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David Lee vs Amare Stoudemire: Who's better


Author Poll
technomaster
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Looking at their relative performance for the past two seasons, who's the better player - Lee or Stoudemire? Lee seems to be the better all-around player to me - certainly he's a better passer. His jump shooting has evolved to a whole nother level this year (I almost expect them to be announcing Ewing's name). In spite of taking a ton of jumpers, his FG% remains 55%+. I'd argue that David Lee runs the floor just as well as Stoudemire.

Amare's game may have plateaued. He's never averaged double figure rebounds over the course of a season (though admittedly he's come quite close).

I don't think either player plays particularly note-worthy defense.

David Lee - Mr. Consistent
Amare Stoudemire
Too close to call
Don't care, don't want either
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Author Thread
technomaster
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12/22/2009  10:00 PM
TMS - completely agree with you. David Lee needs to be paired with a shot blocker ideally. Given his quickness level, I think Lee would actually be less effective if he were matched up against PFs. D'Antoni is using Jared Jeffries as a poor man's Camby - wouldn't it be great if Jeffries were capable of 5+ rpg? :)

Could Jordan Hill eventually evolve into a Camby-like player? I have my doubts - I don't think he moves well going east-west. He could be the shot blocker we're looking for, though.

“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
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orangeblobman
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Nauru
12/22/2009  10:58 PM
David Lee because he brings the consistency and the mental fortitude to give it his all all the time. With Amare, he is too emotional.

Give Lee a blocker behind him and watch him become a perennial all-star. It's not out of reach to say that we might be talking about giving David Lee a max contract some day.

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
Panos
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12/22/2009  11:01 PM
technomaster wrote:TMS - completely agree with you. David Lee needs to be paired with a shot blocker ideally. Given his quickness level, I think Lee would actually be less effective if he were matched up against PFs. D'Antoni is using Jared Jeffries as a poor man's Camby - wouldn't it be great if Jeffries were capable of 5+ rpg? :)

Could Jordan Hill eventually evolve into a Camby-like player? I have my doubts - I don't think he moves well going east-west. He could be the shot blocker we're looking for, though.

East-west? from seventh towards eighth?

Panos
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12/22/2009  11:07 PM
David tonight:
8-13 18pts, 21 rbs, 5 assists
nyk4ever
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12/22/2009  11:11 PM
You know, I'm trying to not be too reactionary, but you really can not argue with the type of basketball that David Lee is playing right now. He has seriously stepped his game up a different level the last 10-11 games and he has to be a part of the future of this team. I'm trying to honestly gauge what type of team we could be if we signed LeBron, slotted him at SG/SF and moved David to PF and got a guy who will compliment David's offensive game with defense. Someone like Tyson Chandler would be nice, any guy in that mold - Okafor works too. I think we'd be a damn good team like that.

With all that being said, I think Lee HAS to be kept.

"OMG - did we just go on a two-trade-wining-streak?" -SupremeCommander
TMS
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12/22/2009  11:12 PM
technomaster wrote:TMS - completely agree with you. David Lee needs to be paired with a shot blocker ideally. Given his quickness level, I think Lee would actually be less effective if he were matched up against PFs. D'Antoni is using Jared Jeffries as a poor man's Camby - wouldn't it be great if Jeffries were capable of 5+ rpg? :)

Could Jordan Hill eventually evolve into a Camby-like player? I have my doubts - I don't think he moves well going east-west. He could be the shot blocker we're looking for, though.

just judging from what i've seen of him, i don't think Jordan Hill will ever be the shotblocker that Camby is (Camby is pretty elite), but he will be able to give us a shotblocking presence nonetheless... i think he's got the potential to be as good a rebounder tho, he goes after loose balls very hard & definitely has the athleticism & vertical leap to grab boards over other bigs... i think the kid's already got a more developed offensive skillset than Camby's ever had tho... he's already got a midrange J, right handed hook shot & turn around fadeaway that he can knock down w/regularity.

i think he just needs to work on his foot positioning in the post & needs to build up his strength a little more, but we already saw him do pretty well guarding Andrew Bynum in a limited run of minutes so i think his defensive ability is definitely there... right now he's not all that quick moving laterally but i don't know of many bigmen that are to tell u the truth... he's definitely a better defender than any of the bigmen we have w/the exception of Fishlips, & in the low post i think he's a lot stronger than Fishlips already & can hold his ground when guys are trying to back him down... Gallo might be a better on ball defender than Hill is now but Hill is a lot stronger in the lane & more of an intimidating presence for penetrators... Gallo gets some nice blocks too but i think Hill will be more of an intimidator if u know what i'm saying.

