it's what we've been dealing with over far too long. A mediocre roster so bad that when you see even a halfway capable player take the court you're in AWE of his skills.

Just more evidence that Walsh is right to tear the mess down.

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Cosmic
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2/21/2010  11:02 PM
TMS wrote:it's too bad i stopped toking up after college, that sheit don't agree w/me broham... i prefer the snortin' lines with some horny chick & bangin' the crap outta her til we both pass out vibe.

I'd fumble for loose change....

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TMS
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2/21/2010  11:15 PM
Cosmic wrote:
TMS wrote:
Cosmic wrote:
TMS wrote:i dunno but Sergio did not wow me at all last nite... dunno what game y'all was watching... he was OK, but we still lost the game if u guys didn't notice & he wasn't on the floor in crunchtime, it was Eddie House... i dunno how anyone can already say this guy is so much better than Duhon based off 1 game we lost in OT... i have no doubt he's a better penetrator than Duhon & he's more active on the floor, but i still have yet to see him orchestrating the offense any better than Duhon & i don't see this tremendous "floor vision" that u have guys railing about on the game thread either... it's only 1 game so u can't judge much at all but y'all are jumping the gun just a tad on this one.

He's a much better passer than Duhon. He has much better vision than Duhon. He shoots about as pathetic as Duhon though.

But, given out situation, he should be our starting PG with Douglas backing him up and Duhon should just be sent home.

again with these proclamations based off 1 game... where is this amazing court vision being displayed last night? i didn't see it... & i'm not saying this just to piss on the T-Mac trade, i just didn't see anything special out of Sergio last night other than him being very active on the court... he made a nice hustle play & stole a rebound away from 1 of OKC's bigs coming from the blindside like Ward used to do on a regular basis... that was nice to see... he ran the ball upcourt instead of walking it upcourt like Duhon does, which was also nice to see... i didn't see any amazing passing or court vision skills on display however... not saying he doesn't have those things, but judging from last night's game i don't see how anyone can equivocably say he's all that.


Sergio and even House did things with the ball that I've never seen Duhon do not once. They push and they have a wide range of vision.

I'm not saying we've found our PGs of the future or anything like that all I am saying is after even just one game these two guys showed just how mediocre Duhon is.

Nothing more...and nothing we didn't already know...but damn after watching it Duhon is far worse than I even thought he was. And I wasn't exactly a fan to begin with.

In fact, TMac, House, Sergio showed us JUST how mediocre Chandler, Gallo, Duhon, Harrington really are.

But, well, it's what we've been dealing with over far too long. A mediocre roster so bad that when you see even a halfway capable player take the court you're in AWE of his skills.

Just more evidence that Walsh is right to tear the mess down.

i'm gonna be fair to Duhon & remind u that when he was playing well, we were playing our best ball of the season... i don't think anyone can fairly say otherwise... he obviously wasn't playing great most of the season but judging from last night's game i'm just not ready to annoint Sergio as being any better than Duhon... he'll have to show me a lot more than what he showed me & help this team win games before i can say for sure... i like the fact that he's active & pushes the ball upcourt, but there wasn't much more i saw out of him last night that made me think he could be our longterm answer at the PG position or make him stand out so much over Chris Duhon... just MHO.

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Cosmic
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2/21/2010  11:20 PM
TMS wrote:

i'm gonna be fair to Duhon & remind u that when he was playing well, we were playing our best ball of the season... i don't think anyone can fairly say otherwise... he obviously wasn't playing great most of the season but judging from last night's game i'm just not ready to annoint Sergio as being any better than Duhon... he'll have to show me a lot more than what he showed me & help this team win games before i can say for sure... i like the fact that he's active & pushes the ball upcourt, but there wasn't much more i saw out of him last night that made me think he could be our longterm answer at the PG position or make him stand out so much over Chris Duhon... just MHO.

Yet wasn't that last year when Duhon played out of his mind? As to this year's "win streak" it came at the weakest point of the schedule, in fact one so weak that it was impossible not to play well for a stretch (and we're paying for it now as we head down the stretch into the teeth of an impossible schedule).

Hey, Duhon isn't a bad guy or anything he's just limited. And as we have seen with this bad team over the years we've tasked limited players to be heroes and in doing so they REALLY SUCK.

Yet we have no other options so they get pushed into that role and when they suck, know what? I'm going to point out that they suck. It's what I do.

Duhon would probably be a nice backup for a good team. He's not a starting PG though. Only here he is because we had no other options.

Yet, out of the blue, we now do. Sergio should start and Douglas should get his bumps and bruises in. Duhon should get the "flu like symptoms" and sit out the rest of the year.

He won't but he should.

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TMS
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2/21/2010  11:33 PM
Duhon did have a small stretch of games this year where he put up some respectable numbers during that run in December... i think that was discussed plenty of times this season that when Duhon plays well, the Knicks play well... dude had a 25 & 10, 22 & 9, & a 17 & 10 game in DEC, all of which the Knicks won... so i'm not gonna get overly excited over a new guy that goes 5 & 6 in a game we lose & assume he's so much better than Chris Duhon.
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2/22/2010  12:17 AM
AnubisADL wrote:Are dudes really trying to hype Sergio? The guy is average at best.

The guy cant shoot and misses layups just as badly as Jefferies.

No one misses lay up as bad as jeffries, he's 6'11 for crying out out, the rim is right there

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2/22/2010  1:56 AM
Duhon is a vet with far more experience but aside from that he has settled in as a below avg PG. He had some really good stretches. In terms of raw ability there are things Sergio already does that are superior to Duhon. The excitement comes from the fact that he's younger and has a chance to improve from where he is now. He has a shot to stick and I think MDA has more to work with in Sergio.

Another thing about stats, we learned from Steph that there are assists and then there are assists. How Steph got his and how Kidd or Nash got theirs are completely different things. Duhon had some good assist games but how he got them is the question. I believe Sergio can provide a better grade of assists if you catch my drift. I think they will be more fluid and that he will spread the assists around more thus keeping the defense off balance and our offense less prdictable.

Infamous
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2/22/2010  2:18 AM
TMS wrote:Duhon did have a small stretch of games this year where he put up some respectable numbers during that run in December... i think that was discussed plenty of times this season that when Duhon plays well, the Knicks play well... dude had a 25 & 10, 22 & 9, & a 17 & 10 game in DEC, all of which the Knicks won... so i'm not gonna get overly excited over a new guy that goes 5 & 6 in a game we lose & assume he's so much better than Chris Duhon.

yet the knicks have had stretches of 1-9 and 3-12 with duhon. the guy is garbage. he should be in the d-league at this point. he cant shoot and he cant create, what can he do? if u give almost ANY player that many minutes on a consistent basis theyre bound to have 4-5 good game out of 50. Sergio > Duhon.

It is amazing how good the team looks with a PG that is not afraid to drive to the hole

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