Bosh might be in a similar situation. I don't watch nearly enough Raptors games to evaluate him. But for anyone who has - is Bosh's lagging progress right now a symptom of purely HIM or the situation he is in?

If he were on a team with a better supporting cast would he put in more effort? Or would his concentration still wander?

metra wrote:Evaluation of a good player on a bad team is tricky. Imagine if Randy Moss had always been on the Raiders. Who would recognize his talent?

Bosh might be in a similar situation. I don't watch nearly enough Raptors games to evaluate him. But for anyone who has - is Bosh's lagging progress right now a symptom of purely HIM or the situation he is in?

If he were on a team with a better supporting cast would he put in more effort? Or would his concentration still wander?

Basketball is a different game than football, which is much more of a team sport, at least in terms of one player's ability to control the play of a team.

Do we want a player who is brought down by the lesser players on his team, or one who inspires them and raises their level. I don't consider the talent level on Toronto to be terrible. If Bosh wants to be a premier player, he has to raise the level of play of the guys around him, not be brought down by them.

crzymdups wrote:i think Bosh would be fine as a second banana - in a pau gasol type role. if bosh is the number one option on your team, you aren't getting very far.

that said, i'd rather lebron and bosh than lebron and dlee.

exactly how i feel... i like D Lee but let's be realistic, Bosh is the guy more likely to appeal to someone like Lebron... he's easily as good as Pau Gasol if not better & definitely better than Zach Randolph... u may not think a player like that deserves max dollars, but he's gonna get it, trust... if a guy like Kevin Durant were available u guys telling me u wouldn't want him on our team either if u could sign him at max dollars? IMO Bosh is a better player than he is overall too... talented bigmen who put up numbers every year like he does & doesn't bring with him any negative baggage are not that easy to come by.

even if Lebron rejects us & Bosh ends up being the #1 for a year u still can target Melo in 2011 & make a run at a title for years to come... i can't believe people are actually being picky w/which max players we should target this season, we'd be lucky to get any 1 of the top guys much less 2.

TMS wrote:

crzymdups wrote:i think Bosh would be fine as a second banana - in a pau gasol type role. if bosh is the number one option on your team, you aren't getting very far.

that said, i'd rather lebron and bosh than lebron and dlee.

exactly how i feel... i like D Lee but let's be realistic, Bosh is the guy more likely to appeal to someone like Lebron... he's easily as good as Pau Gasol if not better & definitely better than Zach Randolph... u may not think a player like that deserves max dollars, but he's gonna get it, trust... if a guy like Kevin Durant were available u guys telling me u wouldn't want him on our team either if u could sign him at max dollars? IMO Bosh is a better player than he is overall too... talented bigmen who put up numbers every year like he does & doesn't bring with him any negative baggage are not that easy to come by.

even if Lebron rejects us & Bosh ends up being the #1 for a year u still can target Melo in 2011 & make a run at a title for years to come... i can't believe people are actually being picky w/which max players we should target this season, we'd be lucky to get any 1 of the top guys much less 2.

I agree, I think that is the perception out there. Even though Lee's improved, between he & Bosh, Bosh is the one that another FA would want to come play with. Yet another reason I think Bosh will be a Knick - he'd add to the draw...

And you're right, if LeBron never comes (still a big possibility - more of a possibility he stays where he is than bolting for NY -- as a reasonable fan, I'd have to concede that), Bosh AND Melo would make a really nice duo..No question..Maybe that's why you bring in Bosh first and then either see if Lee's interested in the leftover money to come back or you let Lee walk and keep that money open for the following year when it's Melo time..

djsunyc wrote:just curious, but how many times have you guys watched bosh play? like really watch him - know his tendencies, what he likes to do...how the offense runs...how he positions himself on defense or what's asked of him? probably takes a bit more than 3-5 games a year to get a good indication on a player, no?

i've only seen him in games we play... i'm sure you have more of a knowledge of his game than anyone else here... would like to hear ur take on this... should we be targetting Bosh this year or hold onto Lee & Al? what do u say dj?

knicks1248 wrote:

metra wrote:Evaluation of a good player on a bad team is tricky. Imagine if Randy Moss had always been on the Raiders. Who would recognize his talent?

Bosh might be in a similar situation. I don't watch nearly enough Raptors games to evaluate him. But for anyone who has - is Bosh's lagging progress right now a symptom of purely HIM or the situation he is in?

If he were on a team with a better supporting cast would he put in more effort? Or would his concentration still wander?

They have enough Talent on that Raptors roster for them to be the biggest dissappointment thus far in the season.

there's a whole host of reasons why the raptors are at 11-15 right now. but if you think the reasons are actually valid ones, then 11-15 actually doesn't sound that bad at this point of the season for them. i'm not going to go into them right now but there is a long way to go in the season and only time will tell if they are what their record says they are...

he's definitely closer to ewing offensively, but still not there, and he will never be the defensive player ewing was.

he's about 70% of Ewing I think..maybe 75%