After 7 years & 40K+ posts, banned by martin for calling Nalod a 'moron'. Awesome.
Sangfroid
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12/23/2009  7:32 AM
After Jeffries is traded, we'll see the emrgence of Hill as his replacement. David Lee will hopefully continue the development of his outside jumper(maybe use the glass more) and become a better asset then Amare, whose physical skills will continue to erode. From what i'm seeing, it makes more sense to give the dollar to Lee instead of caving to the whiner Amare.
"We are playing a game. We are playing at not playing a game..."
arkrud
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12/23/2009  9:44 AM    LAST EDITED: 12/23/2009  9:45 AM
It is already amaizing that this 2 are a legit material to be compared.
Lee was nothing close to Amare and now he is. This is quite an accomplishment by itself.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy." Hamlet
jusnice
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12/23/2009  10:12 AM
Not a good comparison because one player is on the way out and one player is on the way up. When it is all said and done, Lee may be a better offensive player. His game last night was awesome - jumper working, rebound grabbing, assist passing, really nice all around game. He is stepping up as my # 1 Center in Fantasy as well.
MS
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12/23/2009  10:20 AM
I still think it was a mistake not to offer Lee a 4-year 32 million deal. Locking in a player of his caliber for that would have been a very smart move. Especially since max free agents were looking at 9-10 million more to produce similiar stats. The Knicks could also sign a guy like Jordan Farmar who is a pick and roll pg that is accurate from three.

The Knicks don't really need a shot blocker if you ask me. If they get Lebron and pair him with chandler and gallo in the starting lineup you're getting 4-5blks nightly for other positions, maybe more.

Lebron would be a fool to stay with Cleveland. Hickson is the only player on the roster that is really going to improve. Unless they package Big Z I just don't see how they have more talent then the knicks. Gallo and Chandler are emerging every game and with an offseason of practice you're looking at fringe all-stars imo. Lee is only going to improve as well. As we have seen, post moves, shooting, free throws, passing, etc. Plus he is a good guy that get's it.

How many teams have a traditional center in this league. Howard, Bynum, Lopez, Kaman, Camby, Yao, Shaq, Perkins. The knicks can more than get by with Lee. Say no to Amare and Bosh.

DurzoBlint
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12/23/2009  10:49 AM
all one has to consider when answering is who each guy plays with. Lee has been putting up comparable numbers with DUHON as his point guard. If Lee played with Nash I'll go on the line and say Lee would look like the superior player.

He's already (always has been) the better rebounder and offensively has more tools than Amare has. Lee may arguable be more athletic than Amare thought not as strong.

Right now, if dollars were even I would want the guy who brings it everyday and does it was a mediocre guard

the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt
DurzoBlint
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12/23/2009  10:50 AM
also don't understand why/how people say his stats are inflated by player for D'Anphoney. Look at his stats year by year and you see from his growth curve that he is right where he should be.
the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt
djsunyc
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12/23/2009  10:51 AM
not for nothing, but if amare asks for the max, what will prevent lee from asking $12-13 mil a year?
DurzoBlint
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12/23/2009  11:02 AM
can't say with the way he's been playing that he's not worth it. But, I expect him to wait as he has said he would - till mike has his prized 2010 free agent wrapped up before deciding what he will ask for. The opportunity to play alongside LB, Wade, or my personal hope CP3 might just trump the high payday in his mind.
the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt
GodSaveTheKnicks
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12/23/2009  11:05 AM
If Toronto hadn't just extended him to a massive contract (who were they competing with on that btw? weird isiah-like one-upping himself move) I think Bargnani would actually fit well with DLee.

Bargnani likes to play outside and has a smooth J. DLee earns his keep inside and his J is a work in progress.

Need the answer man on this.

Q. Do the Knicks and MDA need a traditional center?

There are a decent amount of young bigs in the league: Lopez, Perkins, Hibbert, Haywood, Hawes, Oden,

Let's try to elevate the level of discourse in this byeetch. Please
DurzoBlint
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12/23/2009  11:11 AM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:If Toronto hadn't just extended him to a massive contract (who were they competing with on that btw? weird isiah-like one-upping himself move) I think Bargnani would actually fit well with DLee.

Bargnani likes to play outside and has a smooth J. DLee earns his keep inside and his J is a work in progress.

Need the answer man on this.

Q. Do the Knicks and MDA need a traditional center?

There are a decent amount of young bigs in the league: Lopez, Perkins, Hibbert, Haywood, Hawes, Oden,


with Bargani next to Lee the defense would be so atrocious. Lee isn't as bad as advertised but isn't good either. And Bragnani seem ignorant to the very existence of the defensive end of the game.

I actually like and considered what he would be like in the blue and orange armor but he's has too much Mr Whipple in him.

the fact that you can't even have an unrelated thread without some tool here bringing him up make me think that rational minds are few and far between. Bunch of emotionally weak, angst riddled people. I mean, how many times can you argue the same shyt
djsunyc
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12/23/2009  11:13 AM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:If Toronto hadn't just extended him to a massive contract (who were they competing with on that btw? weird isiah-like one-upping himself move) I think Bargnani would actually fit well with DLee.

Bargnani likes to play outside and has a smooth J. DLee earns his keep inside and his J is a work in progress.

Need the answer man on this.

Q. Do the Knicks and MDA need a traditional center?

There are a decent amount of young bigs in the league: Lopez, Perkins, Hibbert, Haywood, Hawes, Oden,

many theories as to why re-sign bargs so early...

it is the going rate for centers if you look around the league. and secondly, you sign him up now so in the event chris bosh leaves, bargs agent may ask for another $2-3 mil/year. bargs can play in the post, and looks quite fluid when he does...the reason he doesn't do it more is b/c bosh plays down there.

technomaster
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12/23/2009  11:33 AM
GodSaveTheKnicks wrote:
DLee earns his keep inside and his J is a work in progress.

Without looking at any scientific breakdown - it seems like half of David Lee's shots this year have been from the perimeter. In spite of this, his FG% is still round where it has been for the past few years. His jump shot is significantly improved and consistent. If it stopped developing today, I think we should be satisfied.

“That was two, two from the heart.” - John Starks
fishmike
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12/23/2009  11:52 AM
djsunyc wrote:not for nothing, but if amare asks for the max, what will prevent lee from asking $12-13 mil a year?
I would offer him 6 years and $70mm the first minute you can. Thats a starting $9mm a salary. 6 years $75mm starts at $9.5mm and if you give him $10mm a year to start its 6 years and $78mm. He can opt out after 3 years for a bigger extension if he's a star. Hard to see that not getting done.
"winning is more fun... then fun is fun" -Thibs
orangeblobman
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Nauru
12/23/2009  11:52 AM
fishmike wrote:
djsunyc wrote:not for nothing, but if amare asks for the max, what will prevent lee from asking $12-13 mil a year?
I would offer him 6 years and $70mm the first minute you can. Thats a starting $9mm a salary. 6 years $75mm starts at $9.5mm and if you give him $10mm a year to start its 6 years and $78mm. He can opt out after 3 years for a bigger extension if he's a star. Hard to see that not getting done.

Bro, fishmike, BRO! David Lee is WORTH WHAT YOU'RE TELLING ME HERE. The guy is an all-star

WE AIN'T NOWHERE WITH THIS BUM CHOKER IN CARMELO. GIVE ME STARKS'S 2-21 ANY DAY OVER THIS LACKLUSTER CLUSTEREFF.
David Lee vs Amare Stoudemire: Who's better

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